Dart 427 help

[57jettruck]

Hello everyone, needing some help from anyone willing to offer it with experience in the matter. An engine builder would be great as well. Here’s what’s going on. I finally am building the engine I want for my Camaro. I started with a Dart 427 SHP LS next iron short block from Thompson motorsports and now it’s time for the top end. I’m ordering Frankenstein M311 6 bolt heads with sever duty stainless intake valves and inconel exhaust valves. Cam specs are 240/246 .63 lift on a 116.5 lsa. Car will be on e85 triple pump setup and twin turbos. My questions are.

what head gaskets would you recommend? LSX?

What lifters? I’ve been looking at Johnson tie bar short travel lifters

Rockers?

Intake manifold? A team? Never heard of them but ran across some.

Thanks for any input

[Ashen L99]

Head gaskets: cometic
Lifters: Johnson 2110Rs or the link bars
Rockers: BTR or any other reputable brand
Intake manifold: highram from Holley. It’s been a proven intake that makes great power and can withstand a lot of boost.

[KW Baraka]

Head Gaskets: Cometic
Lifters: Johnson 2110Rs
Rockers: Texas Speed LS3 Roller Rockers
Intake manifold: Frankenstein Freakshow Intake

KW

[57jettruck]

Thanks for the input, I ordered the Cometic head gaskets and some stock ls3 rockers with trunnion upgrades. Any reason why the 2110 Johnson’s over the Johnson ST 2116 SLR lifters? That’s what I ordered as a recommendation from TSP. I’m going to reuse the stock ls3 intake for now as I have other things budgeted vs spending 4K on a Frankenstein billet intake.

[ICUP]

Why didn’t you just get the whole long block from Thompson?

[WVracer]

Just to make sure.. it is a hydraulic cam right? If so, it depends on what your RPM range is for lifter, and rocker selection. Also need to know spring pressures if you want to properly choose lifters

[57jettruck]

Originally Posted by ICUP

Why didn’t you just get the whole long block from Thompson?

Didn’t have all the coin at the time and was able to pickup the short block during a motor of the month deal.

[57jettruck]

Originally Posted by WVracer

Just to make sure.. it is a hydraulic cam right? If so, it depends on what your RPM range is for lifter, and rocker selection. Also need to know spring pressures if you want to properly choose lifters

Yes hydraulic, cam specs are 240/246 .630/.630 on 116.5 LSA. Springs pressures are 155 open 436 closed. Can you elaborate for me why this is so important? Thanks for not bashing just trying to learn.

[WVracer]

Originally Posted by 57jettruck

Yes hydraulic, cam specs are 240/246 .630/.630 on 116.5 LSA. Springs pressures are 155 open 436 closed. Can you elaborate for me why this is so important? Thanks for not bashing just trying to learn.

Just need to know if its hydraulic or solid as the lifter types are different for each. Secondly, lifters have rpm, lift, and spring pressure ratings. The stock LS7 lifters are only rated to 7000rpm or less. Johnson does not have any published ratings for their LS lifters online but I would call them to figure out if they have that information. Tick Performance says on their website that the ST2116s are only rated for 420# of open spring pressure which is a bit below what you currently have. They also do not recommend the ST2110s for more than .630" of lift which is right at the line of what you have. According to them neither of these lifters will be proper for your application. These might just be their recommendations and not the manufacturers specs so you would need to verify. You will need to also verify if your lifter bore as I'm not sure if the Dart block uses the standard bore

If their specs are right you would need something like the ST2126LSR lifters as they have the spring pressure, lift, and rpm capability.

[57jettruck]

Originally Posted by WVracer

Just need to know if its hydraulic or solid as the lifter types are different for each. Secondly, lifters have rpm, lift, and spring pressure ratings. The stock LS7 lifters are only rated to 7000rpm or less. Johnson does not have any published ratings for their LS lifters online but I would call them to figure out if they have that information. Tick Performance says on their website that the ST2116s are only rated for 420# of open spring pressure which is a bit below what you currently have. They also do not recommend the ST2110s for more than .630" of lift which is right at the line of what you have. According to them neither of these lifters will be proper for your application. These might just be their recommendations and not the manufacturers specs so you would need to verify. You will need to also verify if your lifter bore as I'm not sure if the Dart block uses the standard bore

If their specs are right you would need something like the ST2126LSR lifters as they have the spring pressure, lift, and rpm capability.

