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Old 12-30-2020, 08:27 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by m3bs View Post
Iíd like to see a test of average lap time over 10 laps, simulating a typical run session at a HPDE type event. That would be a test of real world performance, not just a one-lap wonder. Can the brakes handle the heat, are the tires being overworked, cooling systems up to the task, etc. I doubt the 500 could even do 10 laps without having to stop for fuel...
I wish magazines would do some sort of endurance test as well. I don't personally care about having the car that wins these things, but I'd love to have better data of what to expect if I buy a car for track duty and how it compares to the other cars I'm considering.
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Old 12-30-2020, 08:28 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by CamaroSSStlfan View Post
I can't stand those young youtubers. Most of them look like beta Soy boys or whiny little girls.


Society would be much better without social media.
Social media is tearing the world apart.
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Old 12-30-2020, 08:30 AM   #17
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The GT500 is obviously bad to the bone. Stores are selling them for thousands over MSRP and have a waiting list, which makes it at least $25,000 more than you can get a ZL1 1LE for. While that's a substantial amount of money for us regular working people, it's nothing for 20 year old youtubers and professionals out there. Hell, that's the price of a several options on Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, etc. I don't know how the GT500 rides, but I know how rough the ZL1 1LE is.
Never driven a 500, but I'd expect the CFTP car rides as comfortable as a ZL1, but you can get ZLE laptimes.
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Old 12-30-2020, 09:20 AM   #18
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SS1LE is the greatest performance bargain we've ever seen.
I'm gonna have to say that performance for dollar and with all things counted including options, the current available C8s (Base and Z51) are the best value hands down. Second place goes to the ZL1.

No matter how anyone slices it GM makes the best value of cars on the planet.
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Old 12-30-2020, 09:35 AM   #19
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I kinda agree but I also think it comes down to mentality. Those of us who worked hard for what we have and earned every penny the hard way, I doubt anyone in that category would ever pay a dime extra for ADM even if it we could afford it.
Couldnít have said it better myself. I canít see myself ever paying even a dollar over msrp. Because of this my next car will probably be a ZL1 (also because it looks and sounds better and can also be bought with a manual.)
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Old 12-30-2020, 09:36 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by BlaqWhole View Post
I'm gonna have to say that performance for dollar and with all things counted including options, the current available C8s (Base and Z51) are the best value hands down. Second place goes to the ZL1.

No matter how anyone slices it GM makes the best value of cars on the planet.
I should have qualified my comment: SS1LE is the biggest laptime value we've ever seen.
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Old 12-30-2020, 11:57 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by BlaqWhole View Post
I'm gonna have to say that performance for dollar and with all things counted including options, the current available C8s (Base and Z51) are the best value hands down. Second place goes to the ZL1.

No matter how anyone slices it GM makes the best value of cars on the planet.
I'm still going with ZL1 as best performance value in the world. It will beat a Z51 C8 around a track, and aside from a dig, beat it from a roll, too. It also stops better than the C8. All that with back seats and the engine in the wrong place! If the C8 didn't have the insane 0-60 times, I don't think it would have the same fanfare.

Did you see the time Randy P. put down at Laguna Seca for the Z51 C8 at this year's MT Best Driver's Car? 1:37.83. Slower than an SS 1LE from a few years back (1:37.77) and nearly two seconds slower than the GT350R (obviously with an M6) time of 1:36.11 from that same year as the SS 1LE. The Z51's time is 4.9 seconds slower than a 911 Turbo S that was also on street summer tires for this year's BDC, and 4 seconds slower than the GT500 CFTP (1:33.84), also same day as the 911 Turbo S. These are all Randy P. times from MT's BDC competition.

The C8 is not a supercar, yet. It will be once the Z06 and other variants arrive. No doubt the capabilities are there for those future models.

Any not for nothing, but this is the second Shelby Mustang to finish in 2nd place in the last few years behind a bona fide supercar (GT350R finished 2nd behind a McLaren 570S in 2016 which by the way went 1:34.58).
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Old 12-31-2020, 02:49 AM   #22
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I'm still going with ZL1 as best performance value in the world. It will beat a Z51 C8 around a track, and aside from a dig, beat it from a roll, too. It also stops better than the C8. All that with back seats and the engine in the wrong place! If the C8 didn't have the insane 0-60 times, I don't think it would have the same fanfare.

