[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Can'tHave2MuchHP

So is all of this back and forth bitching about not having an automatic transmission in the ZL1 1LE? For god's sake people, IF YOU CAN'T DRIVE STICK OR DON'T WANT TO DRIVE STICK THEN YOU AREN'T GETTING ONE. We cannot control Chevy's decision to put what transmission where. No sense in bitching now. A fast driver will get within a second of each other at most tracks no matter trans.

There's two crowds, those who drive stick and those who don't. What I unfortunately find is the auto guys are a bunch of justifiers and the stick guys love to rub the "more manly" option in the others' faces.

Chill out. Go put a coat of wax on your car or something.

I agree for the most part. I look at what a car comes with and if it has the things I want then I'll buy it. If not then I have no desire to get it. But voices need to be heard because GM needs to know that there are lots of people who will buy the car if they offered it with the A10. If nobody said anything then how would they know? This is something I think most manufacturers will have to start doing...offering the automatics in more of their cars. I think the cars will sell either way. But having it enticing to more people means more money for them. Plus the Z06 (and every Corvette trim level) is available in auto and manual trans. They can do the same with the ZL1. I get the heritage and history and all that. But we're talking customers and money and that holds more weight if you ask me.

[Can'tHave2MuchHP]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

I agree for the most part. I look at what a car comes with and if it has the things I want then I'll buy it. If not then I have no desire to get it. But voices need to be heard because GM needs to know that there are lots of people who will buy the car if they offered it with the A10. If nobody said anything then how would they know? This is something I think most manufacturers will have to start doing...offering the automatics in more of their cars. I think the cars will sell either way. But having it enticing to more people means more money for them. Plus the Z06 (and every Corvette trim level) is available in auto and manual trans. They can do the same with the ZL1. I get the heritage and history and all that. But we're talking customers and money and that holds more weight if you ask me.

I find the bold funny because the exact opposite is happening. If you take out the stick Mustangs, Camaros, Corvettes and Vipers, only a few M series and select Porsche models is available in stick these days. #SaveTheManual is a very real thing.

The only modern manual only cars I know of are the ZL1 1LE, Viper, and the GT350. The Viper is gone now too. What's left?

[pwells18]

Unless you are tracking the car....it is more enjoyable to row your own gears..
It's sad that you cannot buy a FERRARI with their old school gated shifter...
-to me..the buyers of these cars now(unless they are tracking them) are poseurs....THAT is my opinion, flame away...i don't understand for the life of me, other than an ailment or injury, why you would buy an auto in the ZL1-(again, unless you are tracking the car..and even then..im not convinced it's quicker)
ask yourself...why is PORSCHE starting to make manuals again in their 911's?
MMGA
make manuals great again!

[Stoner]

Originally Posted by S.T.A.R.

Why on earth does Ford Mustang offer a backseat?
Why would Chevy Camaro offer a backseat? Why!
Who are these people who actually sit back there?

one word INSURANCE

[TheShooter]

Originally Posted by pwells18

Unless you are tracking the car....it is more enjoyable to row your own gears..
It's sad that you cannot buy a FERRARI with their old school gated shifter...
-to me..the buyers of these cars now(unless they are tracking them) are poseurs....THAT is my opinion, flame away...i don't understand for the life of me, other than an ailment or injury, why you would buy an auto in the ZL1-(again, unless you are tracking the car..and even then..im not convinced it's quicker)
ask yourself...why is PORSCHE starting to make manuals again in their 911's?
MMGA
make manuals great again!

I'll try to explain it to you, because I saw the light before I had pain in my left foot.

I'm a huge fan of small nimble cars that handle. So obviously I always had a spot for old school Miata, MG, Austin Healy, STI, Evo X...

When the Evo X came around I really loved it. The manual was sharp and fun and I'm sure most know that it's a giant killer for handling. Back in NY we had a blast with it on twisty upstate roads. Then my buddy picked up the MR version with the SST auto and I drove that version on the very same roads.

With the auto I was suddenly tuned into the chassis completely. Losing the clutch petal was like losing my sight, but having my earring make a huge leap forward. And we drove FASTER, which also means we drove BETTER, which also means we drove SAFER.

And I could STILL shift whenever I wanted.

Now saying that people are posers unless they track is just silly. Come meet me next weekend at Angeles Crest and you'll see advanced drivers on that road and it's more than likely that you cannot match their skills. A LOT of people go there instead of a track and the same goes for the Snake.

Frankly, it really just diminished YOU by suggesting that someone is a poser for not using a car the way you want them to. Some folks drive, some tour, some collect and some like to do shows and cruises. You really shouldn't lower yourself by making a negative comment because you don't like how I might drive my toy. And yeah, "poser" is not a very nice thing to say at all.

I'm a sailor for near 30 years. And in the arena of performance boats I hear the same silly stuff, where some guy says if you don't use your yacht in this race or that regatta, then you're not a "real sailor."