Wow! Good to know thanks for the info I’ll dig deeper into all of this. You would think when you talk to someone like TSP they would steer you right when you tell them your plans for the engine. I’m sure they either didn’t ask the right questions or I didnt give all the pertinent info. Thanks again for the help!

[57jettruck]

It is a hydraulic cam though.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by WVracer

Just need to know if its hydraulic or solid as the lifter types are different for each. Secondly, lifters have rpm, lift, and spring pressure ratings. The stock LS7 lifters are only rated to 7000rpm or less. Johnson does not have any published ratings for their LS lifters online but I would call them to figure out if they have that information. Tick Performance says on their website that the ST2116s are only rated for 420# of open spring pressure which is a bit below what you currently have. They also do not recommend the ST2110s for more than .630" of lift which is right at the line of what you have. According to them neither of these lifters will be proper for your application. These might just be their recommendations and not the manufacturers specs so you would need to verify. You will need to also verify if your lifter bore as I'm not sure if the Dart block uses the standard bore

If their specs are right you would need something like the ST2126LSR lifters as they have the spring pressure, lift, and rpm capability.

LS7 lifters - yea, I would only run those for a 7000rpm deal. The Johnson recommendations they give are extremely, extremely conservative. The 2110, 2110R, 2116LSR, we've run all of those to over 8000rpm and over 500# open with excellent results. As far as the lift, that doesn't really add up either - is it a 1.7 or a 1.8 rocker? Again, we've seen a lot more than .630" lift with all of the above mentioned Johnson lifters, and again, not a problem. I have ST2116LSR's in my personal car, .650" lift, 500# open, 7700+rpm, all no worries.

I think you need to make sure you figure out what the weight of those severe duty valves are - as I recall those suckers are HEAVY and you're going to need quite a bit of valve-spring if you want to see some serious RPM. The cam in a 427 is really not all that aggressive, so maybe you really don't need to see much over 7000rpm to get most of the good out of that. Intake choice really depends on what you want to do with the cowl and hood. Stock stuff and maybe a BTR Trinity fit under the stock hood - the Hi-ram is kind of the standard option for more power if you're willing to cut stuff up.

[57jettruck]

Originally Posted by acammer

LS7 lifters - yea, I would only run those for a 7000rpm deal. The Johnson recommendations they give are extremely, extremely conservative. The 2110, 2110R, 2116LSR, we've run all of those to over 8000rpm and over 500# open with excellent results. As far as the lift, that doesn't really add up either - is it a 1.7 or a 1.8 rocker? Again, we've seen a lot more than .630" lift with all of the above mentioned Johnson lifters, and again, not a problem. I have ST2116LSR's in my personal car, .650" lift, 500# open, 7700+rpm, all no worries.

I think you need to make sure you figure out what the weight of those severe duty valves are - as I recall those suckers are HEAVY and you're going to need quite a bit of valve-spring if you want to see some serious RPM. The cam in a 427 is really not all that aggressive, so maybe you really don't need to see much over 7000rpm to get most of the good out of that. Intake choice really depends on what you want to do with the cowl and hood. Stock stuff and maybe a BTR Trinity fit under the stock hood - the Hi-ram is kind of the standard option for more power if you're willing to cut stuff up.

Thanks I actually just got off the phone with Joe at Johnson lifters and he said that these lifters are good to go for my application. The info on the tick performance site is wrong apparently. He said the lifters are good for 185 seat pressure and 535 on the nose. Good for over .700 lift and 8000+rpm.

Springs are pac 700 springs on the heads

[KnoxSS1LE]

Everyone else has you taken care of on everything but intake. Look into the LOD intake manifold! Out performed the high rise intake and fits under hood and even factory tower brace. I have 1 on my car with Frankenstein heads and I am extremely happy with the results. And man those Frankenstein heads are sexy. Wait till you see the porting job!!!