Did you see the time Randy P. put down at Laguna Seca for the Z51 C8 at this year's MT Best Driver's Car? 1:37.83. Slower than an SS 1LE from a few years back (1:37.77) and nearly two seconds slower than the GT350R (obviously with an M6) time of 1:36.11 from that same year as the SS 1LE. The Z51's time is 4.9 seconds slower than a 911 Turbo S that was also on street summer tires for this year's BDC, and 4 seconds slower than the GT500 CFTP (1:33.84), also same day as the 911 Turbo S. These are all Randy P. times from MT's BDC competition.

The C8 is not a supercar, yet. It will be once the Z06 and other variants arrive. No doubt the capabilities are there for those future models.

Any not for nothing, but this is the second Shelby Mustang to finish in 2nd place in the last few years behind a bona fide supercar (GT350R finished 2nd behind a McLaren 570S in 2016 which by the way went 1:34.58).
You have to remember that the ZL1 with A10 is the one that can do all that and it is a bit more expensive than the C8 Z51. But I can see your point. I switch my choice to the ZL1, lol!!

But I do not think the C8 Z06 will be a legit "Supercar"...like the Aventador, McLarens, etc. It ain't gonna touch those cars. Not without forced induction at least. The C8 ZR1 will be a true Supercar. But not the Z06.
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Old 12-31-2020, 12:47 PM   #23
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You have to remember that the ZL1 with A10 is the one that can do all that and it is a bit more expensive than the C8 Z51. But I can see your point. I switch my choice to the ZL1, lol!!

But I do not think the C8 Z06 will be a legit "Supercar"...like the Aventador, McLarens, etc. It ain't gonna touch those cars. Not without forced induction at least. The C8 ZR1 will be a true Supercar. But not the Z06.
I just built a completely base C8 w/ Z51 with magnetic dampers and no other options: $67,885

An A10 ZL1 with no other options: $67,690 (including $2,100 gas guzzler).

They are pretty darn close in price when you add the magnetic dampers to the C8 ($1,895 option).

You're probably right about the Z06 vs. Aventador, McLaren 720S, etc. I think it will fall short of that level. It will be more like "entry level" supercar performance. The ZR1 will be right there with the big dogs, though. The C7 Z06 went 7:13 around the 'ring, I wonder what the new C8 Z06 will go? For comparison, the Ferrari 488 Pista went 7 mins flat.

FWIW, the Huracan Performante went 6:52 and it's NA...so maybe the Z06 will surprise us. I wasn't planning to mention the Aventador's time of 6:44.9 since it's a V12 and cost more than a half milllion dollars, but I just did anyway.

On another note: I didn't realize the Z51 package adds a 5.17 rear differential to the C8 until I just built one. No wonder it does 0-60 in under 3 seconds. That's some serious torque multiplication assuming the power can be put down (which it obviously does very well). 81% greater than the ZL1 (2.85 rear diff).
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Old 12-31-2020, 01:17 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium View Post
I just built a completely base C8 w/ Z51 with magnetic dampers and no other options: $67,885

An A10 ZL1 with no other options: $67,690 (including $2,100 gas guzzler).

They are pretty darn close in price when you add the magnetic dampers to the C8 ($1,895 option).

You're probably right about the Z06 vs. Aventador, McLaren 720S, etc. I think it will fall short of that level. It will be more like "entry level" supercar performance. The ZR1 will be right there with the big dogs, though. The C7 Z06 went 7:13 around the 'ring, I wonder what the new C8 Z06 will go? For comparison, the Ferrari 488 Pista went 7 mins flat.

FWIW, the Huracan Performante went 6:52 and it's NA...so maybe the Z06 will surprise us. I wasn't planning to mention the Aventador's time of 6:44.9 since it's a V12 and cost more than a half milllion dollars, but I just did anyway.

On another note: I didn't realize the Z51 package adds a 5.17 rear differential to the C8 until I just built one. No wonder it does 0-60 in under 3 seconds. That's some serious torque multiplication assuming the power can be put down (which it obviously does very well). 81% greater than the ZL1 (2.85 rear diff).
That Performante weighs 3000 lbs though. The C8 flatform is heavy (says the guy with a 3900lb track car ). I hope to be surprised, but I don't think the C8Z can break the 7min mark unless it has over 700hp TT OR if it has around 650hp NA with crazy downforce and a suspension as hardcore as the ZLE via a Z07 package. Both scenarios are possible I think.

