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Old 01-06-2021, 02:12 PM   #85
shaffe


 
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Originally Posted by ember1205 View Post
What constitutes "sold"? I'd be willing to bet that most of the Corvettes that qualify as sold during Q4 were 2020 models that were FINALLY being delivered after a ridiculous wait.

And comparing it to a car that had no inventory AND sells in low quantities?

Might as well just call that bundled up misuse of 'facts' NEWS.
Just going off of whats reported in the GM press release and from GoodCarBadCar.

I don't care what way you want to try and spin it Camaro volume getting close Corvette volume isn't a good thing.
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Lets keep it simple. ..
it has more power...its available power is like a set kof double Ds (no matter where your face is... theyre everywhere) it has the suspension to mame it matter...(
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Old 01-06-2021, 02:16 PM   #86
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Track-warrantied full-electric sports coupe, DCT version, but also offer a lower-cost ICE, track-capable derivative (i.e. improved-V6 1LE-esk type of thing).

Move the belt-line down a little, to help facilitate the visibility grips.

Make the rear truck more easy to load things in.

Be congruent in the design language of the car, through-in and through-out (looking at you 2020 mid-cycle refresh*).

*Note: I don't hate the 2020+ design changes. I don't "like" them either. My biggest issue is the departure from a whole-congruent design of the car to implement some "neat" ideas that had a lot of potential, but were clearly compromised.
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Old 01-06-2021, 02:20 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by shaffe View Post
Just going off of whats reported in the GM press release and from GoodCarBadCar.

I don't care what way you want to try and spin it Camaro volume getting close Corvette volume isn't a good thing.
Another factor to consider is the price point. They are basically not even in the same segment, whereas before one could argue that they were at minimum dangerously close to competing...it really is not the case now. Considering the release of the new LT1, you can get into a big V8 Camaro for what, high $20k's? The "entry" C8's I believe go for at least $60, I'm thinking mid-$60k's. The Corvette sales surpassing the Camaro may not be a definite sign of doom, because the Camaro has it's place.

Last edited by zaimer; 01-06-2021 at 03:09 PM.
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Old 01-06-2021, 02:32 PM   #88
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Track-warrantied full-electric sports coupe, DCT version, but also offer a lower-cost ICE, track-capable derivative (i.e. improved-V6 1LE-esk type of thing).
I've been in these arguments before..... either keep the Camaro SS strictly internal combustion V8 with no turbos, or kill the nameplate completely.

There's too much history there to go electric or make the SS a turbo V6 or whatever other kind of nonsense. And no Camaro SS should ever be silent or sound like a whining turbo.

Small block power and sound or kiss the Camaro goodbye.
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Old 01-06-2021, 02:32 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by zaimer View Post
Another factor to consider is the price points. They are basically not even in the same segment, whereas before one could argue that they were at minimum dangerously close to competing...it really is not the case now. Considering the release of the new LT1, you can get into a big V8 Camaro for what, high $20k's? The "entry" C8's I believe go for at least $60, I'm thinking mid-$60k's. The Corvette sales surpassing the Camaro may be a definite sign of doom, because the Camaro has it's place.
This ^
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Originally Posted by 72MachOne99GT View Post
Lets keep it simple. ..
it has more power...its available power is like a set kof double Ds (no matter where your face is... theyre everywhere) it has the suspension to mame it matter...(
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Old 01-06-2021, 02:39 PM   #90
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1. Better rear visibility without relying on a camera.
2. Less electronic gizmos that cause dash lights to illuminate.
3. Lower beltline, so I can get my arm out the window.
4. Either a longer wheelbase with a useable back seat or no back seat at all.
5. Styling cues taken from the 2nd gen camaro.
6. Aggressive advertising that emphasizes pride in performance as a distinctly American automotive icon.
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Old 01-06-2021, 02:57 PM   #91
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That was me. A 3/4 Series and C-Class are mid rangers that can be had from the 40K range. Pretty much any Mazda, Toyota and Honda about 20K has a much nicer interior than the Camaro and that's very sad.
Honestly, it's not a Camaro issue. It's a pony car issue.

The Mustang and Charger I sat in both have a lot of hard plastic. Neither is better than the Camaro, I would say.

