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Old 09-15-2020, 06:48 AM   #29
95 imp
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I REALLY debated the A10/M6. The A10 is scary good (if you let the computer handle everything).

After having the "glass jaw" 4L60E, I was worried about mods and aftermarket parts/tune on it, so I went M6.

Still working on the 10ms shifts....
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Old 09-15-2020, 07:23 AM   #30
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Love how this thread went way off topic into that age old auto vs manual debate.

Folks, the topic put forward by the OP was not which is better. It was regarding the inability to tune the automatic.

With Global B going across the GM line up, given the heightened cyber security, will we ever be able to "tune" these cars again?

As we move deeper and deeper into the "automation" and "connectivity" rabbit hole, security and control of the systems is becoming a major focus. While this is great for the 98% of the people that would just as soon the car drive itself, it's a wall for the enthusiast that wants the car to perform better.
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Old 09-15-2020, 12:13 PM   #31
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I think the A10 is a really good transmission so far, car is only 6 months old. I had the A6 in my C7 , worked well , this A10 shifts quicker, very smooth. Kudos to GM in fixing whatever was the issue with the A8. I heard the grief on the C7 forum over the A8 transmission , especially the early ones. The A6 was only produced the first year with the C7 kinda lucked out buying early and avoiding the A8 issues.



My last manual car was a 4 spd Z28 back in the late 70's, don't miss the shifting. Lots of other things to focus on driving a sports car besides shifting.
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Old 09-15-2020, 12:38 PM   #32
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The A10 is amazing.

2020 SS with 10L80—Amazing transmission, the Fastest non dual clutch in the world. The tranny: rev matches, line lock, launch controls, performance shift mode, rpm hold,keeps RPM at a higher rate if it determines you may accelerate again.

Ordered a 2021 1LE with the 10L80 . It comes with a 2.85 rear gear vs. the 2.77 on the SS.
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Old 09-15-2020, 01:49 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Invertalon View Post
I find the manual crowd the same or worse, TBH. Constantly read that it is somehow a "waste" of sorts to get an auto with such a car or something, how they couldn't stand to ever have an auto and the list goes on.

I can care less what other people prefer, but the fact people do get riled up by other people and their preferences and choices is always interesting. Like a weird flex to themselves for whatever reason, yet nobody cares.
Just like almost anything else I've found that on the internet they're just as bad as each other but in real life manual guys are low key and just say "it's a 6 speed" when asked (maybe with a smirk on their face from time to time).

Almost every Camaro, Mustang, and Corvette guy I've interacted with, when asked what trans they have usually tells you it's an auto followed by some sort of story/excuse (idk why it's their choice) about "how they love manuals, but their age, how much they daily drive in traffic, the wife, or something else" reluctantly pushed them towards an auto. Just say it's auto and own it, but many feel they have to defend or justify their trans choice.

..having said that I understand why they answer that way, but at the end of the day all these transmissions have their advantages and disadvantages so either way you can't really go too wrong.
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Old 09-15-2020, 02:02 PM   #34
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Absolutely not!! I work at a dealership in sales and I'll tell you the new A10 is no joke! It feels soooooo much faster than my 2017 SS M6! All the people I take for a ride that think a manual transmission is the coolest have a change of heart. If it was 1991 and you were buying a new 5.0 Mustang, the manual is where it's at. 4th gen F body is closer on auto/manual debate depending on drivers. My personal opinion,,,,,,, in 2020 technology, you can NOT shift as fast as the A10. Game changer. And the best thing, according to the My Chevrolet app, I got 29 mpg taking it easy on my 18 mile drive to work!!
12.2 vs 12.3 according to C&D.... it might feel a certain way but reality says it's not soooo much faster, and that's including the fact that the m6 is going to be slower out of the hole so in a roll there difference is less apparent.

I recently drove an a10 ss and was thoroughly impressed, easily the most impressive torque converter auto I've driven. From performance shifting mode and how it downshifts when stabbing the gas, to the pretty decent paddle response, and the fact that they handle a lot more power than the old 4l60e's (maybe not 8l90 strong but strong non the less). Just a great auto imo, not for me given the option vs m6, but for those who prefer auto it's fantastic.
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Old 09-15-2020, 02:13 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroRSOnt View Post
I think the A10 is a really good transmission so far, car is only 6 months old. I had the A6 in my C7 , worked well , this A10 shifts quicker, very smooth. Kudos to GM in fixing whatever was the issue with the A8. I heard the grief on the C7 forum over the A8 transmission , especially the early ones. The A6 was only produced the first year with the C7 kinda lucked out buying early and avoiding the A8 issues.



My last manual car was a 4 spd Z28 back in the late 70's, don't miss the shifting. Lots of other things to focus on driving a sports car besides shifting.

