[Tyl3r]

Breach of warranty - write your State Attorney and local consumer protection agency CCing GM.

[speedup]

might be a good idea to take it to an independent shop, pay them to diagnose the problem, and have them write up what they think happened with some pics to support the theory.

Then if/when this goes to court, you at least have another mechanics opinion to support your claim.

besides ... (not saying this is the case) you might find it that what you did was involved in the failure, either directly or indirectly.. then you dont have to waste time and money for the paperwork, lawyers, etc etc...

[cbr1100xx]

Originally Posted by Joshinator99

I really don’t know any manufacturer that will continue to warranty a car with $13K worth of mods to it. If you want a fast car, you have to forget the warranty and let the chips fall where they may.

Yup.

[Childs Play]

Catch cans and aftermarket oil coolers most definitely can void the engine and power train warranty. Don’t believe me? There’s a previous post of a guys engine going due to an oil pump failure and GM blamed the catch can. It went all the way to Al and he basically said “Welp, we told you not to mod it.”

It’s happened before, now, and will happen again.

And to the people who say “ThEy HaVe To PrOvE tHe AfTeRmArKeT pArT cAuSeD tHe PrObLeM!” No. No they don’t. People who say that HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA WHAT THE F*** THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT. The Mag-Moss act has nothing to do with aftermarket/custom parts. It’s only for OEM parts.

OP I wish you absolutely the best of luck. Maybe a remediation will work. However for it to I’d keep as much personal info/car info off here as possible as GM has been known to tell someone to shove it because they complained and bashed them online and they figured out who they were so they decided they didn’t need to help due to the bad publicity that was created.

I’m not saying it’s right. It’s absolutely shitty and I’m on your side about the custom part you added most likely doing nothing. But GM is known to be sticklers on this stuff.

[ScatPack]

Originally Posted by Childs Play

Catch cans and aftermarket oil coolers most definitely can void the engine and power train warranty. Don’t believe me? There’s a previous post of a guys engine going due to an oil pump failure and GM blamed the catch can. It went all the way to Al and he basically said “Welp, we told you not to mod it.”

It’s happened before, now, and will happen again.

And to the people who say “ThEy HaVe To PrOvE tHe AfTeRmArKeT pArT cAuSeD tHe PrObLeM!” No. No they don’t. People who say that HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA WHAT THE F*** THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT. The Mag-Moss act has nothing to do with aftermarket/custom parts. It’s only for OEM parts.

OP I wish you absolutely the best of luck. Maybe a remediation will work. However for it to I’d keep as much personal info/car info off here as possible as GM has been known to tell someone to shove it because they complained and bashed them online and they figured out who they were so they decided they didn’t need to help due to the bad publicity that was created.

I’m not saying it’s right. It’s absolutely shitty and I’m on your side about the custom part you added most likely doing nothing. But GM is known to be sticklers on this stuff.

Yikes man. Check your facts before you post...

https://www.sema.org/sema-enews/2011...ermarket-parts

In a Consumer Alert issued by the Federal Trade Commission (FTC), the agency confirmed that “The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act makes it illegal for companies to void your warranty or deny coverage under the warranty simply because you used an aftermarket part.” The alert outlines key provisions in the law that provides protections to car owners. As defined by the FTC, an “aftermarket' part is a part made by a company other than the vehicle manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer.”

“The FTC’s reference to aftermarket parts is equally applicable to specialty parts,” said Russ Deane, SEMA’s General Counsel. “Under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, the warranty cannot be conditioned to a specific brand of parts, services or vehicle modifications unless those parts or services are provided free of charge.”

The alert notes that a consumer has the right to patronize independent retail stores and repair shops for parts and service without fear of voiding the new car warranty. The dealer/vehicle manufacturer has the right to deny a warranty repair but they must demonstrate that the aftermarket part caused the problem. The warranty remains in effect for all other covered parts.

Basically your whole post is wrong. Voiding a warranty is not something they can do. All they can do is deny the warranty claim. Your warranty stays intact. They may label in their system that the specific part you are trying to get service on was modified, and other dealers can see this. Then its that dealer's decision to attempt to get chevy to cover the claim. This void warranty business has been misconstrued so bad over the years.

[ScatPack]

Originally Posted by staples87

Whether they are "voiding" the warranty or denying the warranty claim, it doesn't matter. They're still not covering the costs to fix the issue.