And yeah, the Mazda6 GT has a nicer interior finish than the Camaro, but it doesn't even remotely compare when it comes to performance. At a given budget, you either have a good interior or good performance. $20k family cars don't have to spend much on their drivetrain versus a Camaro with an RWD drivetrain. $40k BMW and Mercedes are piss slow compared to an SS.

IMO the current Camaro interior is okay, for what it is. It's a sports car, not a luxury car. I don't live and sleep in the car, I drive the thing.

Basically, it's the classic "pick two" triangle. Good interior, good performance, good price. Pick two.
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Old 01-06-2021, 03:03 PM   #92
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Something Chevy could do right now, the new LT 455 HP, but the SS more HP, like they used to do within the same engine. SS option should be at least 500. Vette should probably start at 550.

Camaro needs to stay 2+2 even if the rear seat isn’t actually usable. I am all of 5’7” and there no room to sit behind me as close as I sit.

Thank the stars for ProClip, there is no place for a phone, the charge pad behind the driver is some afterthought add on. Who puts it behind the driver? besides being tiny for today’s
phones.
I try to leave my glasses case there and it just flys all over the place. Consequently no place for glasses either.

The height of the door/window is awkward.

A front cam should be standard in the upper trims.
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Old 01-06-2021, 03:05 PM   #93
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I want an electric, AWD, Station wagon version weighing 5000lbs!!!!
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Old 01-06-2021, 03:10 PM   #94
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I want an electric, AWD, Station wagon version weighing 5000lbs!!!!
If it resembles a woody wagon, I am in
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Old 01-06-2021, 04:07 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by Paintslinger16 View Post
Something Chevy could do right now, the new LT 455 HP, but the SS more HP, like they used to do within the same engine. SS option should be at least 500. Vette should probably start at 550.

Camaro needs to stay 2+2 even if the rear seat isnít actually usable. I am all of 5í7Ē and there no room to sit behind me as close as I sit.

Thank the stars for ProClip, there is no place for a phone, the charge pad behind the driver is some afterthought add on. Who puts it behind the driver? besides being tiny for todayís
phones.
I try to leave my glasses case there and it just flys all over the place. Consequently no place for glasses either.

The height of the door/window is awkward.

A front cam should be standard in the upper trims.
This is me, but once you go over 500 HP, it really just becomes bragging rights on the street, especially on FR cars with limited traction.

And isn't 2+2 for insurance purposes?

Front cams could be useful, yeah, though I do back in for the most part.
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Old 01-06-2021, 04:19 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UnknownJinX View Post
This is me, but once you go over 500 HP, it really just becomes bragging rights on the street, especially on FR cars with limited traction.

And isn't 2+2 for insurance purposes?

Front cams could be useful, yeah, though I do back in for the most part.
There was a time when it was. It doesn't matter any more. What's it worth, how likely is it to get stolen, how terrible is your driving record, and where is it parked most of the time? Those are the major factors that determine rate of premium - not how many seating surfaces it has.
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Old 01-06-2021, 05:39 PM   #97
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There was a time when it was. It doesn't matter any more. What's it worth, how likely is it to get stolen, how terrible is your driving record, and where is it parked most of the time? Those are the major factors that determine rate of premium - not how many seating surfaces it has.
Yep I doesnít it matter. engine size and credit score effect your rate more then it being a passenger car.

My reason was, itís supposed to be 2+2 otherwise itís just a Vette coupe.

My wife has been in the back sitting sideways but it does work.

High HP bragging? probably, but count the threads about adding FBO or Blower? The only thing that beats it is, I added XYZ part, do I need a tune?
The answer is always Yes. But I digress.
People want HP, if the Mopar or even worst the Blue Oval offer more then we as Bowtie guys are obligated to ask to up the ante or at least try to keep up.
Itís going to be at a premium, and that is one of the ways that cars actually became collectible.
My Ď18 HB SS as much I wish it was, is not unique itís never going to be worth more then. Any other one.

The GT 500 and Hellcats are going to be the collectibles the 5th Z/28 is, maybe the Hotwheels will be in the 6gen, but thatís appearance package only.
Put a cam in a factory over bored 376 at least.
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Old 01-06-2021, 11:20 PM   #98
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all i really want is car that looks like a modern Camaro. like in 1967, 1970, 1982 and 2016.
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