[Gen6_1Le]

Originally Posted by oldman

And even superman can't shift as fast as a DCT... nuff said.

A DCT can’t predict the turn a head , it’s not always about how fast you can shift, there is more to it then that.

[oldman]

still can manually sift it WAY WAY WAY WAY faster than an M6,, so try again.

[Gen6_1Le]

Originally Posted by oldman

still can manually sift it WAY WAY WAY WAY faster than an M6,, so try again.

Shift denied

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by oldman

And even superman can't shift as fast as a DCT... nuff said.

I get that for you, fast shifting sits among the very top measures of automotive performance perfection. Fine, so long as you truly understand that it doesn't matter nearly that much to everybody. I think it's overrated in any driving that's not 10/10ths/WOT racing. Way overrated for anybody's street driving.

Maybe instead of sticking with generalities I'll run a comparative simulation with only shift time differences between maybe 400 ms for the conventional 3-pedal car and 100 ms for the DCT-equipped one. I may or may not throw a little extra weight on the DCT car, roughly based on the weight difference between Tremec's Magnum XL and their 9007 DCT.


DCTs have some reputation for being a bit clunky in part-throttle driving . . . do you suppose that maybe there's a tendency for them to shift too fast for those easy-driving conditions?


Norm

[90503]

Originally Posted by shaffe

Take rate for M7 in the C7 dropped to 15% last year, according to Tadge

Heard that as well....Never heard them say a manual couldn't be made for the C8, just that the take rate was so low, they decided not to make one.

If the take rate is so low on manuals in Vettes why didn't they stop making them several years ago? Why is it only used as a rationale now? If a manual can be made for the C8 they should go ahead and offer it, even if it is an expensive option and a low take rate. If the desire is there, they should sell at the low take rate as usual. At least the automatic now gets standard status as opposed to being the more expensive option...lol..

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by 90503

Heard that as well....Never heard them say a manual couldn't be made for the C8, just that the take rate was so low, they decided not to make one.

If the take rate is so low on manuals in Vettes why didn't they stop making them several years ago? Why is it only used as a rationale now? If a manual can be made for the C8 they should go ahead and offer it, even if it is an expensive option and a low take rate. If the desire is there, they should sell at the low take rate as usual. At least the automatic now gets standard status as opposed to being the more expensive option...lol..

Maybe they wanted a clean break from the previous generations. Who knows it may be the best move they could have made, but I don't track my cars, so they lost me until they either put in a MT, or I win the lottery and want one of every type sports car just because I can.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

I get that for you, fast shifting sits among the very top measures of automotive performance perfection. Fine, so long as you truly understand that it doesn't matter nearly that much to everybody. I think it's overrated in any driving that's not 10/10ths/WOT racing. Way overrated for anybody's street driving.

Norm

Really, you mean a performance car really performs only when driven for performance?? No kidding?

Yes it does not really matter that much, unless you are into performance cars. 1 second or more off the SS time 0 to 60 is a lifetime in the performance world. Now it can be reachable by mortals. This is not some smoke and mirrors Euro exotica, it is a Chevy. It is a game changer.

[redcoats1976]

after reading the new car and driver it is thought that not needing a hole for the shifter to go through allows the backbone of the car to be stiffer,which in turn does away with the wide door sills found on many midengine exotics.sounds reasonable enough.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by Gen6_1Le

Shift denied

Are you saying that a DCT can't be manually shifted before the turn???? Of course, it can and at a far far faster speed. I not only can replace, but I need to replace my Type R's twin carbon synchros every year or so. So please don't pretend there is not a HUGE wear penalty for performance driving a manual. Also please I have the SAME trans as you, it ain't exactly the easiest shifting trans.... not putting the trans down, as obviously the m6 is a stout piece. It just not a fast-shifting trans.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by 90503

Heard that as well....Never heard them say a manual couldn't be made for the C8, just that the take rate was so low, they decided not to make one.

If the take rate is so low on manuals in Vettes why didn't they stop making them several years ago? Why is it only used as a rationale now? If a manual can be made for the C8 they should go ahead and offer it, even if it is an expensive option and a low take rate. If the desire is there, they should sell at the low take rate as usual. At least the automatic now gets standard status as opposed to being the more expensive option...lol..

I think the way Tadge worded it was it was dropping every year since the C7 came out and last year was the lowest take rate for it and they didn't want/couldn't findsomeone willing to develop it for such a low take rate- His words paraphrased

Originally Posted by redcoats1976

after reading the new car and driver it is thought that not needing a hole for the shifter to go through allows the backbone of the car to be stiffer,which in turn does away with the wide door sills found on many midengine exotics.sounds reasonable enough.

There was also this ^

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by oldman

Really, you mean a performance car really performs only when driven for performance?? No kidding?

Yes it does not really matter that much, unless you are into performance cars. 1 second or more off the SS time 0 to 60 is a lifetime in the performance world.

Actually, I am into performance cars. Have been for most of my adult life.

Just that drag racing and any feeling that I have to beat the guy in the next lane when the light turns green or else "lose face" have never been part of that.

Far as I'm concerned, 0 to 60 time is one of the least valuable metrics - any given car will either feel at least "quick enough" for the situation at hand or it won't, and its acceleration capability need not be pinned down any closer than that. Just so you know, I've driven cars that were considerably quicker, straight line acceleration-wise, than any of the cars I currently own.


Norm

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by redcoats1976

after reading the new car and driver it is thought that not needing a hole for the shifter to go through allows the backbone of the car to be stiffer,which in turn does away with the wide door sills found on many midengine exotics.sounds reasonable enough.

Probably true. Structurally it's not all that difficult to compensate for strength lost to a hole, but to fully compensate for lost stiffness (torsional in particular) is a whole 'nother thing.

I can also see the length of a MT shift linkage and the likely tortuous path available for it perhaps defying easy solution. But did they even try?


Norm

[oldman]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

Actually, I am into performance cars. Have been for most of my adult life.

Just that drag racing and any feeling that I have to beat the guy in the next lane when the light turns green or else "lose face" have never been part of that.

Far as I'm concerned, 0 to 60 time is one of the least valuable metrics - any given car will either feel at least "quick enough" for the situation at hand or it won't, and its acceleration capability need not be pinned down any closer than that. Just so you know, I've driven cars that were considerably quicker, straight line acceleration-wise, than any of the cars I currently own.


Norm

SoYou like performance cars, but NOT 1/4 mile, not 0 -60, not street fights, obviously not any road race,... only ones alone where you can shift.... got it. The c8 is not for you. Pintos came with manuals ya know...

[lt4camaro]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

Actually, I am into performance cars. Have been for most of my adult life.

Just that drag racing and any feeling that I have to beat the guy in the next lane when the light turns green or else "lose face" have never been part of that.

Far as I'm concerned, 0 to 60 time is one of the least valuable metrics - any given car will either feel at least "quick enough" for the situation at hand or it won't, and its acceleration capability need not be pinned down any closer than that. Just so you know, I've driven cars that were considerably quicker, straight line acceleration-wise, than any of the cars I currently own.


Norm

Wow, 0-60 a very important part of performance cars... what else is there. Oh yeah, your driving a mustang, no 0-60 thrills there and you like that...