[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

I know exactly your type.

Lol you don’t know that either. You are making internet judgement because I can support a technology discussion on what A potential future Camaro might be without an ICE and you can’t (it’s ok that you can’t, I actually understand your side of the discussion)

You may have missed my history on this site and how deeply ingrained I have been in Corvette and Camaro throughout my career. Kind of had dream jobs car nuts would love to have. Been there done that. Did GMs first carbon fiber panels, GMs first aluminum body structure. Ever think of converting an SMC part to Carbon Fiber because you could use the same tool and only have piece cost to consider in order to save 5 pounds per car? I did. Yeah, lol you know my type.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Lol you don’t know that either. You are making internet judgement because I can support a technology discussion on what A potential future Camaro might be without an ICE and you can’t (it’s ok that you can’t, I actually understand your side of the discussion)

You may have missed my history on this site and how deeply ingrained I have been in Corvette and Camaro throughout my career. Kind of had dream jobs car nuts would love to have. Been there done that. Did GMs first carbon fiber panels, GMs first aluminum body structure. Ever think of converting an SMC part to Carbon Fiber because you could use the same tool and only have piece cost to consider in order to save 5 pounds per car? I did. Yeah, lol you know my type.

FWIW, I value the information you share in your posts and you have definitely been a voice of reason in this controversial thread. I too have been a long time Camaro and Corvette owner/enthusiast and I am just trying to share some of my experience now that I have owned a Tesla performance EV now. Some folks will be open minded and others just think all EVs are just boring appliances.

I totally get the knee-jerk reaction over an EV Camaro. I used to be the same way but after owning a Tesla for the past couple years and seeing the aftermarket develop and guys tracking them I enjoy both now. Watching Randy Pobst help tune the track mode on the Model 3 Performance and hearing his positive feedback on how the cars perform has been an endorsement as well.

Take a look at this company and how strong the aftermarket has become for Tesla. Lots of guys have started to track their Teslas. They are better suited to autocross right now since there are not a lot of Superchargers installed at the tracks yet but folks are having a lot of fun with them. Folks like the strong regen braking as it helps save on the brakes and the torque/exit speed out of the corners is ridiculously good.

https://unpluggedperformance.com/

Tesla has a great powertrain and the best battery technology so far but the chassis and suspension are just ok. This is where GM has an opportunity to take the great styling of the Camaro and other tech they have refined over the years and create a highly desirable sports coupe EV. I also wouldn't expect them to cost anymore than they do now. Better performance, lower operational cost may usher in the next generation of Camaro buyers.

[90503]

A couple of things...2025 is not that far off...GM has promised 30 EVs for sale by then. Two thirds, 20 or so will be sold in North America. So far we have only seen a handful, all pricey, low production, and years away from being available...The Bolt isn't even an Ultium platform, and certainly not at a low end of pricing for anything that would be a "EV for everyone" as we have been told will be the case...

If one of these for sale by 2025 EVs is going to be a Camaro, it should be announced in the not too distant future....one or two more years to at least have a reveal??? And a date should be announced for the ICE Camaro's end. I don't see GM producing both like Ford is doing with the Mustang...The ICE Camaro isn't selling that well to justify both. Actually calling the new EV a Camaro might hurt sales due to the unpopularity of the current one. Ford does not have this problem with the Mustang.

In the meantime I think GM should continue production of the ICE Camaro at least in the ZL1 and V-8 versions and give anyone who wants one a chance to get one before they are gone. And the more you all discuss this, the more I believe ICE Camaros will end much sooner than later. I really hope they do not call any new EV a Camaro. What would be the benefit? Revising the Corvair name would be more appropriate...."Hey, Buddy! What are you running under the floor-boards? An Ultium 8 pack or what? Got a full charge? Show me what she can do..." etc., etc,

[V8 Firebird]

It's basically same argument when Corvette went MR layout and Hummer returning as an EV, both old school fanbases didn't like that kind idea. Despite this, both models still do very successful in the market. No reason Gm not doing same thing for Camaro

[90503]

Originally Posted by V8 Firebird

It's basically same argument when Corvette went MR layout and Hummer returning as an EV, both old school fanbases didn't like that kind idea. Despite this, both models still do very successful in the market. No reason Gm not doing same thing for Camaro

Basically the same thing? Hardly. The Corvette was never in danger of being discontinued, or given an EV engine....The Hummer was out of production for 12 years. Hardly the same idea as unnecessarily ending ICE Camaros from being produced.

[Petrol Head]

The people with the letter that comes between c and e next to their name are forcing this on us and it really isn’t funny. If the general public lemmings who know nothing about cars want to plug their appliances in have at it. They don’t care what’s under the hood anyways.

But let the market and enthusiasts - or purists, or whatever you want to call me (I’m sure a few of you have other names and that’s fine, I don’t give a truck) dictate the product and keep 4 stroke, gasoline, pushrod V8 in production in the Camaro for people who want it. It’s not that hard.

I’ll even pay MORE for a V8 that gets 18 mpg and has a manual transmission if I have to.

You want people to keep buying g your product don’t you?

[Bhobbs]

No, GM doesn’t want enthusiasts to buy their cars. That’s why corporate GM does so little to embrace enthusiasm. GM put the bare minimum into the Camaro. GM recycled the ATS-V and CTS-V into the CT4/5-V Blackwing. GM is moving at a glacial pace to challenge the Raptor on the full size truck. If GM could drive off the brand enthusiasts without major backlash, they would have done so.

