[protovack]

So after a few track days with my 1LE, I've gathered several opinions about racing technique:

1.) Revmatch is a crutch. You should pretend it doesn't exist and instead learn the TRUE racing technique of HEEL TOE. When you brake before a corner, you should simultaneously blip the throttle and downshift before turning using your toe on the gas pedal. This is TRUE racing.

2.) Revmatch is modern technology, use it and enjoy the car. It's one less thing to worry about when turning. Just sit back, use the technology and think nothing of it.

3.) Revmatch is a crutch, but so is heel toe. A truly accomplished driver can anticipate turns in advance and shift well before he ever reaches the actual turn. If you find yourself needing to "HEEL TOE" then you already missed the window for optimal shifting. A TRUE driver selects his gear just after the previous turn (if necessary) and goes into the next turn with his foot on the throttle, only. If you find yourself needing to think about shifting right before a turn, you messed up 5-10 seconds ago.

What do you guys think?

[zr1chris]

I think it's just technology. Some people are hell bent holding onto the old way of doing things. Heel toe technique leaves any driver more susceptible to making an error. Rev match allows you to skip that step which helps you be more consistent. It's the same as a dual clutch paddle shift car vs an old school h pattern setup. Dual clutch is simply quicker and allows you to be more consistent.

[Ryephile]

Oh crap, not this again. There was a rather bitter troll on here earlier this year that went around telling people that if you used the Rev-Match you weren't a "real" driver. GTFO with that elitist nonsense.

If you have the skill to heel-n-toe, then neat, congrats, but it doesn't gain you access to the secret champagne room of manhood. It took me years to fumble heel-n-toe poorly, a few more years of practicing everyday, looking like a boy-racer idiot. I'm now reasonably proficient enough where most of the time it would be difficult to discern if it's me or the rev-match doing it. The difference is the rev-match always gets it perfect, and I don't.

So yes, the rev-match makes heel-n-toe obsolete on a technical level, but it doesn't replicate the satisfaction of getting that perfect heel-n-toe downshift yourself. On the track when I'm looking to lay down hot laps, I let the rev-match do it perfect. On the street when I'm just looking to have fun, I heel-n-toe myself.

As for option #3, that's just a load of stinky poo.

[protovack]

As for option #3, that's just a load of stinky poo.

Why?

[Ryephile]

Originally Posted by protovack

Why?

If you're able to downshift prior to braking for the corner, you were in the wrong gear. The rest of #3 is so nonsensical I assumed you wrote it as a joke.

[TrackClub]

#3 is clearly a big joke and so is #1 as you dont blip the throttle with your TOE. Unless one has special leg and hip anatomy that doesnt match the rest of the human race all in all: a good effort at a humurous post to get folks "going" lol!

[Ichabod]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

#3 is clearly a big joke and so is #1 as you dont blip the throttle with your TOE. Unless one has special leg and hip anatomy that doesnt match the rest of the human race all in all: a good effort at a humurous post to get folks "going" lol!

I actually prefer to reach down and use my left hand to blip throttle, right hand to shift and teeth to steer. That’s how a TRUE racer does it.

[Provoste]

Originally Posted by protovack

So after a few track days with my 1LE, I've gathered several opinions about racing technique:

3.) Revmatch is a crutch, but so is heel toe. A truly accomplished driver can anticipate turns in advance and shift well before he ever reaches the actual turn. If you find yourself needing to "HEEL TOE" then you already missed the window for optimal shifting. A TRUE driver selects his gear just after the previous turn (if necessary) and goes into the next turn with his foot on the throttle, only. If you find yourself needing to think about shifting right before a turn, you messed up 5-10 seconds ago.

What do you guys think?

Huh- sounds like 4th gear everywhere is your ticket then... you’ll never need to shift. I’d be willing to wager you’ve never ridden with a “truly accomplished driver” on track.

Originally Posted by Ryephile

If you have the skill to heel-n-toe, then neat, congrats, but it doesn't gain you access to the secret champagne room of manhood.

Damnit! Had my hopes up!

Originally Posted by Ryephile

So yes, the rev-match makes heel-n-toe obsolete on a technical level, but it doesn't replicate the satisfaction of getting that perfect heel-n-toe downshift yourself. On the track when I'm looking to lay down hot laps, I let the rev-match do it perfect. On the street when I'm just looking to have fun, I heel-n-toe myself.