This is really about having a inferiority complex and nothing more. You don't have to track a ZL1 1LE. If you have the cash and it makes you happy to cruise it once a month, I'm VERY thrilled for you. It's what you want and so long as it's not hurting anyone, be happy.

Cheers,

R (the "Poser)

[Can'tHave2MuchHP]

Come on, can we stop this SOAP OPERA of a thread already?

Originally Posted by TheShooter

I'll try to explain it to you, because I saw the light before I had pain in my left foot.

I'm a huge fan of small nimble cars that handle. So obviously I always had a spot for old school Miata, MG, Austin Healy, STI, Evo X...

When the Evo X came around I really loved it. The manual was sharp and fun and I'm sure most know that it's a giant killer for handling. Back in NY we had a blast with it on twisty upstate roads. Then my buddy picked up the MR version with the SST auto and I drove that version on the very same roads.

With the auto I was suddenly tuned into the chassis completely. Losing the clutch petal was like losing my sight, but having my earring make a huge leap forward. And we drove FASTER, which also means we drove BETTER, which also means we drove SAFER.

And I could STILL shift whenever I wanted.

Now saying that people are posers unless they track is just silly. Come meet me next weekend at Angeles Crest and you'll see advanced drivers on that road and it's more than likely that you cannot match their skills. A LOT of people go there instead of a track and the same goes for the Snake.

Frankly, it really just diminished YOU by suggesting that someone is a poser for not using a car the way you want them to. Some folks drive, some tour, some collect and some like to do shows and cruises. You really shouldn't lower yourself by making a negative comment because you don't like how I might drive my toy. And yeah, "poser" is not a very nice thing to say at all.

I'm a sailor for near 30 years. And in the arena of performance boats I hear the same silly stuff, where some guy says if you don't use your yacht in this race or that regatta, then you're not a "real sailor."

This is really about having a inferiority complex and nothing more. You don't have to track a ZL1 1LE. If you have the cash and it makes you happy to cruise it once a month, I'm VERY thrilled for you. It's what you want and so long as it's not hurting anyone, be happy.

Cheers,

R (the "Poser)

[Mr. Meh]

Originally Posted by TheShooter

LOL....I was talking to a buddy about my issue with transmissions. He has a smashed ankle and can't even drive stick anymore. He knows my foot hurts like hell. His response when I said I'd like a 1LE with the A10? "Man up, dude!"

Look, I'm a pro sailor. I can sail a 100 foot boat single handed. But somewhere there's a guy who can knit a beautiful sweater in 2 days. Who's more of a man? Answer: Neither!

As I get older and these autos get better, it's pretty awesome to have the option of a great car that can handle bad traffic without causing me physical pain. That's the bottom line and there's no sensible argument against it.

And for the record, CHEVY AGREES WITH ME. Now we'll see what my options are when I'm ready to make the move (after holidays), but I'm guessing I'll end up happy in the end.

PS: I did some hunting around and there's ZERO evidence that the A10 causes any kind of cooling problems vs. the M6. Frankly, we'd be hearing it big time by now, so that's just bad info.


R.

Yeah.. and.. ultimately.. This is all moot anyways.. ICE will be replaced by electric motor powered cars and you'll see the end of transmissions as we currently know them...

You think it's difficult to NLS an ICE car w/o computer assistance.. Try doing that in an all electric motor car with instant TQ application after the clutch reapplies.. You'd be so heavily hampered by the computer you may as well not even be involved in the process.

Even the eLSD can operate in 0.150 seconds or 150 milliseconds to a full engagement command. If it doesn't need a full engagement, it happens even quicker (per the HP Supplement).. I don't think non-techy people truly have an appreciation for that type of speed... and this is the 1st generation of this technology being applied to these cars.

The MagRide reads the road conditions 1000 times/sec, effectively 1ms intervals.

These operational times are only going to get faster and faster.. At some point, having a human between the pieces will do nothing but slow the system down.

[bpang1234]

A10? Agreed

ZL1 plus the Aero? Sure, it should be something they offer.

Back seat better? Sure but not a huge issue for me.

Steering wheel? If you're rich enough to be in Lamborghini territory you can afford another steering wheel, they are available.

[TheShooter]

The perfect car for my usage...

The Camaro ZL1 1LE-T (T for Touring).

ZL1 with A10
Includes
ZL1 magnetic ride suspension
1LE Aero Package
1LE Wheel/Tire package
Red 1LE Calipers

Now, I know I can create this car, but it will cost FAR more vs. being able to order it this way...or am I wrong? I think the aero alone will set me back nearly 5K, which is crazy.

I wonder what the other stuff would cost, though I know I can sell off the original spoiler and wheels/tires.

R.

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by TheShooter

The perfect car for my usage...

The Camaro ZL1 1LE-T (T for Touring).

ZL1 with A10
Includes
ZL1 magnetic ride suspension
1LE Aero Package
1LE Wheel/Tire package
Red 1LE Calipers

Now, I know I can create this car, but it will cost FAR more vs. being able to order it this way...or am I wrong? I think the aero alone will set me back nearly 5K, which is crazy.

