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Old 08-30-2014, 11:37 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by doc7000 View Post
Moving the front axle forward two inches
Would make more sense then moving the engine back two inches. Actually we dont even know if two inches will be enough. The point would be to lower the engine in the engine bay.
Yeah, there's normally a X-member that connects the suspension. It would take probably 6" to be able to drop the engine, but then you'd have oil pan issues, on a lowered car, the first good speed bump you hit would crush the pan..... lowering would also lower the trans, so a manual would need a serious linkage re-work. It's always something.....
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Old 08-30-2014, 01:53 PM   #100
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If they did that, they would end up with something like the 4 the gens where half the engine was under the dash.
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Old 08-30-2014, 02:18 PM   #101
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As for the spyshot photos, I think GM is jacking with us.... ton of padding ^ a different nose everytime they bring em out....lol
of course they are. remember they tried to trick us into believing the c7 corvette would still have the traditional round tail lights

also I've never seen that grill on the current models in those spy shots
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Old 08-30-2014, 03:44 PM   #102
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There are probably a number of ways to do it but they probably couldn't practically do it on the alpha platform. If gm didn't produce the corvette though them i would say that they couldn't do it. I just think switching to a front mid shop layout would elevate the level of performance for the camaro.

The biggest issue is that the camaro has more then two seats
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Old 08-30-2014, 04:08 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by hector95z View Post
Big fan of the 3rd gen myself. Can't wait to see this new car regardless of the direction it goes. In the meantime, post pics of said 3rd gen garage Alan91 to keep us busy
here are a couple...

the 1st one is my 1991 z28 5 speed 305 tpi vert that i ordered new from the factory in may 1990 and picked up from the dealer in august... it has less than 7,000 miles on it

the second one is my 1985 IROC Z28 that i have been working on over the past several years... it has a LS3 based engine with a TVS2300 at 7 pounds of boost mated to a t-56... it puts over 600 rwhp to the ground...

the pic on the wall was an original GM billboard for the launch of the 3rd gens back in the day!

right now for 3rd gens i have in this garage
- 1982 Pace Car with rare 4 spd manual
- 1985 IROC as noted above
- 1987 Formula 350 (this is my son's car we gave him this year on his 16th birthday)
- 1988 Trans Am
- 1988 Sport Coupe (my original car i bought in '88 i found in a junk yard and i am restoring)
- 1988 Sport Couple that looks identical to my original car and was made same day 30 cars earlier
- 1989 IROC Z28 vert
- 1991 Z28 vert as mentioned above

also a 1987 buick grand national to round it out

can't wait for the 6th gen, hoping it has some 3rd gen features!
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Old 08-30-2014, 05:18 PM   #104
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Old 08-30-2014, 06:29 PM   #105
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Sort of funny reading all of the speculation after just finishing reading a book about GM on the design & testing of new cars.
From reading the book, I would be very surprised if those are true 5th Gens w/the Gen 6 mules. During the different phases of development, they put the new drivetrains & suspensions on the current generation to hide them in plain site. They talked about how they built C5's & put them under C4 body's so they could drive them around for a year without being noticed. The even put C5 drivetrains trains under current Camaro's (referred to them as Cormaro's) for the same reasons.
They enjoy reading the speculation knowing the bumps, fake panels, fake bumpers, taped off sections, etc are leading people off on all sorts of tangents. IMHO, it won't be a mild reskin. The mindset they normally have is they have to build a new car that will still look fresh (w/mild changes) 8 yrs after it comes out. Look at the changes from the C6 to the C7. Major changes to the look of the interior & exterior. They want to make sure they can sell the car for 6+ years, not just 2-3. They place them right next to the current model & competition when they are going for approval on the design. If you look at it from their perspective & the millions spent on development, a similar look to the 5th gen won't do that. Nice thing is they have a good car in the ATS to base it off. Should be interesting. From reading the book, these should be beta cars now.
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Old 08-30-2014, 07:29 PM   #106
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I was messing around with MS paint on the spy pic and used the basic dimensions shown....anyway my version is more evolutionary than revolutionary but I think the 6th gen will have more aggressive styling.
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Old 08-30-2014, 08:29 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by m1tankr View Post
Sort of funny reading all of the speculation after just finishing reading a book about GM on the design & testing of new cars.
From reading the book, I would be very surprised if those are true 5th Gens w/the Gen 6 mules. During the different phases of development, they put the new drivetrains & suspensions on the current generation to hide them in plain site. They talked about how they built C5's & put them under C4 body's so they could drive them around for a year without being noticed. The even put C5 drivetrains trains under current Camaro's (referred to them as Cormaro's) for the same reasons.
They enjoy reading the speculation knowing the bumps, fake panels, fake bumpers, taped off sections, etc are leading people off on all sorts of tangents. IMHO, it won't be a mild reskin. The mindset they normally have is they have to build a new car that will still look fresh (w/mild changes) 8 yrs after it comes out. Look at the changes from the C6 to the C7. Major changes to the look of the interior & exterior. They want to make sure they can sell the car for 6+ years, not just 2-3. They place them right next to the current model & competition when they are going for approval on the design. If you look at it from their perspective & the millions spent on development, a similar look to the 5th gen won't do that. Nice thing is they have a good car in the ATS to base it off. Should be interesting. From reading the book, these should be beta cars now.
Excellent post
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Old 08-31-2014, 03:13 AM   #108
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Very astute, and I would guess right on the mark. But that is kind of the fun of hounding upcoming car forums, they could be mules with 6th gen drivetrain, or they could just be 5th gens. Makes the lead up to the reveal interesting.

