[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

I have personally witnessed both. Is it the norm, no...but my point was...there is more at play. I can tell a child that 2+2=4, but unless I explain why...they won't learn anything.

So you "witnessed" the same car bog at launch, (not spin at all) lose power, lose momentum, fully recover, run a worse ET, yet trap higher than what this same car traps when it runs its best ET's?

[Fraxum]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

Crappy tires have a lot to do with that, however...the IRS does as well.



When the s550 upgraded to the IRS, it took on all of the negatives associated with it. The s197s solid axle was far superior with launches. The S550 has a much better overall suspension. There is nothing crappy about it. The s197 was a better dragstrip car, the s550 is better everywhere else.

Rule of thumb is, .1 reduction in the 60' equals .2 in the 1/4 mile. Running on stock tires seems to be very difficult for many to get the 60' down. Those that have, have been rewarded with high-mid 12's in the 1/4.
Every S550 with a drag radials and control arm upgrade should be running mid 12's period. If they can't, it's all on the driver.

Agreed the S550 is not crappy in any way. My friend's 100% Stock 2015 S550 GT auto ran a few 12.4s and a bunch of low 12.5s. So the auto GTs (with the driver mod) run neck and neck with the new M6 SS also with the driver mod. So some drivers are okay with IRS. He bolted on a paxton, injectors, DRs, and a tune with zero suspension mods on his GT and went 10.6@ 132 in crappy air.

But as discussed here the Mustang GT chassis and dynamics cannot run with either the 5th or 6th gen Camaro excluding the standard 5th gen SS on a track with curves. This may all come down to a superior chassis. Even the GT350R with all the changes could not quite match the Z/28 here although that may depend on the track.

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Fraxum

Agreed the S550 is not crappy in any way. My friend's 100% Stock 2015 S550 GT auto ran a few 12.4s and a bunch of low 12.5s. So the auto GTs (with the driver mod) run neck and neck with the new M6 SS also with the driver mod.

So your friend has an auto GT that would be number one on their fast list? Why isn't it then? Heck, if I recall that would be number one on the stock S197 fast list as well, which I personally spent time on. I don't know, my gut says that car has a tune. Easy to hide, and no way to know for sure. Not calling you a lier, as you might not know the actual deal with the car, but personally, I don't belive the bone stock 12.4 ET.

The HUGE thing you are forgetting here is you are comparing a supposed freak/hero/best ET to an average time. That is far from apples to apples, or the norm. Auto Mustangs don't need a driver mod, especially at Acto. Fact is 90% of stock auto GT's are around a 13.00 car, maybe a 12.90 car. While 90% of manual 6th gen SS's driven by even average drivers are 12.40/50 cars. I spend lots of time at the track, there are a good six or seven stock auto GT's in my club (one owned by someone who races as a career) and only two of them have broken into the 12's. Heck, I made a few passes in my good friends bone stock manual SS with only 1300 miles on it, not even power shifting I ran a 12.55 and then a 12.41 in 2500 DA. That's a easy 12.30 car in better air without even trying.

If we are talking averages, with good drivers, a manual 6th gen SS has on average a good .4-.5 second advantage on an automatic GT. That's not speculation, but fact, and a pretty big difference.

Heck, even look at the magazine times which in some cases are same track and driver.
Auto GT tested twice that I recall, 13.0 and 13.1.
Manual SS tested a lot. 12.3, 12.3, 12.4, 12.4, 12.4.
Not even close.

Not looking for a pissing match with you, as I respect and agree with your posts usually. But in this case, I can't...lol.

[6spdhyperblue]

Dude there are like 20 threads on this guys 12.4 run. It's all they want to talk about. I don't even understand what this thread has anything to do with a mustang GT. We should be talking about the M4 and carrera

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Nicul15

Dude there are like 20 threads on this guys 12.4 run. It's all they want to talk about. I don't even understand what this thread has anything to do with a mustang GT. We should be talking about the M4 and carrera

Haha, you're right. But I just found it so unbelievable I couldn't resist...

[b4z]

I think people who buy the V6 will want a little more tq off the corners. The 3.6l is not known for having much below 3500 rpms. And since the 3.6l is not that much lighter than the 6.2l, where it counts(over the front end) I don't see thaT it will have much appeal.
I do like that the 1 le will have Mrc. I think that will improve the ride quality over the 5 th gen 1 le.

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by b4z

I think people who buy the V6 will want a little more tq off the corners. The 3.6l is not known for having much below 3500 rpms. And since the 3.6l is not that much lighter than the 6.2l, where it counts(over the front end) I don't see thaT it will have much appeal.
I do like that the 1 le will have Mrc. I think that will improve the ride quality over the 5 th gen 1 le.

MRC ride quality is fantastic in the cars I've driven with it.

[mcsoul]

Originally Posted by SS 1LE

Wheel spin.

A car may have a higher trap speed with a slower ET due to wheel spin. Wheel speed will be higher due to that. Also why sometimes when you get a sticky tire, you may go quicker ET wise, but lose a mph or so due to the increased traction.

I think low trap speed and good low ET's are usually related to hooking well with a light car that has a decent power to weight ratio but not a heck of a lot of power, then very poor aerodynamics take over past the 1/8th and make the car even harder to push.

[Fraxum]

Originally Posted by SS 1LE

So your friend has an auto GT that would be number one on their fast list? Why isn't it then? Heck, if I recall that would be number one on the stock S197 fast list as well, which I personally spent time on. I don't know, my gut says that car has a tune. Easy to hide, and no way to know for sure. Not calling you a lier, as you might not know the actual deal with the car, but personally, I don't belive the bone stock 12.4 ET.

