[UnknownJinX]

As mentioned before, some of you don't understand the difference between TSB and recalls.

As for the cost, I am sure Subaru and Mazda are definitely happy about replacing all the valve springs in their engines(in Mazda's case, it's their diesel engines only so it doesn't impact North Americans). That's a recall, BTW, not a TSB.

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

Some of you may be missing my point. I am not saying GM needs to replace the springs in all of them. Just the engines they know the defective springs went into. They know exactly which engine every spring went into and the VIN numbers of every car or truck those engines went into. Every part has a QR code that is scanned during assembly for situations exactly like this.

See this reply.

Originally Posted by GearheadSS

Yes, yes they would. It has already happened where a replacement engine failed because of the same issue.

Imagine getting a large batch of valve springs from the supplier. Then dumping valve springs into existing pile of valve springs that are waiting to be installed into new heads. How do you track which ones are bad and which aren't at that point? There are actually probably good ones in these batches from suppliers. They may not all be bad. There are very likely good mixed with bad.

Now, you have to source more good springs because you know you have an issue. Do you think that can happen in a day or two? No. It takes time to a)identify why the springs failed and then b)inform the supplier and get them to fix the issue with all new springs going forward.

So, there are probably a lot of heads that already have bad springs in them, including heads mounted on new warranty replacement engines. Gm has to try and figure out a)just how many of cars are really affected and b)the failure rate of those cars

As for build dates, the build date of the car isn't as important as the build date of the head and the engine.

Sent from toaster or something

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by UnknownJinX

As mentioned before, some of you don't understand the difference between TSB and recalls.

As for the cost, I am sure Subaru and Mazda are definitely happy about replacing all the valve springs in their engines(in Mazda's case, it's their diesel engines only so it doesn't impact North Americans). That's a recall, BTW, not a TSB. See this reply.





Sent from toaster or something

Maybe you’ve all missed the fact every part has a QR code and they can trace every single component to every single engine to the exact date/time/location that component was produced at the supplier, then installed into the engine, then installed into the car. This isn’t 1970 anymore. They can trace every single individual spring back to the date it was forged or cast from raw metal all the way to what exact car it’s in.

The valve springs, along with every other component of the engine, aren’t mixed in a random pile today like they were in 1970. They’re sorted and inventoried and traced and tracked from the absolute genesis of their existence to the customers name and address who buys the car.

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

Maybe you’ve all missed the fact every part has a QR code and they can trace every single component to every single engine to the exact date/time/location that component was produced at the supplier, then installed into the engine, then installed into the car. This isn’t 1970 anymore. They can trace every single individual spring back to the date it was forged or cast from raw metal all the way to what exact car it’s in.

The valve springs, along with every other component of the engine, aren’t mixed in a random pile today like they were in 1970. They’re sorted and inventoried and traced and tracked from the absolute genesis of their existence to the customers name and address who buys the car.

Then explain why some of the replacement engines have failed due to the faulty springs, as mentioned in a few posts before.

If those springs are that easy to trace down, they would have been sorted out and discarded before they make their way into replacement engines.

Sent from toaster or something

[Thill444]

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

Maybe you’ve all missed the fact every part has a QR code and they can trace every single component to every single engine to the exact date/time/location that component was produced at the supplier, then installed into the engine, then installed into the car. This isn’t 1970 anymore. They can trace every single individual spring back to the date it was forged or cast from raw metal all the way to what exact car it’s in.

The valve springs, along with every other component of the engine, aren’t mixed in a random pile today like they were in 1970. They’re sorted and inventoried and traced and tracked from the absolute genesis of their existence to the customers name and address who buys the car.

My guess is the manufacturer only has a bad batch date, not the exact breakdown of which valve springs that are faulty and which are fine. Otherwise they would never have shipped them if they knew they were faulty. Perhaps as GM gets more and more failed ones they can isolate it further.

[GearheadSS]

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

Maybe you’ve all missed the fact every part has a QR code and they can trace every single component to every single engine to the exact date/time/location that component was produced at the supplier, then installed into the engine, then installed into the car. This isn’t 1970 anymore. They can trace every single individual spring back to the date it was forged or cast from raw metal all the way to what exact car it’s in.

The valve springs, along with every other component of the engine, aren’t mixed in a random pile today like they were in 1970. They’re sorted and inventoried and traced and tracked from the absolute genesis of their existence to the customers name and address who buys the car.

How do you know this as fact? Just curious.

[CoeusAscended]

Originally Posted by GearheadSS

How do you know this as fact? Just curious.

Not to speak for him but I work in a factory that produces steel plates, and every step of the way, everything that happens, is logged in computers, so if its ever needed, everything down to the second of every step, every transportation and every treatment can be traced back. You cant even move it without being forced to log it into the system, and I'm sure this is the same in GM factories as well, as well as all other factories belonging to major companies.

