02-05-2019, 12:43 PM | #29 | ||
Drives: 20 1LE 2SS M6 Rally Green Join Date: Mar 2014
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"the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.” Ronald Reagan - |
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02-05-2019, 01:08 PM | #30 |
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02-05-2019, 01:20 PM | #31 |
Drives: 2018 Camaro 1SS 1LE Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Front Range, CO
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The GT PP2 is an embarrassment to American cars. What a joke! When German car owners say American cars can only can set fast lap times because of oversized and inappropriate tires and the car's chassis and suspension has deficient engineering... this is the prime example of that. 305 square Cup2s on a car that can't even drive on a track without overheating, that's some ridiculous BS right there. PP2 makes me look down on Ford more than I already did.
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02-05-2019, 01:48 PM | #32 | |
Drives: 22' Porsche PDK GT4 Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Bay Area
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I do not buy into the German cars having the better Chassis and suspension though. I came out of a 16' M3 into my SS 1LE and the SS 1LE kills the M3 in all of those areas by a good margin. My M3's rear-end was all over the place and the rebound damping was a joke. The chassis could not even handle the stock power levels and thus they made the traction/stability controls on it SUPER conservative and would fight you all the way. I had to upgrade to Ohlin coilovers to get that car to feel confident and behave, and even then the traction was still lacking, even with extreme performance rated tires on it, and the stability control system was still a liability. Plus, I had a rough riding car now with the coilovers. Now, some German cars can do it right, my Audi TTRS was dialed in chassis and suspension wise, albeit with understeer, but it was well planted from the factory, but then again it also had MRC like the SS 1LE.
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22' Porsche PDK GT4 (MCS 2-way remote dampers) Previous: 18' NFG 2SS 1LE (ZL1 1LE solid rear cradle bushings & Corsa Exhaust) 16' F80 M3 (Ohlin R/T Coilovers) 13' Audi TTRS (APR Stage 1, MSS Springs) 09' C6 Z06 08' E90 M3 06' 335i (KW V2 Coilovers) 03' C5 Z06 |
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02-05-2019, 02:19 PM | #33 |
Drives: 1SS, A8, MRC, NPP, Blade Spoiler Join Date: Jun 2010
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Not to pile on but, don't forget these snippets from the main portion of the article (in regards to the PP2):
Rt. 198: "Thanks to the super-sticky Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 tires that come with the Performance Pack 2, the Mustang GT has a ton of mechanical grip. But it feels clumsier and less composed than the Chevy Camaro SS 1LE that impressed us so much in 2016. "It's hard to have a lot of confidence in this car," Mark Rechtin grimaces." Mazda Laguna Seca: "Although it's much happier on the smooth surface of Laguna Seca than on choppy Route 198, chassis balance is also an issue with the Ford Mustang GT, which Randy found oversteered to a fault on corner entry. The Performance Pack 2 is designed to get the Mustang GT on par with a 1LE-equipped Camaro SS, but the Racepak data reveals the brutal truth: Despite a 1:38.42 lap time that made it the second-quickest Mustang ever around Laguna Seca, it's still 0.65 second slower than the Chevy." |
02-05-2019, 02:24 PM | #34 | |
Drives: 1999 Camaro SS M6 - SBE LS1 Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Alberta, Canada
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LL isn't a good comparison - different year, different drivers, condition, etc. No I won't claim any SLE lap time over a PP2 until they meet face to face. I assume them to be very close in best overall lap time, with the PP2 then off to the pits for a cool down, while the SLE continues to lap. If that's a win in anyway, I would like to hear why newmoon.
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02-05-2019, 02:51 PM | #35 |
Drives: 2018 Camaro 1SS 1LE Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Front Range, CO
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Not vs the GM Alpha but the Ford GT PP2 is proof that those claims are true wrt the Mustang. It's an awkward and pathetic attempt to keep up with the SS 1LE and they would have been better off not trying to make the Mustang into something it's clearly not suited for.
