[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Not quite sure what your point is.

The government mandated emissions for gasoline and diesel cars and trucks.

VW elected to CHEAT in order to meet those requirements, and hence was penalized, as were others.

So my point remains correct, the government only mandated the emissions performance of the cars, they did not mandate the software or hardware to meet those standards. VW made poor choices on how to meet them......or not meet them.

But again not clear on your point on suggested fines. The regulations are pretty clear on what happens if you don't meet them.

But VW was also penalized in the consumer world as well as some vehicles couldn't just get a software update so vehicle were bought back as I recall.

You're kidding..... you didn't get what his point is? My stoner nephew could understand exactly what he was saying.

He's pointing out the fact that laws are force. You surmise they're "suggestions".

[NeverDie]

NO, he's very clearly stating that the result is mandated by law but the method for achieving it is not.

Even your stoner nephew could understand that.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by NeverDie

NO, he's very clearly stating that the result is mandated by law but the method for achieving it is not.

Even your stoner nephew could understand that.

Ergo, law = force.

My point stands as fact.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

Styling and performance are the only reasons to buy a car.

Anything else is an appliance. Otherwise known as a beige Toyota Camry.

True....an enthusiast wants styling and performance and dependability. Most don't care about interior perfections and how much useable space.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by gtfoxy

Don’t worry, no non-necessary travel for you, comrade.

Have to stick to your allotted energy rations, peasant.

Well thats sort of the planned idea. They want people to stay put. They don't want people freely traveling anymore, and with an electric you will NOT be freely traveling. It will be a big hassle marking out your destinations with charging stations where you will be spending 15min to an hour and maybe longer depending on who is in front of you. And after all this charging taking place they still want to put the coal miners out of business. The very thing that runs our power grid. And there will be even more of a load on the PG with electric cars they intend to force down our throats. The people running the show now are a bunch of clowns. Name one with a known very high I.Q. You can't...they are known clowns and Eff ups.

[FarmerFran]

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

True....an enthusiast wants styling and performance and dependability. Most don't care about interior perfections and how much useable space.

Or according to about 95% of the people, a manual transmission

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

Well thats sort of the planned idea. They want people to stay put. They don't want people freely traveling anymore, and with an electric you will NOT be freely traveling. It will be a big hassle marking out your destinations with charging stations where you will be spending 15min to an hour and maybe longer depending on who is in front of you. And after all this charging taking place they still want to put the coal miners out of business. The very thing that runs our power grid. And there will be even more of a load on the PG with electric cars they intend to force down our throats. They people running the show now are a bunch of clowns.

Yep. More assaults on the American way of life.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by Realist

The bailout just 10 years ago separated the good and the bad from the new GM. The new GM only had the good and no taxes to pay the Fed for years and years. This set up any CEO placed in the role to look good for quite a few years. I bet if Ford knew what they now know after seeing the GM bailout, in retrospect they would have done the same. I don’t have anything against her but honestly think many folks I worked with over the years could be put in the same position and the outcome would be the same. Take her away and GM keeps going. Take Musk away from Tesla and it would suffer instantly.

Believe me..she is like todays Hollywood actors...nothing special because anyone can play the part.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by Camaro_QC

I see so much hate about all the GM new vision and staff... Why don't you guys sell your Camaro and buy a Mustang instead?

I love the current product. That why I bought. Also my current product makes loud rumbling noises, allows me to shift my own gears and gas up and go in about 3 min.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by vtirocz

That data shows only 23% of energy comes from coal and appears to be shrinking at a fast rate.

Lansing Mich. rep. says 95% of their power comes from coal. Its all on video, he said it just last week. I suspect most large cities are comparable.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by 95 imp

"Newsom’s budget plan calls for using $465 million in cap-and-trade dollars to help lower-income Californians buy electric cars and trucks."

"Newsom also wants to spend $50 million to install vehicle chargers at state-owned facilities and to borrow $1 billion against future vehicle registration fees to accelerate the build-out of charging stations."

https://www.yahoo.com/news/editorial...162437209.html

Remember when the government subsidized ICE cars and gas stations when we went from horse and buggy to autos? Remember when the government taxed you to help pay for your neighbor's new car?

Ya... me either...

Newsome isn't he the same clown who runs the state of California that has blackouts all the time, and forest fires in the summer because he refuses to prune the forests because it will disrupt the wildlife? He could care less about the wildlife. He's like his Aunt Nazi Pelosi. A scammer and robs from the people

[vtirocz]

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

Lansing Mich. rep. says 95% of their power comes from coal. Its all on video, he said it just last week. I suspect most large cities are comparable.

The data being referenced was obviously nationwide across the US, where in 2019, coal was the source of 23% of the total US electricity that was generated. That # is falling at a fast rate (see the plot in that link).

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Not quite sure what your point is.



The government mandated emissions for gasoline and diesel cars and trucks.



VW elected to CHEAT in order to meet those requirements, and hence was penalized, as were others.



So my point remains correct, the government only mandated the emissions performance of the cars, they did not mandate the software or hardware to meet those standards. VW made poor choices on how to meet them......or not meet them.



But again not clear on your point on suggested fines. The regulations are pretty clear on what happens if you don't meet them.



But VW was also penalized in the consumer world as well as some vehicles couldn't just get a software update so vehicle were bought back as I recall.

If only governments actually made regulations that made sense and are actually based on science. That's unfortunately not always the case.

If you set out unrealistic goals, companies will be forced to cheat to pass them.

Are you the type of guy who drives exactly at the speed limit because the sign says so? Even though it doesn't make sense and there are evidence that some roads see fewer accidents with raised speed limits. But nope, gotta keep that sweet, sweet ticket money coming...

Sent from toaster or something

[c4racer]

Originally Posted by vtirocz

The data being referenced was obviously nationwide across the US, where in 2019, coal was the source of 23% of the total US electricity that was generated. That # is falling at a fast rate (see the plot in that link).

looked up CA - at least they do report it. Looks like 68% from non renewables and half of that from natural gas - which is a pretty clean and abundant resource. Which also makes one wonder why we are not focusing on multiple fuel alternatives not just electric - follow the money on that I'm sure, nothing to do with what's best or makes sense as you would expect with the Gov.
Natural gas makes a lot of sense to me since ICE engines can actually run on that without significant changes.

https://www.energy.ca.gov/data-repor...ric-generation