[GearheadSS]

Originally Posted by CoeusAscended

Not to speak for him but I work in a factory that produces steel plates, and every step of the way, everything that happens, is logged in computers, so if its ever needed, everything down to the second of every step, every transportation and every treatment can be traced back. You cant even move it without being forced to log it into the system, and I'm sure this is the same in GM factories as well, as well as all other factories belonging to major companies.

I get that but steel plates aren't the same as valve springs. I can tell you that each valve spring does not have a QR code on it. I'm sure the container that they're in does but the question is whether those valve springs are just randomly grabbed by the person assembling the engine or not.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Yes, they put every single engine on a test bench that measures 1500+ parameters during a dry (compressed air) run, see below.

They also put the finished car on a chassis roller and run it through a variety of tests. You can watch them do this at the Corvette plant (or you could before the suspended tours to switch over to the C8). But that's not going to catch a bad batch of valve springs that takes 200mi to show themselves.

[CHASLT1]

Originally Posted by gtfoxy

Any idea how the cylinder wall looked?





I dunno man, a few hundred bucks, if you already have an air compressor, for valve springs, TDC stop, hand spring compressor & an afternoon would solve the problem for good.

Really not my line of work. Back in the day i would change spark plugs or even make my own wires on my 1972 Bel air Chevy i called the green lean machine. At least back then you had room to get a hand down and around the engine and know what is what. That was my first car in 1982. That old car ran pretty good for a 4 door.

[CHASLT1]

Originally Posted by slimjim2525

Sorry man. After being in the off road motorsports arena for 40 plus years, Polaris quality is crap. Their idea of testing is to design, make it, and put it on the market and let the dealers fix them as they break. Total junk, up and down their line up. There's a reason you won't see a Polaris snowmobile in northern Quebec. If you have a break down you're literally 50 to 100 miles from anything. Now you're screwed.


Back on topic. I would be very nervous owning a new 6.2 liter. what if you're at 37k miles and then you have an issue. Now you're on your own dime. This sucks, glad I have a 19. Was gonna upgrade but not now.

I guess you would be out of luck buck. For me to get to 37k miles would take many years and i never keep a car past 4 years. But if it did happen and it was on my dime i guess i would do a rebuild and do away with that crappy AFM and do a cam and such.

[CHASLT1]

Originally Posted by 95 imp

Bad news, ALL the engines are cycle tested at the engine plant. Just because they are doesn't mean that nothing will ever go wrong. That's why you have a warranty.

In this case, the engine failed due to a faulty batch of parts. This is not GM's fault. Blame the spring manufacturer, or the steel company.

The motor got rebuilt. GM did it in a timely manner and honored the warranty. What more can you ask for?

The irony in all this is that everyone is crying that GM engine plant quality is poor, but they want a replacement engine FROM THE SAME PLANT.

And, they also say a motor HAS to come from the plant over having a GM certified tech HAND build the motor. There are metal fragments everywhere in that engine. It HAS to be completely tore down, cleaned, inspected and rebuilt.

These are the same guys who drool over an aftermarket builder's hand built 416, super cam, blower deluxe motor who took a core engine and.... REBUILT IT!

And, before you point a finger, my car was built in the TSB area too. I have 45xx on the clock and have wound the motor out at the track and street without issue thus far.

If it does pop, I would try to talk the dealer into slipping the HOT cam in with the rebuild and have it all warrantied. (Even if it were a few $$ out of pocket)

My sticker says built in Sept of this year. I wonder how you can find out what day it was made?

[CHASLT1]

Originally Posted by GearheadSS

The highest mileage I've seen reported is around 700. Most that make it above 500 seem to be fine. The majority that I've seen with a failure happened within 200 miles.

I am just over 160 miles and since i don't drive much it seems like it will take forever for me to get past 500 miles. My vette club stopped all cruises back in June of this year. We would have around 40 vettes out in the country tearing it up. I need to just get somewhere and drive mine without traffic.

[ember1205]

Originally Posted by CHASLT1

My sticker says built in Sept of this year. I wonder how you can find out what day it was made?

If you're going off of the build sheet, that's the build date for the CAR, though, and only represents the day that the build was started (it takes a couple of days to make it all the way through the assembly process). The engine was likely completed at least a few days to a week prior to the start date for the car. And if you're referring to the general date on the door sticker, that's also referencing the build for the car and not for the engine.

[95 imp]

Originally Posted by ember1205

While there's a certain amount of good logic in this, the fact remains that A) certified technicians are not engine builders and B) GM isn't going to pay to completely tear down a motor every single time to ensure things are perfect.

So... They are going to leave a motor full of metal shavings and damage to a sleeve because they want to save money even though it will wipe out the new motor in a week. Makes sense, right?

Heck, next you probably say they solder the pistons back together and run the used oil through a coffee filter then pour it back in the motor to save some money too.

And, last I checked, the techs are factory trained. Some specialize in certain areas. I had a friend that was a certified tech at a Caddy dealer and all he did was rebuild trannys.

I guess somehow they can't train people to rebuild motors because they never ever go bad under warranty, or need to be repaired period and the shop manuals that tell you all the steps to do it are really there for show...