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02-05-2019, 03:48 PM | #36 |
Drives: 2019 Corvette Grand Sport Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Chicago IL
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Car and Driver's review of the PP2 mentioned a similar comment to what Motor Trend mentioned; that even though it is very accomplished on the track they prefer the SS 1LE's handling dynamics more.
The PP2 reviews so far seem to be yet another indicator of the results of how much went into the development of the GT350's suspension/chassis to differentiate it from the other Mustangs as mostly everyone loves the way they drive. Yet it seems that all Camaro models get nothing but raves regarding its handling. |
02-05-2019, 04:48 PM | #37 | |
Drives: 2021 BMW M2 Competition Join Date: Oct 2008
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I cross-shopped the GT PP2 and 2SS 1LE, and obviously preferred the Chevy, but I gave the PP2 some serious consideration. It's not like it's light years behind the SS 1LE. They're probably pretty close in the hands of amateurs at track days - or do you think otherwise?
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2011 Candy Lime Green Kawasaki Z1000 (1/4 mile - 10.38 @ 129.61 mph - stock) ---------- Previous: 2018 Summit White 2SS 1LE; 2015 MINI Cooper F56 6MT; 2015 BMW M235i 6MT; 2003 MINI 5MT; 2005 Mustang GT 5MT |
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02-05-2019, 05:13 PM | #38 | |
Drives: 2018 Camaro 1SS 1LE Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Front Range, CO
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The car also overheats on track and Ford says it's not intended for track use. Yet it has Cup2 tires. Finally, all reports are stating the car doesn't handle well and isn't confidence inspiring at speed. Now, the cars may be evenly matched for a lap or 2 around a track but the tire life and overheating and handling issues make it a far larger difference than lap times might suggest. It just seems to me it was a total marketing stunt by Ford, and not a serious attempt to make a car that's actually good for their customers. |
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02-05-2019, 05:20 PM | #39 | |
Drives: 2019 GT350 Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: NC
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2013 Boss Mustang 2012 SRT Challenger 392 auto 12:40s 112 stock 2012 Ford Mustang 5.0. Brembo, 3:73s 2010 SS, LS3, Cammed, LTs, 12:20s 2004 Redfire Cobra, Pullied & Tuned 1986 GT, Ed Curtis 347ci, 11:20s motor. 10:30s 100-hp shot |
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02-05-2019, 05:36 PM | #40 | |
Drives: 2018 Camaro 1SS 1LE Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Front Range, CO
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On the coolers, Ford hobbled the car so it wouldn't get too close to the 350s, but in doing so they made the PP2 a total joke and a bad deal for anyone buying it. It's a marketing stunt done at the expense of their own customers. |
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02-05-2019, 06:54 PM | #41 | |
Drives: 2019 GT350 Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: NC
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2019 GT350 RR
2013 Boss Mustang 2012 SRT Challenger 392 auto 12:40s 112 stock 2012 Ford Mustang 5.0. Brembo, 3:73s 2010 SS, LS3, Cammed, LTs, 12:20s 2004 Redfire Cobra, Pullied & Tuned 1986 GT, Ed Curtis 347ci, 11:20s motor. 10:30s 100-hp shot |
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02-05-2019, 07:17 PM | #42 |
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Careful...somebody might wander over to Mustang6 and count Shelby listings.
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2017 CAMARO FIFTY SS CONVERTIBLE
A8 | MRC | NPP | Nav | HUD | GM Performance CAI | Tony Mamo LT1 V2 Ported TB | Kooks 1-7/8” LT Headers | FlexFuel Tune | Thinkware Q800 Pro front and rear dash cam | Charcoal Tint for Taillights and 3rd Brakelight | Orange and Carbon Fiber Bowties | 1LE Wheels in Gunmetal Gray | Carbon Fiber Interior Overlays | Novistretch bra and mirror covers | Tow hitch for bicycle rack | |
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