I am a muscle/performance car fan, currently have a VERY built Shelby GT500, so I am having fun watching the trickle of info on both the GT350 and the 6th Gen Camaro (and the Challenger and 5th Gen Camaro before that), and of course VERY interested
in both the Z06 and the rumors of an upcoming GT500. Bottom line, it is a GREAT time to be a muscle/pony/sports car fan. I am so glad to see all three of the Big 3 American manufacturers making cars that are well made, good looking, and in my personal experience very dependable.
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Old 08-31-2014, 07:42 AM   #109
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You can be certain they aren't Mules. If these are Mules, and they generally don't run Mules in packs in drive evaluations like the latest rounds of photos, then it is far from a 2016 car.

If these are 2016 prototypes (which with all the camo and two sets of photos of off property group drives they are), then these aren't Mules and they aren't disguised 5th Gens to throw everyone off.

Simply go back and look at the evolution of the spy shots of the Gen 5 and the C7 Corvette.

They've just done the best job of camo that I've ever seen. And both C6 and C7 were pretty well done. This takes it to another level.

Camo won't come off until the car is shown at an auto show somewhere or in the Camaro, shown in a movie. Again, look at history for the 5th Gen and C6 and C7.
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Old 08-31-2014, 09:40 AM   #110
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You can be certain they aren't Mules. If these are Mules, and they generally don't run Mules in packs in drive evaluations like the latest rounds of photos, then it is far from a 2016 car.

If these are 2016 prototypes (which with all the camo and two sets of photos of off property group drives they are), then these aren't Mules and they aren't disguised 5th Gens to throw everyone off.

Simply go back and look at the evolution of the spy shots of the Gen 5 and the C7 Corvette.

They've just done the best job of camo that I've ever seen. And both C6 and C7 were pretty well done. This takes it to another level.

Camo won't come off until the car is shown at an auto show somewhere or in the Camaro, shown in a movie. Again, look at history for the 5th Gen and C6 and C7.
Are these cars hand built at the GM Tech Center/Milford Proving Grounds or at the new home plant for Camaro in Mi along side the ATS/CTS chassis mates?

I know that history has shown us that someone at Oshawa took pics of a hand built car (white), I think they may have been fired over this, it would probably be too early if I really think about it for this to happen now at the new plant. So it would seem to make sense for Milford or the Tech center.

It doesn't seem like its been that long ago that we went thru this process.
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Old 08-31-2014, 03:19 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by m1tankr View Post
Sort of funny reading all of the speculation after just finishing reading a book about GM on the design & testing of new cars.
From reading the book, I would be very surprised if those are true 5th Gens w/the Gen 6 mules. During the different phases of development, they put the new drivetrains & suspensions on the current generation to hide them in plain site. They talked about how they built C5's & put them under C4 body's so they could drive them around for a year without being noticed. The even put C5 drivetrains trains under current Camaro's (referred to them as Cormaro's) for the same reasons.
They enjoy reading the speculation knowing the bumps, fake panels, fake bumpers, taped off sections, etc are leading people off on all sorts of tangents. IMHO, it won't be a mild reskin. The mindset they normally have is they have to build a new car that will still look fresh (w/mild changes) 8 yrs after it comes out. Look at the changes from the C6 to the C7. Major changes to the look of the interior & exterior. They want to make sure they can sell the car for 6+ years, not just 2-3. They place them right next to the current model & competition when they are going for approval on the design. If you look at it from their perspective & the millions spent on development, a similar look to the 5th gen won't do that. Nice thing is they have a good car in the ATS to base it off. Should be interesting. From reading the book, these should be beta cars now.
So when they picked the refresh tail lights what did they have it parked next to?
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Old 08-31-2014, 03:45 PM   #112
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Thank you SO much for these pics!!! I'm getting more excited by the day. Come on January!!!
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