GM would rather spend its time fielding boring as hell products like the new Blazer. That’s the perfect representation of GM as a company. They take a classic name brand and slap it on a snooze fest vehicle like that. The one true outlier is the Corvette. That seems to be the only badge that’s managed to escape GM’s hatred of passion and enthusiasm.

Meanwhile, brands that care about their loyal enthusiasts are putting Hellcat V8s in everything they can or putting 35” tires on their reborn classic off-roader.

[90503]

Today's enthusiast wants to buy a smart-phone or a lap-top with a car attached to it.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by 90503

Basically the same thing? Hardly. The Corvette was never in danger of being discontinued, or given an EV engine....The Hummer was out of production for 12 years. Hardly the same idea as unnecessarily ending ICE Camaros from being produced.

C7 was cancelled at least 2 times and almost a 3rd during my time at GM. It went from being ME to being cancelled to being revived to being cancelled before the bankruptcy to being revived and then having to survive an attempt from the government’ts task force to cancel it. Fun times them were, I tell ya.

[90503]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

C7 was cancelled at least 2 times and almost a 3rd during my time at GM. It went from being ME to being cancelled to being revived to being cancelled before the bankruptcy to being revived and then having to survive an attempt from the government’ts task force to cancel it. Fun times them were, I tell ya.

I guess I should have specified canceled due to low sales numbers and for similar reasons that would cancel the current Camaro. If that was the case and there was an outcry from some old-school Corvette fan base, I stand corrected.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

C7 was cancelled at least 2 times and almost a 3rd during my time at GM. It went from being ME to being cancelled to being revived to being cancelled before the bankruptcy to being revived and then having to survive an attempt from the government’ts task force to cancel it. Fun times them were, I tell ya.

There’s that letter between c and e again

[90503]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

C7 was cancelled at least 2 times and almost a 3rd during my time at GM. It went from being ME to being cancelled to being revived to being cancelled before the bankruptcy to being revived and then having to survive an attempt from the government’ts task force to cancel it. Fun times them were, I tell ya.

I think 1983 was the only year a Corvette was not for sale. All other years you could buy a Corvette...a lot of corporate goings on for sure, but it was never truly cancelled as in out of production completely.

Here's an article you may enjoy....Good work.

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...twice-feature/

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by 90503

Today's enthusiast wants to buy a smart-phone or a lap-top with a car attached to it.

This is pretty accurate, which is why Tesla can’t build them fast enough. It will take more than just electrifying the vehicles, the software and user interface will be critical to the success. Most people that buy Tesla are drawn to the tech. They love the big screen with Netflix theater, streaming audio, google earth maps, live traffic. They like the sentry alarm system that records video from all 6 cameras if anyone approaches the car. Built in dash cam recording, with built in playback viewer. You press a button on the steering wheel and give it voice commands like like you would with Alexa or Siri, navigate home, or lower the temperature 3 degrees or open the glovebox, or play music by Fleetwood Mac.

Like you said, it is more of a computer than a car and the system is responsive and makes traditional infotainment systems feel archaic. Another game changer is over the air software updates. The idea that your car can continue to improve over its lifetime via software is revolutionary. I have seen two 5% power updates, Spotify streaming was added, NAV updates are constantly being updated, voice recognition, Netflix and Hulu, autopilot improvements, driving improvements like true one pedal driving where regen braking will bring the car to a complete stop and apply brake hold, even improvements to to rain sensing wipers algorithm, etc. and the fact that car is managed by an app on your phone. Little features have been added via software along the way like your windows will automatically close if you walk away from the car. You can enable climate protection in case a dog or child was left in the car the AC will keep the cabin cooled. From the app you can see exactly where the car is on a satellite map and how fast it is traveling, etc. The list goes on and on. My point is GM needs to build Camaro that looks great and drives great but in order for them to fully compete they need the software because that will be the differentiator moving forward.

[digitalfutur]

Some typical trends in this thread that I've seen in other forums about GM.

First, that because your opinion about what, how and which cars GM should care about differs from theirs, that GM is a [insert pejorative(s)] company. Fact: My or your individual opinion about GM does not matter. What matters is the end customers' collective opinion about GM. Fact: GM outsells Ford or Stellantis (FCA) in America, and is more profitable than either. If GM hadn't shifted most of its production to SUVs because that's where the market went, they'd be out of business.

Second, and related to the first, is that CEO Mary Barra is [insert misogynistic comment] because GM has decided not to compete tit-for-that with every performance vehicle Ford and FCA make, when presumably a male CEO (like Ford's and FCA's) would. Fact: Barra's compensation exceeds that of Ford's or FCA's CEOs, because she runs GM better than they run theirs.

Third, that if the Camaro isn't spec'd the way you think it should be, it just ain't a Camaro. So you'll just take your sabots and time-warp back to the good 'ol days when performance cars were performance cars, men were men, and women in the automotive world were useful only for sexist car ads. Fact: 6th gen Camaros, and this site, are about all its iterations, not just the one you prefer. So if the next Camaro is an EV, it'll be here, unless the mods decide otherwise.

In the end, facts with data will trump opinion. All car manufacturers, not just GM, see the trend over the long term...it's EV, not ICE. Not unlike the transition from horse-drawn carriages to ICE that took about 25 years at the turn of the 20th century.