Homepage Garage Wiki Register Members List Social Groups Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
#Camaro6
Go Back   CAMARO6 > Specific Packages / Variants > 6th gen Camaro 1LE


Bigwormgraphix


Post Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-16-2019, 01:17 PM   #1
JROC
Account Suspended
 
Drives: 19 Camaro SS 1LE, 03 Ford Lightning
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 334
Do these cars come with a Corvette tax?

Really mods seem to be very expensive for these GEN6 Camaros or maybe it's just GEN5 SBC's in generally, but holy crap. I use to think $1800-$2200 was a lot for a complete exhaust from your higher-end exhaust companies. A complete U.S made SS exhaust for a GEN6 looks to be pushing $3K. It's just stainless tubing that's been bent into shape and welded together. A CAI looks to be like $400+. I have an awesome JLT CAI on my L that cost well under $200. My LID/drop in K&N on my Fcar was maybe $120? About $700 for a good 102+ MM TB? It's just a block of aluminum machined to mount to a manifold with 4 bolts in a square pattern and a large hole in the center of them with a butterfly valve and maybe an electrical sensor mounted on it. Do the GEN5 LT motors see bigger gains from these mods then say your GEN4 LS motors? Then you'll probably need a $1300 manifold to run a l02+ MM TB. That's $2k right there. I mean what's a clutch or a STS cost for a new Camaro.

I know I'm ranting here, and I'm all for people/companies making their $. They're in business to make a profit, and these arent necessarily LS7 aftermarket part prices. Still I don't see why aftermarket parts for GEN6 Camaros should cost much if any more than they do for cars a generation or two back. I'm all for businesses making money, but I don't want to feel extorted either. Oddly enough more serious mods like a cam or head porting doesn't seems like it's gone up "TOO" much over your LS stuff. (maybe a little bit more) It seems to me to mainly apply to bolt ons from what I'm seeing.

Please tell me if you think I'm wrong. I'm not the bigger expert, but when I start looking for mods for this car I keep thinking, "wow that part cost a lot of money for this car.)

Last edited by JROC; 11-16-2019 at 02:03 PM.
JROC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2019, 01:24 PM   #2
TRZ06

 
TRZ06's Avatar
 
Drives: 18' NFG 2SS 1LE
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 1,908
IMO, manufacturing costs are higher than they used to be.

Another thing to consider is that while many will still upgrade to aftermarket, cars are built with quality OEM stuff already nowadays to where aftermarket isn't as needed as before, so an aftermarket company will yield less for all their R&D than they used to, so to compensate, they have to increase their margins.

Also, with exhaust systems at least, if it maintains the valves/dual mode, that adds production costs.

Pricing for the Euro crowd is going up as well, you can pay upwards of $8K to $10K on certain BMW/Audi full systems.
__________________
Current:
18' NFG 2SS 1LE (ZL1 1LE solid rear cradle bushings & Corsa Cat-back Exhaust)

Previous:
16' F80 M3 (Ohlin R/T Coilovers)
15' Audi S4
13' Audi TTRS (APR Stage 1, MSS Springs)
09' C6 Z06
08' E90 M3
06' 335i (KW V2 Coilovers)
03' C5 Z06
99' C5 Hardtop
TRZ06 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2019, 02:14 PM   #3
JROC
Account Suspended
 
Drives: 19 Camaro SS 1LE, 03 Ford Lightning
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRZ06 View Post
IMO, manufacturing costs are higher than they used to be.

Another thing to consider is that while many will still upgrade to aftermarket, cars are built with quality OEM stuff already nowadays to where aftermarket isn't as needed as before, so an aftermarket company will yield less for all their R&D than they used to, so to compensate, they have to increase their margins.

Also, with exhaust systems at least, if it maintains the valves/dual mode, that adds production costs.

Pricing for the Euro crowd is going up as well, you can pay upwards of $8K to $10K on certain BMW/Audi full systems.
You do make some very good points. Especially that OEM parts are much improved and not as needing of replacement as they were in years past. Also time moves on, inflation goes up and labor costs increase. I can't complain about that too much as I'm a tool maker myself.

I hope those Euro exhausts are like full titanium and CF exhaust systems for those kinds of prices.

BTW how much were your ZL1 1LE solid bushing and were did you get them if you don't mind me asking? I've seen other threads where you're a big proponent of solid subframe bushings on these cars. I have detected some wheelhop in this car especially with the outside temps dropping. I replaced all the IRS bushings on my old Terminator with a delrin/UHMW/aluminum bushings kit and it was a huge improvement over the OEM rubber.
JROC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2019, 03:02 PM   #4
TRZ06

 
TRZ06's Avatar
 
Drives: 18' NFG 2SS 1LE
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 1,908
Quote:
Originally Posted by JROC View Post
You do make some very good points. Especially that OEM parts are much improved and not as needing of replacement as they were in years past. Also time moves on, inflation goes up and labor costs increase. I can't complain about that too much as I'm a tool maker myself.

