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Old 11-30-2018, 05:28 AM   #1
USAFS197

 
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Straight line traction

So, this isn’t a drag racing question, per se. But, I’m wondering what, if anything, have some of you done to help address your straight line traction. I am full bolt on and tuned by Pray. I had him remove any and all torque tables and just let the engine do what it inherently wants to do. Therein, my tip-in throttle response and low end torque are...interesting. If I even give my right pedal a sideways glance, I’m spinning. If I do a no-lift-shift from first to second, it’s either a violent fishtail or I need to let off of the throttle immediately. No-lift-shift into third is a guaranteed wiggle from the back end and at times, it’ll chirp the tires into 4th.

I assume that many of you are likely pushing significantly more power than myself. Granted, I could have much more right foot modulation but, while fighting traction, the car accelerates similar to a stock vehicle. Once it grabs, however, it hustles pretty good. Perhaps some bushings or different control arms are in order but, I don’t want to change tires to a more track oriented once since this is my daily when I’m in the states. Right now, it feels as though the car is all bark and no bite, largely due to the spinning. My tires still look great (4900 miles street driven) and don’t show much sign of wear. I don’t necessarily perform shifts of that nature on the regular but, as I was data logging for Pray, I had to and therein, brought up this concern.
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Old 11-30-2018, 05:39 AM   #2
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did you get a dyno on that combo?
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Old 11-30-2018, 06:18 AM   #3
Vtor_ZL1
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Better tires ?
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ing for grip.


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Old 11-30-2018, 10:00 AM   #4
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You said no tires but you need tires. The Mickey Thompson dr’s might be a little extreme on a daily for some. I know lots of people that daily drive the nitro dr’s
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Old 11-30-2018, 10:12 AM   #5
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I'm completely stock and notice that I leave marks behind when flooring it in 1st or 2nd and NLS 1-2 and 2-3. It certainly doesn't fishtail but the black marks are very noticeable from the mirror. Also with traction control on, it will kick in hard when NLS 1-2 and sometimes slightly when NLS 2-3.
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Old 11-30-2018, 12:15 PM   #6
USAFS197

 
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I'll try to address the questions posed;

I made 475whp on a crappy Dynocom AWD dyno. It reads pretty low compared to Dynojets.

I don't want to sacrifice my cornering prowess so, I don't think drag radials would be a good look.

When I was stock, NLS would do similar stuff that you are mentioning but, it's a lot worse now.

I'm really hoping that a better tire that is also good around corners may do the trick or, some additional suspension components.
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2018 Audi TT RS
2.4X 0-60, 1.6X 60', 120+mph 1/8th, 4.XX 60-130, 150+mph traps on 255/35/18 R888R tires on the street (unprepped).
2019 Audi RS3
About as fast as the TT RS
2019 Camaro ZL1 1LE
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2018 Camaro SS 1LE
Sold
2019 Corvette Z06
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2021 Charger Hellcat Redeye Widebody
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Old 11-30-2018, 08:43 PM   #7
jwcassidy1969
 
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I am at 590 whp and as long as the tires are warm the Goodyear’s hold really well. On a colder day it can take them a while to heat up. I think once you get them to spin it’s over and they will keep spinning, you just have to try and not hit that point. Even with tune I don’t think you can override the traction nannies on these cars. You still have to push and hold the button down to deactivate.
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Old 11-30-2018, 09:30 PM   #8
Gasoline_Farts
 
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Throttle control. These cars are insanely powerful and you simply can’t drive them flat out like you would with a 200hp car. It reminds me of the iRacing simulator. The gt3 cup Porsche has 485hp and weighs 1000lbs less then our cars. You can floor it sometimes but in tight corners you need to roll onto the throttle or the rear will come around on you. Takes lots of practice. This is why it’s often best advice to learn to drive a slow car fast, and then drive a fast car.
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Old 11-30-2018, 09:34 PM   #9
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If your 1LE hasn’t had the tires leveled out that’ll help with straight line traction
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Old 12-01-2018, 12:17 AM   #10
USAFS197