The rear mid engine layout is proving to only help 0 to 60 times.
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Old 12-31-2020, 02:36 PM   #25
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That Performante weighs 3000 lbs though. The C8 flatform is heavy (says the guy with a 3900lb track car ). I hope to be surprised, but I don't think the C8Z can break the 7min mark unless it has over 700hp TT OR if it has around 650hp NA with crazy downforce and a suspension as hardcore as the ZLE via a Z07 package. Both scenarios are possible I think.

The rear mid engine layout is proving to only help 0 to 60 times.
The Performante has amazing active aero, it can even adjust downforce to a particular side of the car while turning. Car and Driver tested the Performante and it weighs 3,429 lbs and went 10.1 @ 136 mph in the 1/4 mile. That's 220 lbs lighter than the C8 (3,650 lbs), but not lighter than 720S, 488 Pista, etc. Plus, 136 mph vs 122-123 mph trap speeds means the Performante pulls a LOT harder than a Z51 C8.

Maybe GM will pull a C6 Z06 move and make the C8 Z06 lighter than the base car. It could be possible without forced induction but may be difficult since with the C6 Z06 they used a lot more aluminum and some carbon fiber compared to the base C6.

I also don't think the C8 Z06 will break 7 mins, considering the 488 Pista ran 7 mins flat; and the 720S didn't break 7 mins either. I think a C8 ZR1 could break it, though.
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Old 12-31-2020, 03:59 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium View Post
I just built a completely base C8 w/ Z51 with magnetic dampers and no other options: $67,885

An A10 ZL1 with no other options: $67,690 (including $2,100 gas guzzler).

They are pretty darn close in price when you add the magnetic dampers to the C8 ($1,895 option).

You're probably right about the Z06 vs. Aventador, McLaren 720S, etc. I think it will fall short of that level. It will be more like "entry level" supercar performance. The ZR1 will be right there with the big dogs, though. The C7 Z06 went 7:13 around the 'ring, I wonder what the new C8 Z06 will go? For comparison, the Ferrari 488 Pista went 7 mins flat.

FWIW, the Huracan Performante went 6:52 and it's NA...so maybe the Z06 will surprise us. I wasn't planning to mention the Aventador's time of 6:44.9 since it's a V12 and cost more than a half milllion dollars, but I just did anyway.

On another note: I didn't realize the Z51 package adds a 5.17 rear differential to the C8 until I just built one. No wonder it does 0-60 in under 3 seconds. That's some serious torque multiplication assuming the power can be put down (which it obviously does very well). 81% greater than the ZL1 (2.85 rear diff).

5:17? Hows the launch on that thing though? Gotta be a great driver with all that wheel spin.
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Old 12-31-2020, 04:49 PM   #27
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5:17? Hows the launch on that thing though? Gotta be a great driver with all that wheel spin.
Pretty sure the computer takes care of it all with launch control. Otherwise, with no launch control: throttle modulation!

Apparently the base C8 diff. is 4.89 so the trans. must be geared differently than most cars with 2.85-3.73:1 rear ends.

I just looked it up and the trans. is geared as if you started in 2nd in most other modern automatic vehicles. 1st is 2.91, 2nd is 1.76, 3rd is 1.22 and 4th is .878.

The ZL1 A10 doesn't hit 1.00 until 7th gear, for comparison:

1st 4.71
2nd 2.99
3rd 2.15
4th1.77
5th 1.52

Take 2nd gear, for example in the ZL1: 2.85 rear combined with 2.99 2nd = 8.52 overall. 2nd in the Z51 C8 = 1.76x5.17 = 9.1, so it's only a little lower than a ZL1's 2nd gear. Base Stingray = 1.76x4.89 = 8.61, pretty close to a ZL1 A10's 2nd gear.

Numerically, it makes sense to have such a low geared diff. with those transmissions ratios. Interesting choice on GM's part.
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Old 12-31-2020, 07:12 PM   #28
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That Performante weighs 3000 lbs though. The C8 flatform is heavy (says the guy with a 3900lb track car ). I hope to be surprised, but I don't think the C8Z can break the 7min mark unless it has over 700hp TT OR if it has around 650hp NA with crazy downforce and a suspension as hardcore as the ZLE via a Z07 package. Both scenarios are possible I think.

The rear mid engine layout is proving to only help 0 to 60 times.
Oh wow, that's much heavier than I thought. The 3000lbs must be dry weight.
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