I wonder what the other stuff would cost, though I know I can sell off the original spoiler and wheels/tires.

R.

So, all you really want is the canards and wing, along with the wheels and tires? The brake calipers are the same.

Seems to me, you could save a lot of hassle by buying ZL1 with the A10, throwing on the aero, wheel, tires and painting the calipers. There is no need for GM to undo all the work they did on the 1LE for you when the ZL1 already exists.


A touring 1LE makes absolutely no sense. It's like asking for a V6 option on the ZL1 or a clutch pedal option on the A10, because you like pushing a clutch but your wife can't drive stick.

[JB'sZL1]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

So, all you really want is the canards and wing, along with the wheels and tires? The brake calipers are the same.

Seems to me, you could save a lot of hassle by buying ZL1 with the A10, throwing on the aero, wheel, tires and painting the calipers. There is no need for GM to undo all the work they did on the 1LE for you when the ZL1 already exists.


A touring 1LE makes absolutely no sense. It's like asking for a V6 option on the ZL1 or a clutch pedal option on the A10, because you like pushing a clutch but your wife can't drive stick.

And once you place mag ride in the 1LE...it's no longer a 1LE.

[TheShooter]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

So, all you really want is the canards and wing, along with the wheels and tires? The brake calipers are the same.

Seems to me, you could save a lot of hassle by buying ZL1 with the A10, throwing on the aero, wheel, tires and painting the calipers. There is no need for GM to undo all the work they did on the 1LE for you when the ZL1 already exists.


A touring 1LE makes absolutely no sense. It's like asking for a V6 option on the ZL1 or a clutch pedal option on the A10, because you like pushing a clutch but your wife can't drive stick.

The 1LE package advantages are MAINLY the tires and aero. They contribute to the handling advantages more than the suspension does.

BUT...I'd happily accept the 1LE package with the A10 of course.

Anyway...others are right! This thread is done. Thanks for the many good views and answers. I'll post pics when I get it done and I think folks will like the outcome.


Cheers,


R.

[Artos]

Looking forward to the end project shooter...someone with more insight can answer, but I'm not certain how the mag ride will work with the 1LE suspension??

I'm sure you will enjoy your poser regardless...watch that heat soak

[GrimReaperSS]

OP: I understand your fustration. Its been a very long time since American cars could be ordered by checking off which options you want. Now its which options package do you want. There might be one thing you want but four others you didnt necessarily want. It does exist on mfg's such as Porsche, but as you can see, if you want to order whatever paint color you want, what ever interior color and trim options you want, what ever wheels/colors you want, you gotta pay big time for it. Porsche will even charge more to take things out! I believe GM doesnt offer this to its customers because they want to keep the price point down. As you saw with the 5th gen Z/28. People will go mad if I could build a Camaro for $90k. "Its just a crappy GM Camaro" they will say, even if it became the best performance vehicle in the world. Personally I wouldnt purchase an A10 equipped ZL1 1LE, but I understand your reasoning for sure. I dont see why it couldnt be available, this argument was run through the ringer on the Corvette forums too when the C7 Z06 was rumored to debuted with the A8. If enough people want it, they have a case to make it happen. They dont want to turn customers money away if theres enough demand. I do believe with both the ZL1 and ZL1 1LE that their suspensions, tire and aero develops were all designed with eachother in mind. Only placing 2/3 of the equation from the 1LE on the standard ZL1 with come with compromises and most likely will not provide the best overall handling. Will there be an upgrade/increase in handling by adding the wider/lighter/stickier wheels/tires and the larger chin spoiler, canards and rear wing, sure, just not as good as with the suspension in the equation as well. So long as youre cool with that.... The alcantera steering wheel is there for better grip, many a high end sports cars and straight up road race cars use these. Its there for function and some form. As GM stated, the ZL1 was designed to take you to the Road Course on Saturday, the dragway on Sunday and to work on Monday and do all those things well. The ZL1 1LE changes that 3 way focus to a singular focus at the Road Course and do that as best it can, while giving you "some" creature comforts for your ride to the track and back. It sounds to me that the best option for you would be to do a wheel/tire swap. The aero package isnt going to provide the downforce needed for better handling because you wont see the necessary speeds on the street, at least you shouldnt be, haha. Sounds like you want the aero more as an appearance package to me. Nothing wrong with that, I think it looks great, just functionally unnecessary for a street car. Good luck with your request to GM to try and build the car you want, I dont see it coming to fruition. As you said though, never hurts to ask, worst they can say is no. Unless youre mentally a 2 year old and you can only react to the word no with a tantrum, Im guessing you'll be just fine, haha. Food for thought though, if you were already pricing a Huracan, Im pretty sure purchasing a ZL1 and adding which components you want from the ZL1 1LE, should still come out cheaper. Just sayin.