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwcassidy1969 View Post
I am at 590 whp and as long as the tires are warm the Goodyear’s hold really well. On a colder day it can take them a while to heat up. I think once you get them to spin it’s over and they will keep spinning, you just have to try and not hit that point. Even with tune I don’t think you can override the traction nannies on these cars. You still have to push and hold the button down to deactivate.
I tend to run the car exclusively in Sport/Competitive Mode. When I get back to the states, I’ll try to run it a bit aggressively in just sport mode. I don’t flog my car that often but, it seems that there may be some misinterpretation by a few here that right foot modulation is all that’s required. I sometimes wonder if I do not convey my questioning and explanations specifically enough. I could modulate my right foot all I want but at that rate, I am rolling as slow if not slower than most stock SS’s until I can lay on the throttle. I don’t care too much about my straight line speed but, when exiting a turn and utilizing NLS, that fishtail/wiggle is unsettling at the wrong time. If the solution is just “learn to drive”, then I’ll just seek out my own solution to this issue.
__________________
2018 Audi TT RS
2.4X 0-60, 1.6X 60', 120+mph 1/8th, 4.XX 60-130, 150+mph traps on 255/35/18 R888R tires on the street (unprepped).
2019 Audi RS3
About as fast as the TT RS
2019 Camaro ZL1 1LE
Sold
2018 Camaro SS 1LE
Sold
2019 Corvette Z06
Sold
2021 Charger Hellcat Redeye Widebody
Sold
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Old 12-01-2018, 07:35 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFS197 View Post
I tend to run the car exclusively in Sport/Competitive Mode. When I get back to the states, I’ll try to run it a bit aggressively in just sport mode. I don’t flog my car that often but, it seems that there may be some misinterpretation by a few here that right foot modulation is all that’s required. I sometimes wonder if I do not convey my questioning and explanations specifically enough. I could modulate my right foot all I want but at that rate, I am rolling as slow if not slower than most stock SS’s until I can lay on the throttle. I don’t care too much about my straight line speed but, when exiting a turn and utilizing NLS, that fishtail/wiggle is unsettling at the wrong time. If the solution is just “learn to drive”, then I’ll just seek out my own solution to this issue.
I thought the oem tune was pretty damn good for the purposes of traction. Maybe you should go back to the stock settings for torque management, throttle, and possibly shifting.

Maybe look into diy tuning. That is a downside of having someone else tune your car, you can’t sit there and perfect it with small tuning adjustments.
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Old 12-01-2018, 08:09 AM   #12
Gasoline_Farts
 
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Watch high horsepower V8s exit corners. NASCAR @ Sonoma is a great example. You can’t expect to make more power than a mclaren f1 AND be able to floor it out of corners without traction issues. The fastest lap times are achieved when the driver is on the very limit of grip. Your car should just be sliding a tiny bit. Also NLS in a manual is bound to upset traction further.

Of you weren’t across the country I’d let you try my simulator with VR and any V8 you’d like. You need to be gentle and smooth and roll into the throttle.

Edit: only remedies that come to mind are a) increase chassis rigidity (solid subframe bushings, spherical rod ends.. race car stuff that will ruin daily driving and NVH)
B) downforce. A proper rear diffuser and wing can increase traction, however it needs to be balanced, add in the rear and you’ll increase understeer

Last edited by Gasoline_Farts; 12-01-2018 at 09:02 AM.
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Old 12-01-2018, 10:30 AM   #13
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I tried to get my camber set more positive, but no one was able to get it past -.9 degrees, I wanted to get as close to zero as possible.

I think the traction situation is a lot more dynamic than you realize. So its not so much about how much static weight transfer, contact patch, and friction coefficient you can get, but more about taking dynamic movement out of the unsprung mass.

So kind of explains why people replace the rubber bushings with solid, stiffer pieces, since this keeps the less stiff, lower frequency components from resonating with the lower frequency dynamic movement of the wheels caused by bumps in the road.

But at the same time, when you move to more stiff components, you then resonate with the smaller stuff in the road, which dosent effect dynamic movement of the wheels but rather noise.

Quoting from Wikipedia:

"A beneficial effect of unsprung mass is that high frequency road irregularities, such as the gravel in an asphalt or concrete road surface, are isolated from the body more completely because the tires and springs act as separate filter stages, with the unsprung mass tending to uncouple them. Likewise, sound and vibration isolation is improved (at the expense of handling), in production automobiles, by the use of rubber bushings between the frame and suspension, by any flexibility in the frame or body work, and by the flexibility of the seats."
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Old 12-01-2018, 11:41 AM   #14
Nabush
 
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Your issue is that your tires are cold. Build some heat in them and you won't spin. Cold, these tires have limited grip, at temperature grip is very good, straight are cornering.
Even without heating the tires, difference between 90-100F weather and 45-50F is enormous.


And it takes time and corners to heat the tires correctly, which in flat states like Florida can be pretty challenging...though it works also by doing several acceleration/hard braking runs...

So if you want to keep a racing compound, you have no choice than heating your tires. My GrandSport has similar mods (AFE,TB,MSD mani,ARH headers,tune) and 335 pscup2 and it grips starting 55F and little heat in the tires.(in 2nd gear, I don't play with first, $1000 rear set is a good reason not to burn them). Of course way better at 90F and few miles of roadcourse or mountain road...
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