07-09-2019, 12:50 PM | #1 |
Drives: 2020 LT1 M6 Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: South, the DEEP south
Posts: 1,114
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T4 exhaust manifold
I realize the aftermarket is not as abundant for the 2.0t canaro as other models, but I am suprised not seeing ANY vendors trying to build an exhaust manifold with a t4 housing. Seems like an excellent opportunity to bypass these ridiculously overpriced tiny turbos available for the factory exhaust manifold. I think a decent t4 exhaust manifold would sell well enough. A nice size t4 turbo could be had for $500ish compared to $1,xxx-$2xxx for a slightly bigger than stock turbo from a vendor.
I was planning to wait and see what ZZP Z54 turbo could do, but that idea has been c*ck teased for over 2 years and still not available. At this rate, gen6 camaro production may end before the Z54 turbo is available for purchase. I realize I can have a shop make me a custom t4 manifold if i desired, but that is not the point. I am sure several 2.0t members would jump on a group purchase of some t4 exhaust manifolds for the camaro should the option be available. I can't be the only person wanting the plethora of turbo options available on a car with a t4 housing... |
07-09-2019, 01:57 PM | #2 |
603 Camaros
Drives: 2017 NGM I4 1LT Coupe Join Date: May 2012
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 6,779
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ZZP loves to c#@k tease prototype parts that are somehow off the shelf available in the prototype stages but not available to the public for a year or more after they make record passes. Your likely 100% right on the release of the Z54 being after 2023 at this point. We had some promise awhile ago with the Mitsubishi Turbo but that's probably been graveyarded like so many other companies we had hoped would compete with ZZP. *stares at BNR*
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07-09-2019, 03:31 PM | #3 |
Drives: 2016 M6 2.0T Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Posts: 837
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I can't stand ZZP and the games they love to play.
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07-09-2019, 04:21 PM | #4 |
Coopers Camaro
Drives: 18 Flex Fuel LTG Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: St. Louis/Sullivan/Washington MO
Posts: 933
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Come on guys. Thats a little harsh. Back in 2017 Steve said this:
Now, in his defense, he does NOT indicate what year sooo... ZZP got ya again
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07-09-2019, 04:35 PM | #5 |
Drives: 18 Camaro LS M6 Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: NH
Posts: 698
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I just wanted to say Ive been around the zzp site and they seem to have expanded a lot, so it's a business and business decisions have to be made. These turbo coupes will be looking for rad mods into the next decade. On top of that, now realize one of your core markets is going to be closed to future growth. Would you invest in a sizable outlay in R+D to make a product for a customer base that is going to be severely curtailed? That's it. done.
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07-09-2019, 06:14 PM | #6 | |
603 Camaros
Drives: 2017 NGM I4 1LT Coupe Join Date: May 2012
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 6,779
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Quote:
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07-09-2019, 09:32 PM | #7 |
Drives: 17 Camaro lt, 22 Camaro LT1 Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Beaver, PA
Posts: 411
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It's all about marketing strategy. Why make an alternative for a cheaper, larger turbo when you can offer your slightly bigger turbo at an inflated cost? Cost is also kept high by only releasing a few at a time.
For example, look at turbo bay's selection of turbo's. Most of em are priced anywhere from $500-$800 for a similar size turbocharger. ZZP markets their turbo at $2000, RPM's compressor wheel upgrade turbo goes for $1200 and Vermont's $1400. Now all these companies know it'd be waaaay cheaper to make an exhaust setup for a larger turbo but more profit can be made by selling people expensive turbo's in a very dry performance parts market. Until the private sector starts doing it on their own, there will be no change. |
07-10-2019, 05:33 AM | #8 |
Drives: 18 Camaro LS M6 Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: NH
Posts: 698
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Totally onboard with you. I suspect demand isn't enough to shape that market strategy where competition is driving down the price point. Afaik we are in a tiny segment here.
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07-10-2019, 10:12 AM | #9 |
603 Camaros
Drives: 2017 NGM I4 1LT Coupe Join Date: May 2012
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 6,779
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Atleast we have it infinitely better then the V6. The supercharged V6 is no joke but for the money we can go faster if we ever decide to sink the money into it. The biggest hurdle for us is the internals. It's not so much the cost of the rods and pistons but the labor.
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07-10-2019, 10:52 AM | #10 |
Drives: 18 Camaro LS M6 Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: NH
Posts: 698
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true. what 7k for parts alone for supercharger not taking in to account drivetrain? Ford probably did thier customers a favor by eliminating the v6 mustang. I wonder what a rod and piston job would go for. No chance of those being a direct fitup? talk about gouging, I could have done sc my 04' E85 straight 6 for $3400 from G-power straight from germany plug and play all tuning included.
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07-10-2019, 10:56 AM | #11 |
603 Camaros
Drives: 2017 NGM I4 1LT Coupe Join Date: May 2012
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 6,779
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Rods and Pistons for us with the engine we have in car is about $3000 to 3500 in labor. Anything more and the shop is gouging you. Having the ability to do it yourself or have an engine out of the car already will save a grand or more easily in labor.
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MY 2017 I4 CAMARO BUILD JOURNAL | YOUTUBE | INSTAGRAM | 316RWHP - 385 RWTQ HPTUNERS DYNO TUNE | 12.693s @ 105MPH 1/4 Mile |
07-14-2019, 07:45 AM | #12 |
Drives: 2017 ice sliver 1LT Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Punta Gorda,FL
Posts: 33
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I really don't think anyone has the understanding that making a turbo manifold isn't the easiest thing out there. That's why you see three performance shops either throw in a bigger compressor wheel or they do both sides and throw as big as they can make it. I have a turbo bay turbo and I'm friends with the owner which he is a one man show. His many focus is only doing stock big wheel turbos and pushes the biggest wheels on both the compressor side and turbine side that will fit. Now back to turbo manifolds you guys think its going to be cheaper your in a rude awaking if there was a company to make a manifold with a T3 flange or whatever it will be close or over a grand for it. Then your going to have to add the turbo which is what every you want it too be then a down pipe the factory one or your aftermarket one won't fit anymore. As you can see your at a lot higher dollar amount then the ZZP EFR turbo but that's my thoughts on it.
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