I do agree with you that a lot of times it's up to the dealership if they want to push for the warranty claim, however the manufacture only pays a fraction of the labor that it takes to complete the work. If the book calls for 22 hours of labor to replace a motor, GM may only pay that technician 12-14 hours to get it done. The dealership then has to decide on if it's worthwhile to proceed with the work.

No. Thats not how book hours work. GM specifies and pays the book hours, and techs are given the book hours to do a job. If they can do it quicker, they still get those book hours paid. If it takes longer, then they are eating the time or basically working at a lower pay rate. Like when salary people work over 40 hours a week. They are basically working at a lower hourly rate.

https://www.cartruckinfo.com/mechani...and-mechanics/

As for the warranty void. Its really a dealer decision. They dont "void" the warranty. But they will flag the part as being modified. And as I said, its up to the next servicing dealer to decide if they want to push it through. Most will just hands off say no, no matter what was really the problem. But there are plenty of dealers out there with car guy techs and service writers that understand what some of these mods actually do, and wont be dicks about it by default. If I were a service writer, I would make damn sure the mod actually did cause the fault before I simply called the customer and told them to get bent.

Now you come in down a cylinder, with your NOS kit still installed and the bottle heater still on, then you are most likely out of luck. Now you come in with the nos kit still installed, but your air conditioning is not working properly, then you are going to get a fair diagnosis and most likely the warranty work no questions asked. Although I might ask you what you ran with the car as a fellow car guy. That is what should happen.

[burnningice]

GM is going to use the fact that I modified the car to get out of the claim. Although that is BS I see that happening. (All manufacturers do that)
I'm going to be stuck paying for the repairs myself. I'm more upset at the dealership at this point. I took it to them 2 or 3 times for a growling noise. They said there was no problem with the car. They said the oil lines were rubbing g against the engine. (False) I think the sound of the failing oil pump was being sent through the lines.
Now that the pump fails, I'm blamed. If that was the problem they should have told me to remove it.
I have no problem paying for services rendered. I feel that I should receive a major discount for this problem because of misdiagnosis.
I'm thinking dealership employee discount rate. 17.2 hrs at $145 is rediclious for something that could have been prevented.
At employee cost they are not loosing any money and they can do the right thing and save face. Am I being rational about this request or am I being unreasonable?

[Childs Play]

Originally Posted by ScatPack

Yikes man. Check your facts before you post...

https://www.sema.org/sema-enews/2011...ermarket-parts



Basically your whole post is wrong. Voiding a warranty is not something they can do. All they can do is deny the warranty claim. Your warranty stays intact. They may label in their system that the specific part you are trying to get service on was modified, and other dealers can see this. Then its that dealer's decision to attempt to get chevy to cover the claim. This void warranty business has been misconstrued so bad over the years.

Yea... I typed that up really quick while taking a dump.

You’re correct on the void warranty part. I used the wrong term. They can deny a specific claim on the warranty itself but the overall warranty does in fact stay in tact. Thanks for that. And yes. I am aware of it.

What I meant was the warranty will be denied and was basically void on that specific item. While not technically correct on the word “void”, it might as well be because even if you take it to a different dealership and GM was already notified of the problem you’re pretty much still SOL.

Also, if you tune your car and GM requests to see if it was tuned. You’re basically hosed if you have an engine go up in smoke. They’ll wiggle out any way they can. You’ll need an army of lawyers to get out from under that.

And an aftermarket part can be used. Absolutely. However it still falls under an OEM part originally used on the car. That part can be sold by anyone even if it’s a specialty part. GM can’t force you to buy their brand or a specific brand of that part. Just like they can’t tell you you have to buy Shell gasoline.

However, you can’t just bolt on a supercharger and/or put on aftermarket headers, tune it, send it, and blow a piston out the side and go “Well you have to prove it!” That’s not how that works. You’ll get that warranty claim denied every time. And if you sue them, you’ll be out of that money too.

Now... if you paid to have it all replaced and it was put back to stock? Probably would still be covered under your warranty if something went wrong.

[burnningice]

Idk if this works in my favor or not. I never received an estimate for repairs. I notated on a drop box envelope that car has no oil pressure.