The HUGE thing you are forgetting here is you are comparing a supposed freak/hero/best ET to an average time. That is far from apples to apples, or the norm. Auto Mustangs don't need a driver mod, especially at Acto. Fact is 90% of stock auto GT's are around a 13.00 car, maybe a 12.90 car. While 90% of manual 6th gen SS's driven by even average drivers are 12.40/50 cars. I spend lots of time at the track, there are a good six or seven stock auto GT's in my club (one owned by someone who races as a career) and only two of them have broken into the 12's. Heck, I made a few passes in my good friends bone stock manual SS with only 1300 miles on it, not even power shifting I ran a 12.55 and then a 12.41 in 2500 DA. That's a easy 12.30 car in better air without even trying.

If we are talking averages, with good drivers, a manual 6th gen SS has on average a good .4-.5 second advantage on an automatic GT. That's not speculation, but fact, and a pretty big difference.

Heck, even look at the magazine times which in some cases are same track and driver.
Auto GT tested twice that I recall, 13.0 and 13.1.
Manual SS tested a lot. 12.3, 12.3, 12.4, 12.4, 12.4.
Not even close.

Not looking for a pissing match with you, as I respect and agree with your posts usually. But in this case, I can't...lol.

No pissing match. We can always disagree. It's not that it is common as you say. But the guy, Pat, is over 70 I think and does not ever get on the Internet. He had a 2013 base auto GT, and a 2015 auto GT. He ran 12.4s in both. The S550 is a little heavier but has a little more power. And this is in good air at Atco which is one of the faster tracks. He also has a 2017 base GT auto on order so we will see if he can go 3 for 3 with stock GTs to run in the 12.4s this fall. There are others on here who know Pat and have seen him run. So the stock auto Mustang is capable of a 12.4. And while 13 second Mustang GTs are common anyone who gets enough seat time in any transmisson Coyote is in the 12s. CA6 M6 SSes are in the same boat but are easier to get into the 12s. CA6 SS autos are easy 12s for most anyone.

So if we understand we cannot directly compare track times on a different day, let alone different drivers in a different year, the variables of track condition, air density, and driver variation can give us only a rough comparison.

We can only really directly compare the cars run on the same day with the same drivers. But looking at the entire list we can say The Chevys are kicking some butt in the C&D Lightning lap. And we can also say you need to buy the most expensive Mustang to keep up with or beat the fastest CA6 Camaros so far. How much was the cheapest GT350R ever sold?

While the SS 1LE is eye opening fast and very cool to me, the real winner is the LT 1LE. It is light and balanced and affordable for many people. A car that runs in the 13s is still a fast fun car lest we forget. And I also think the SS may be a bit too fast for many to handle and I wonder how many SS 1LEs will ever see 8 10ths on a race track?

[SpeedIsLife]

The cheapest GT350R I've seen was only MSRP...most go with about 10K ADM

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by Fraxum

No pissing match. We can always disagree. It's not that it is common as you say. But the guy, Pat, is over 70 I think and does not ever get on the Internet. He had a 2013 base auto GT, and a 2015 auto GT. He ran 12.4s in both. The S550 is a little heavier but has a little more power. And this is in good air at Atco which is one of the faster tracks. He also has a 2017 base GT auto on order so we will see if he can go 3 for 3 with stock GTs to run in the 12.4s this fall. There are others on here who know Pat and have seen him run. So the stock auto Mustang is capable of a 12.4. And while 13 second Mustang GTs are common anyone who gets enough seat time in any transmisson Coyote is in the 12s. CA6 M6 SSes are in the same boat but are easier to get into the 12s. CA6 SS autos are easy 12s for most anyone.

So if we understand we cannot directly compare track times on a different day, let alone different drivers in a different year, the variables of track condition, air density, and driver variation can give us only a rough comparison.

We can only really directly compare the cars run on the same day with the same drivers. But looking at the entire list we can say The Chevys are kicking some butt in the C&D Lightning lap. And we can also say you need to buy the most expensive Mustang to keep up with or beat the fastest CA6 Camaros so far. How much was the cheapest GT350R ever sold?

While the SS 1LE is eye opening fast and very cool to me, the real winner is the LT 1LE. It is light and balanced and affordable for many people. A car that runs in the 13s is still a fast fun car lest we forget. And I also think the SS may be a bit too fast for many to handle and I wonder how many SS 1LEs will ever see 8 10ths on a race track?

Was there any proof of this? considering ho long this car has been out, you would think there would be some video.

[6spdhyperblue]

Originally Posted by 13vertss/r's

Was there any proof of this? considering ho long this car has been out, you would think there would be some video.

seriously can u do this in the other 20 threads. theres one in the 1/4 mile section. dont troll this one up now too

[toytruckman]

So I just got my C&D and read the article. The C&D editors drive the cars? What do they do take the fastest time from who ever? So yes I guess they all can drive some what fast but no real race car driver?....

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by Nicul15

seriously can u do this in the other 20 threads. theres one in the 1/4 mile section. dont troll this one up now too

I looked and what I saw is he had a catback and nitto tires with best time if 12.46. So how is this stock? so where is this stock 12.4 car I keep hearing about?

This is his quote.

Finally made it to a 1/4 mile track yesterday. DA very good -259 according to dragtimes calculator. Got one good run in before track started to suck.

Car is Base Auto 3.15gear with SVE 19x9.5 Drifts on 4 corners. 275/35-19 Nitto Invos. Stainless works h-pipe catback. Car still has stock tune, and airbox/filter etc.