I hope those Euro exhausts are like full titanium and CF exhaust systems for those kinds of prices.

BTW how much were your ZL1 1LE solid bushing and were did you get them if you don't mind me asking? I've seen other threads where you're a big proponent of solid subframe bushings on these cars. I have detected some wheelhop in this car especially with the outside temps dropping. I replaced all the IRS bushings on my old Terminator with a delrin/UHMW/aluminum bushings kit and it was a huge improvement over the OEM rubber.
Yeah, those exhaust systems that are that much are the Ti and CF ones, but even the non exotic ones are way more expensive that the domestic systems for Corvettes, Camaro's, Mustangs, etc.

I got my Solid cradle bushings from Wildhammer Motorsports, they are the GMPP ones, but from what I understand they are hard to get ahold of now and I have even heard that GM has stopped selling them as a standalone part, but that is just what I have heard on here, not sure how true that is.

They do make a big difference, mostly in how the rear-end behaves in quick transition maneuvers and on back roads or high speed sweepers. It is the single best thing to get you close to the body control you get from the ZL1 1LE
__________________
Current:
18' NFG 2SS 1LE (ZL1 1LE solid rear cradle bushings & Corsa Cat-back Exhaust)

Previous:
16' F80 M3 (Ohlin R/T Coilovers)
15' Audi S4
13' Audi TTRS (APR Stage 1, MSS Springs)
09' C6 Z06
08' E90 M3
06' 335i (KW V2 Coilovers)
03' C5 Z06
99' C5 Hardtop
TRZ06 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2019, 03:16 PM   #5
Joshinator99

 
Joshinator99's Avatar
 
Drives: 2017 Camaro 2SS A8
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Petersham MA
Posts: 1,568
My brother has a ‘16 Z06 and can tell you his car-specific items (like CAI, exhaust, etc) are definitely more expensive than they were for my car.
__________________
2017 Chevy Camaro 2SS A8 Whipple 8.00/3.25, Mast Motorsports Black Label LT1 heads, CamMotion custom blower cam, Katech VVT & AFM delete covers, Rotofab Big Gulp, Katech 103mm TB, DW400 in tank pump w/JMS, Johnson 2110R lifters, GPI forged pistons & rods, LPE +52 injectors, LPE BB HPFP, AWE Touring CB, GForce 3.5” DS, GForce Outlaw axles, 2” ceramic coated Dynatech headers, MM Wild CC, LPE check valve, everything BMR makes, OEM 1LE wheels (street), Forgestar D5 bead locks (track)
2019 Toyota Sequoia Limited 4WD (daily driver)
2018 Alfa Romeo Giulia Ti Sport Q4 (hers)
Joshinator99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2019, 08:14 PM   #6
Paintslinger16
Two Lane Blacktop
 
Paintslinger16's Avatar
 
Drives: '18 Camaro 2SS
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Black River, NNY
Posts: 403
Big boy Toys are expensive, the market will pay it, i was super stoked to find my used 18 had a cat back system on it when I got it home, no mention from dealer.
I came back to cars from the Harley world, by the inch HD aftermarket exhaust are way more expensive.
I spent 1000.00 on a 2:1 D&D for my Springer probably only 40 inches of tube.
Paintslinger16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2019, 12:12 AM   #7
JamesNoBrakes

 
JamesNoBrakes's Avatar
 
Drives: 2SS 1LE
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: AK
Posts: 1,619
Quote:
Originally Posted by JROC View Post
Really mods seem to be very expensive for these GEN6 Camaros or maybe it's just GEN5 SBC's in generally, but holy crap. I use to think $1800-$2200 was a lot for a complete exhaust from your higher-end exhaust companies. A complete U.S made SS exhaust for a GEN6 looks to be pushing $3K. It's just stainless tubing that's been bent into shape and welded together. A CAI looks to be like $400+. I have an awesome JLT CAI on my L that cost well under $200. My LID/drop in K&N on my Fcar was maybe $120? About $700 for a good 102+ MM TB? It's just a block of aluminum machined to mount to a manifold with 4 bolts in a square pattern and a large hole in the center of them with a butterfly valve and maybe an electrical sensor mounted on it. Do the GEN5 LT motors see bigger gains from these mods then say your GEN4 LS motors? Then you'll probably need a $1300 manifold to run a l02+ MM TB. That's $2k right there. I mean what's a clutch or a STS cost for a new Camaro.