My older brother by 5 years was autocrossing in HS and he taught me how to drive a manual and how to heel toe when I was 13 years old in an 88 Alfa Romeo Spider in a huge empty parking lot. I completely agree on it adding satisfaction. Though new technology makes it a dying skill you just won’t need in the future (unless you’re driving a proper old school car).

I certainly wouldn’t call any new technology that makes drivers faster on track a “crutch”, I certainly don’t fault professional racers for using sequential paddle shift transmissions or ABS brakes...

Originally Posted by TrackClub

#3 is clearly a big joke and so is #1 as you dont blip the throttle with your TOE. Unless one has special leg and hip anatomy that doesnt match the rest of the human race

[Boost Creep]

lol
The synchronizers in a manual transmission are a crutch.


Heel toe is not a crutch, it's how you slow the car with the brakes and engine simultaneously without upsetting the balance and locking up the rear tires by shifting into a lower gear while the engine is near idle.

#3 is clearly a big joke and so is #1 as you dont blip the throttle with your TOE.

I apply brake pressure with my big toe side and blip the throttle with my little toe side.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Oh crap, not this again. There was a rather bitter troll on here earlier this year that went around telling people that if you used the Rev-Match you weren't a "real" driver. GTFO with that elitist nonsense.

If you have the skill to heel-n-toe, then neat, congrats, but it doesn't gain you access to the secret champagne room of manhood. It took me years to fumble heel-n-toe poorly, a few more years of practicing everyday, looking like a boy-racer idiot. I'm now reasonably proficient enough where most of the time it would be difficult to discern if it's me or the rev-match doing it. The difference is the rev-match always gets it perfect, and I don't.

So yes, the rev-match makes heel-n-toe obsolete on a technical level, but it doesn't replicate the satisfaction of getting that perfect heel-n-toe downshift yourself. On the track when I'm looking to lay down hot laps, I let the rev-match do it perfect. On the street when I'm just looking to have fun, I heel-n-toe myself.

As for option #3, that's just a load of stinky poo.

Pretty much this.

#3 didn't even make sense.

In the Camaro, the tech works so I leave it on all the time. In a Civic Type-R that I tracked it worked 80-90% of the time, so I found myself turning it off.

In every other manual trans car I have.. I don't have the option... I'm proficient enough at HT to not upset the cars.. but I just don't care to bother when the tech actually works.

[waterman]

Heel-toe will never become obsolete. There will always be manual cars without rev match technologies.

I've been working heel-toe since 1975. With that much practice, one becomes proficient.

With that said, no one is quicker shifting than a computer. Auto is quicker than manual for the same reason. Rev match and (while we're at it) no lift shift make me faster. So why not take advantage of similar technology that makes the guys with autos faster? I personally am a fan of the newer tech that keep the manual gear box competitive.

I'm getting older, but I'm no dinosaur...Shifting with your right foot planted takes some serious faith in technology.

[Apex_Missing_Ape]

Originally Posted by waterman

Shifting with your right foot planted takes some serious faith in technology.

I love the no-lift shift. It's a weird feeling doing it but makes the car sound somewhat like a DCT shifting, especially with that little burp sound between shifts. The shifts are unbelievably fast for a manual car.

On backroads I heel-toe, but on a track I will use the rev-match feature. There are enough variables I'm dealing with on a track already to worry about my own.

[MosaicX1LE]

I mean I agree that the rev match technology is cool, so it's not a crutch per se, but at some point shouldn't you just have an automatic transmission? I heard the track mode on the auto was pretty dang good.

Also... maybe a few people trolling here, heel-toe does not actually involve your heal. I think the term itself comes from tanks or pre-WWII or something where you actually put your heel on one pedal and hot the other one with your toes. ... someone once told me you had to do this with the 2006 GTO, but anyways. This is part of the enjoyment of a manual transmission to me. I'm sure you can be as fast, or faster with the computer doing everything for you though.

[Boost Creep]

Originally Posted by MosaicX1LE

I mean I agree that the rev match technology is cool, so it's not a crutch per se, but at some point shouldn't you just have an automatic transmission? I heard the track mode on the auto was pretty dang good.

Also... maybe a few people trolling here, heel-toe does not actually involve your heal. I think the term itself comes from tanks or pre-WWII or something where you actually put your heel on one pedal and hot the other one with your toes. ... someone once told me you had to do this with the 2006 GTO, but anyways. This is part of the enjoyment of a manual transmission to me. I'm sure you can be as fast, or faster with the computer doing everything for you though.

Troll here, I had a '06 GTO M6 for 110,000 miles, still no heel involved.