[Childs Play]

Originally Posted by burnningice

GM is going to use the fact that I modified the car to get out of the claim. Although that is BS I see that happening. (All manufacturers do that)
I'm going to be stuck paying for the repairs myself. I'm more upset at the dealership at this point. I took it to them 2 or 3 times for a growling noise. They said there was no problem with the car. They said the oil lines were rubbing g against the engine. (False) I think the sound of the failing oil pump was being sent through the lines.
Now that the pump fails, I'm blamed. If that was the problem they should have told me to remove it.
I have no problem paying for services rendered. I feel that I should receive a major discount for this problem because of misdiagnosis.
I'm thinking dealership employee discount rate. 17.2 hrs at $145 is rediclious for something that could have been prevented.
At employee cost they are not loosing any money and they can do the right thing and save face. Am I being rational about this request or am I being unreasonable?

Let me put it this way... A guy with a 5th gen Camaro on these forums knew his oil pump was going out. He told the dealership about it. What did they do? Started the car anyway.

Guess who had to pay for the repairs since they found a catch can on his car.

I’ll give you a hint. It wasn’t the dealership or GM.

This could have easily not happened if they didn’t start the car and let it run. Yet since he had a catch can GM washed their hands of it and said it wasn’t covered. It was a HUGE deal on here. Many members stated their displeasure with the outcome and thought it was bullsh**. Even higher up guys had a conference call about it with the Chief Engineer for the Camaro. His response was, more or less, we’ve told you not to modify the cars or the warranty wouldn’t be honored for the parts that broke.

Could you take them to court? Sure. But can you afford a lawyer that will probably just be a waste of time and money?

I’m not saying I agree with it. Believe me I’ve had to pay for stuff that I’ve modified before due to it not being covered after mods. It sucks. I’d just pay to get it repaired and move on even if it sucks.

[mlee]

Originally Posted by speedup

dont they have to prove the aftermarket part is directly responsible for the failure?

Nope

Originally Posted by burnningice

That is what I thought but apparently they just told the dealership to reject my claim. Taking GM to court would probably cost more than the price of the repair.

That exactly right. Those that spout Moss V Mag don't realized that Magnuson had a butt ton of money to lose in sales so it made sense for them to fight it.

Originally Posted by burnningice

I thought about that. Build it to 1k hp. But that's a lot of money too. I would be representing a brand that doesnt support the customers.

They are doing exactly what they say they will do if there are mods. This is one car that is covered even running on a track. Your wheel wells could be full of track rubber and come in with a broken axle and they will fix it every time with no mods.

Over 135k posts in this thread and the guy is a close personal friend who I can vouch for 110%. He had the exact issue as you except all he had was a catch can. A lot of people went to bat for him too.

Camaro Chief Al O. brought his case up with me and his comments were I've told you guys many times (and he has) that if you mod anything don't expect to keep your warranty. Doesn't matter what it is.... Cold Air Intake included. That rarely happens because most dealerships use a little common sense about this stuff. I'm not sure about your case, but with oil cooler mod and other items you just can't expect them to warranty this. I try to relay this message every chance I get.

Now putting on my sympathy hat. We all know oil pump is the weak link in these motors and the mods on my buddies car definitely didn't cause it to go and I can assume yours as well. Others have mentioned this starts with the dealership. They could have fixed it under warranty. I've seen dealerships fix big failures like this just recently and they knew full well the mods did cause the failure. I'd be more pissed at them than GM, and maybe you can find someone else if GM hasn't flagged it yet. It's probably not the "right" thing to do, but who knows.

Really sorry to see this happen to you and hope you can replace the pump like my friend did. He's still driving the car today. In fact he will be on the NCM track at Camaro Fest again this July.

[protovack]

That sucks really bad and I think you make a good case for the failing oil pump making noise and going undiagnosed. Unfortunately you shot yourself in the foot by doing that specific engine mod before 36k. If it was indeed a random oil pump failure, it is an extremely unfortunate coincidence that you had also modded the oil system. When you mod before 36k you are implicitly taking on the risk of paying for your own engine repairs. You knew that when you put the oil cooler on, hoping the dice might land in your favor. Still, it totally sucks and I understand how you feel. You'd think dealers would be more interested in maintaining relationships with loyal customers.

[C Man]

Take the car back.

Switch out the oil cooler.

Bring to another dealership.

Tell them you didn't like the service at the other dealership and that you want to build a better relationship with another one since you are looking at upgrading next year.

[ScatPack]

Worst case scenario take it to a private shop, and pay the (actual cost) $500 to have it swapped out. Or dare I say, learn a thing or two and do it yourself. Its not the end of the world.