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Old 07-09-2024, 12:11 PM   #85
Katech_Mike

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZL1Atlanta View Post
Does anyone have a link to this testing done by Katech with a 38% lobe and +65’s?
We were able to make 1500+/1300+ on C16/E85 respectively. This was on our twin turbo LT5 dyno mule using a 38% lobe and +65 injectors.
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Old 07-09-2024, 12:20 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post
This is From Stanadyne web site, I noticed Katech stated up to 225 Bar of fuel pressure not sure why.


The Goliath pump increases fuel flow by an average range of 83 percent, compared to factory-installed stock GDI fuel pumps with 10 mm plunger bore size. Its 12-mm plunge bore size, compared to the standard 10 mm, provides up to 2.0 cc of fuel per revolution at a 6.0 mm stroke at up to 350 bar of fuel pressure. This specialty engineering pump can deliver up to 2.8 cc of fuel per revolution. This industry leading fuel flow is delivered at a custom 8 mm stroke without the plunger losing contact with the camshaft/lifter when the engine is operating at 6,000 to 6,600 rpm.
The Goliath itself is capable of over 250bar on the LT platform. The injectors that are currently available to the public will only operate at 220bar. If we advertise this pump as 250bar I can only imagine the calls I will have the field. If/when the injector technology allows for higher pressure we will raise what we rate it at.

Last edited by Katech_Mike; 07-09-2024 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 07-09-2024, 12:34 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katech_Mike View Post
The Goliath itself is capable of over 250bar on the LT platform. The injectors that are currently available to the public will only operate at 220bar. If we advertise this pump as 250bar I can only imagine the calls I will have the field. If/when the injector technology allows for high pressure we will raise what we rate it at.
Fair enough.
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Old 07-09-2024, 12:37 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by KingLT1 View Post
I don't see it gaining a bunch over the LPE but I hope I am wrong. I believe the issue on stock cam cars is the fuel lobe to drive the pump. I think this pump will do the same thing as the LPE with a stock fuel lobe.
I have no doubt that the Goliath will support more power than the current pump offering on the market even with an OEM fuel lobe. On a stock cam lobe ~5% gain over competitors pumps is what I would expect. This comes at a better price point, built to OEM standards, high pressure capability and plenty of room to grown in the future.
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Old 07-09-2024, 01:29 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katech_Mike View Post
We were able to make 1500+/1300+ on C16/E85 respectively. This was on our twin turbo LT5 dyno mule using a 38% lobe and +65 injectors.
Good info, thanks for sharing. Have you by any chance done a comparison with the LPE pump on that dyno mule?
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Old 07-09-2024, 01:42 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by ZL1Atlanta View Post
Good info, thanks for sharing. Have you by any chance done a comparison with the LPE pump on that dyno mule?
We did not test the LPE pump side by side with Goliath.
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Old 07-09-2024, 02:19 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katech_Mike View Post
We did not test the LPE pump side by side with Goliath.
I think that would be great info to have in marketing the pump, but I can understand why you might not want to publish a direct comparison. From my perspective, I am trying to decide if there is enough there to justify changing my LPE BB and +30 injectors. I am certainly an advocate for pushing DI as far as possible to maximize the power potential, but have lost some of the fire to take the “buy it and find out” approach I had for a few years with this car. Haha. I’m sure someone will do some max effort comparisons, so I’ll keep an eye out.
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Old 07-09-2024, 03:08 PM   #92
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I am wondering if I need a lash cap or any other alignment method for this pump in case I have +38% fuel lobe cam in my ZL1.

Mike, do you have any suggestion?
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Old 07-10-2024, 07:17 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by b1anc0 View Post
I am wondering if I need a lash cap or any other alignment method for this pump in case I have +38% fuel lobe cam in my ZL1.

Mike, do you have any suggestion?
There is no generic answer. You need to check the preload.
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Old 07-10-2024, 07:29 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by Megahurtz View Post
It may not gain anything over the LPE on the stock fuel lobe, but I figure why not test since it is two different cars with the same mods. Only difference would be the Goliath vs the LPE which I know isn't even a concern for Katech since that isn't where its expected to shine. But I know some people who are interested in this as a first step towards setting the car up for fuel. I personally prefer 100% DI over going with port or meth as options. Not that port is bad, it just cuts into the power a little and makes the engine bay a little more complicated. Some guys don't like this. And I'm not a fan of meth for fueling for obvious reasons.

BUT, the Goliath is supposed to have better stability and VE over the LPE BB so I'm hoping when I try to run higher pressures than the LPE, it is more stable. The LPE isn't happy above 2400 psi. The Goliath may be better or maybe its the same, but I'm curious. Plus it sets me up for plenty of fuel down the road when its gets heads and cam.

For the record, this is my own personal test and my own theories. Katech is not part of this and I paid for my pump. They have made NO individual claims to me about anything. They have only stated what they have already publicly released.

It's post #9 in this thread. There is more detail on the Instagram post if you go find that.
Is this why?:

I remembered watching that when it came out and was surprised it was that much. I'm sure the delta has something to do with how, relatively, burly that NA combination was, but the way I understood the theory seemed to make sense. I know one of the guys who's posts I watch intently for little trinkets of knowledge mentioned something, somewhat, contradictory to the moral of this video, and I was going to post the link for it in the thread to see what they thought of it, but I didn't want to come across as argumentative or a jerk or something. And maybe it's different for FI and who knows for how many other reasons, so I didn't, because I'm not going to bite the hand that feeds me...

Anyways - that was a surprising outcome. I know it was said in the years between LS3 and LT1 that adding DI to an LS3 could easily bring power out to around what the SAE-rating for the LT1 eventually became, and they were right. And - it seems like BTR showed that the percentage of PI will have a pretty direct correlation to the delta, so, for me, since I'm only running around 32% PI, it's not too bad. Getting some intake port cleaning is also a big win, to me, and I don't have a choice anyways. I have to be able to run OEM software so anything that requires tune changes (e.g. HPFP, DI Injectors, etc.) won't work for me. DI certainly seems the way to go if you can though. It's good to see more and more choices out there. I hear the Mustang guys have it tough for DI, too, from what A Flores says, after a certain HP level.
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Old 07-10-2024, 07:52 AM   #95
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That video is a reminder that DI is superior to PI. It doesn't have any new info in it but I think they made it as a reminder since Port Kits are starting to become common place.

I'm not knocking port at all. It is a viable solution. But I think with the Goliath pump solution and XDI 65's, you now how a real 100% DI solution that would cover the power level of 99% of the LT4 builds for street cars. And the cost would be about the same or slightly more than port if you consider all of the costs.
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Old 07-10-2024, 09:33 AM   #96
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We have tested it in house as well. We lost 30hp on a H/C LT1 simply by switching from DI to PI.

Direct injection is superior to port injection when it comes to power production.

The reason people switch to port is due to the cost of DI and limits of the injectors and pumps that are available to supply the needed fuel for larger power combinations.

We're actively trying to raise the power ceiling and lower the cost on DI only fuel systems by working with companies such as Stanadyne and XDI.
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Old 07-10-2024, 10:29 PM   #97
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Just the pressure stability alone helps alot over the LPE unit. Realistically most combo's will be 800-900 rwhp and this pump and XDI 30's should cover that on E85 easily. With the 3000-3200 pressure the 30's go a long way.
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Old 07-11-2024, 08:36 AM   #98
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30's won't handle 900whp on full E @ .84 lambda.
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