I know I'm ranting here, and I'm all for people/companies making their $. They're in business to make a profit, and these arent necessarily LS7 aftermarket part prices. Still I don't see why aftermarket parts for GEN6 Camaros should cost much if any more than they do for cars a generation or two back. I'm all for businesses making money, but I don't want to feel extorted either. Oddly enough more serious mods like a cam or head porting doesn't seems like it's gone up "TOO" much over your LS stuff. (maybe a little bit more) It seems to me to mainly apply to bolt ons from what I'm seeing.

Please tell me if you think I'm wrong. I'm not the bigger expert, but when I start looking for mods for this car I keep thinking, "wow that part cost a lot of money for this car.)
Well, you should be smart enough to buy stuff that will actually increase your power, and for that, you will pay some money, but it'll be worth it. Suckers will buy the K&N kits, the "cold air intakes", etc...

You gotta pay to play. Headers + full exhaust + a tune will give you some gains, not huge, since you are dealing with a NA engine. It takes some money to design those parts so they fit the same every time and materials that will be heat resistant as necessary.

I think you are wrong. Gains on a NA engine are very difficult. You can often get a 20-33% increase on a turbo engine by going exhaust(downpipe included) + tune, not in every case, but in many cases and it's usually a significant increase. NA engines work differently and it's not possible to cram more fuel and air into the cylinder because there's nothing "pushing it" that you can tell to push harder.

Quality stuff costs money, whether it's a corvette, a camaro or a BMW.
__________________
Everything happens for a reason, except when it doesn't, but even then, you can, in hindsight, fabricate a reason that satisfies your belief system.
JamesNoBrakes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2019, 07:37 AM   #8
nasbagoat
 
Drives: 17 SW 1LE
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: ROCKVILLE MD
Posts: 257
Also mods are always more expensive on current generation cars, as the cars age they will get cheaper usually. At least that have been my experience.
nasbagoat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2019, 10:38 AM   #9
s346k

 
s346k's Avatar
 
Drives: 18 1SS 1LE
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: indiana
Posts: 1,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by nasbagoat View Post
Also mods are always more expensive on current generation cars, as the cars age they will get cheaper usually. At least that have been my experience.
this. gen v is still the latest engine. aftermarket parts will be expensive for another 15 years.
__________________
2016+ camaro: everyone’s first car
s346k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2019, 11:10 PM   #10
beedo
 
Drives: 18 2SS 1LE NFG
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Mansfield
Posts: 107
JROC
Where do you work man, I am a toolmaker as well at lockheed Martin. Most people think we make wrenches lol
beedo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2019, 11:33 AM   #11
USAFS197

 
USAFS197's Avatar
 
Drives: 2019 Corvette Z06
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Navarre, Florida
Posts: 1,691
Generally speaking, stuff is just more expensive as a whole. Right now I’m getting a pretty unsettling taste of that Corvette tax. If you really wanted to spend some money, a 2” ARH long tube setup and full Akrapovic exhaust system will crest north of $8,000 without cats and uncoated. Blows my mind.

But the sentiment about quality is true. However, I find it utterly audacious that a company can charge as much money as they do for a damn muffler delete on these cars, 6th Gen or C7. That’s just absurd.
__________________
2019 Corvette Z06 3LZ 630whp, 701wtq: Halltech CAI, Corsa Double X-Pipe, AWE Touring Axle Back, LMP LT4 Lid, Pray 93 tune. DSC Sport V4 Controller (street/track alignment), fully lowered on stock bolts, BC Forged EH172's w/ Toyo R888R's.
USAFS197 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2019, 12:07 PM   #12
Matos1LE
 
Drives: SS 1LE
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Miami
Posts: 285
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFS197 View Post
Generally speaking, stuff is just more expensive as a whole. Right now I’m getting a pretty unsettling taste of that Corvette tax. If you really wanted to spend some money, a 2” ARH long tube setup and full Akrapovic exhaust system will crest north of $8,000 without cats and uncoated. Blows my mind.

But the sentiment about quality is true. However, I find it utterly audacious that a company can charge as much money as they do for a damn muffler delete on these cars, 6th Gen or C7. That’s just absurd.
The Akrapovic alone is like $6k! I would have to have it though lol. I have wanted one on a car forever, although I would definitely try to get a used one.
Matos1LE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2019, 12:00 PM   #13
JROC
Account Suspended
 
Drives: 19 Camaro SS 1LE, 03 Ford Lightning
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by beedo View Post
JROC
Where do you work man, I am a toolmaker as well at lockheed Martin. Most people think we make wrenches lol
Good deal. I'm sure Lockheed Martin is a pretty desirable tool maker job to have. Right now I work for a company called REI Automation. I started out as a die builder for about 9 years, and have been in the trade since 04.

Yeah I try to remember to tell people not in the trade that I'm a machinist instead of a tool maker. They really were like WTH when I'd tell them I was a die builder. Lol
JROC is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Post Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:54 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.