Lot's of other things to focus on, like what? If you're going to say a better racing line, I doubt most including yourself have to worry about that much. Usually when driving a sports car, you focus on the drive imo.
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Old 09-15-2020, 02:33 PM   #36
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I thought I read that this Bosch controller is being used across most 20-on platforms. If that is true, it seems there is a good business case for HPTuners not to unlock this thing. But - I don't have any clue if I'm onto something.

I didn't know '20s would have this problem when I purchased mine. I didn't think I'd mod' it anyways at the time, but because I have, I would not have changed my decision then. It seems torque modeling can affect at least some aspects of the transmission tuning, and I think I've verified that. Regardless - even if it isn't unlocked in the future, I don't regret my decision. I got the car almost exactly how I wanted it, and have changed almost everything I've wanted to, and the state of the tranny tune isn't holding me back (torque tuning is, but that's not the topic, HAHAHA).
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Old 09-15-2020, 04:34 PM   #37
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Quote:
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I can't imagine anyone buying the A10 in an SS or LT1 having any regrets.
I hope you're right in the majority of cases.

That would at least mean that those who bought their V8 Camaro with the A10 made their choice for their own right reasons.

But there's probably a few customers who bought too hastily off the lot (perhaps under heavy salesperson influence or unwillingness to source a V8/MT) or who thought they'd give the automatic a try this go-around without being 100% convinced, that might end up wishing they'd chosen differently.


I can see where inability to tune the shift programming could be a sticking point for some, who didn't realize that going in. Though outside of taking the lag out of the paddle-shifting I'm not sure just what you'd be usefully gaining that's not available in some mode.


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Old 09-15-2020, 05:30 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroRSOnt View Post
I think the A10 is a really good transmission so far, car is only 6 months old. I had the A6 in my C7 , worked well , this A10 shifts quicker, very smooth. Kudos to GM in fixing whatever was the issue with the A8. I heard the grief on the C7 forum over the A8 transmission , especially the early ones. The A6 was only produced the first year with the C7 kinda lucked out buying early and avoiding the A8 issues.



My last manual car was a 4 spd Z28 back in the late 70's, don't miss the shifting. Lots of other things to focus on driving a sports car besides shifting.
We could be friends.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87 View Post
Just like almost anything else I've found that on the internet they're just as bad as each other but in real life manual guys are low key and just say "it's a 6 speed" when asked (maybe with a smirk on their face from time to time).

Almost every Camaro, Mustang, and Corvette guy I've interacted with, when asked what trans they have usually tells you it's an auto followed by some sort of story/excuse (idk why it's their choice) about "how they love manuals, but their age, how much they daily drive in traffic, the wife, or something else" reluctantly pushed them towards an auto. Just say it's auto and own it, but many feel they have to defend or justify their trans choice.

..having said that I understand why they answer that way, but at the end of the day all these transmissions have their advantages and disadvantages so either way you can't really go too wrong.
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Old 09-15-2020, 09:57 PM   #39
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A10 shifts faster

M6 is a more visceral driving experience

Thank God we still have a choice

Pick your poison and be happy.
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Old 09-16-2020, 12:59 AM   #40
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Loving my 2020 LT1 with the A10 so far. No regrets.

I was in the never-auto club for a long time, but this one won me over when I test drove it.

It's also what let me talk my wife into letting me buy it. She was very wary of manual, since she wanted to be able to drive it too, and my reassurances of "I'll teach you how to drive a manual" weren't well received... :-)
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Old 09-16-2020, 08:11 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by Awebb View Post
Loving my 2020 LT1 with the A10 so far. No regrets.

I was in the never-auto club for a long time, but this one won me over when I test drove it.

It's also what let me talk my wife into letting me buy it. She was very wary of manual, since she wanted to be able to drive it too, and my reassurances of "I'll teach you how to drive a manual" weren't well received... :-)
I'm still working on the "I'll teach you" promise, I told her that was the reason for buying my last beater Miata lol.. Every car we own is a stick beside the zr2 so I really do need to get on it.
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2019 Mustang GT pp1 - svt pp2 wheels, mbrp cat back, sync 3 upgrade, p1x procharger + stg2 intercooler.
2018 Colorado zr2 - zr2 sport bar, showcase spare tire.
2018 Camaro SS 1LE - GM cai, black bowties, suede knee bolsters, 1le plate frame, black fuel door, dark tails + 3rd brake light, euro side markers + led's, GM all weather floor mats, velossatech big mouth, GM strut brace.
2017 Corvette Grandsport (sold) - untouched.
2006 GTO (sold) - iat relocation, air box mod, monero side marker lights.
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Old 09-16-2020, 08:51 AM   #42
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Locking the tcm has nothing to do with cyber security. It's completely about control. Taking control of your car and keeping it is GM's hands to divy out who can service it. This not only benefits franchises (dealers) but also helps ensure consumers can't extend the part beyond what gm wants... Forcing either more expensive new car purchases or more frequent ones.

It's exactly the same story with the encrypted audio in the infotainment system. It's going to reach pretty much everything. None of it is for your benefit... Security or otherwise
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