[MightyBobo]

Originally Posted by GearheadSS

The First Edition RST is the one that could be reserved. The WT is actually going to come out first though. The WT will hit dealer lots in Spring 2023, the RST First Edition will hit Fall of 2023.

Only partially correct.

You can ("could", the RST FE sold out in 19 minutes) reserve all three versions: WT, RST, and RST FE). There were two queues: the WT/RST one where you could order either customized, or the RST FE queue which is coming loaded to the brim.

You can literally go reserve a customized RST right now, but we don't know how you can customize it yet. Similar to the Hummer I imagine, but cheaper lower prices.

Also, your dates are wrong: it's Summer of 2024 before people can order the WT or RST models.

[Hops]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeROC

Just MHO and random thoughts:

Enjoy the ride.

Your last sentence sums it up for me, EV's have accelerated the idea of having the car give you a ride vs driving the car!

[m6-lt1]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeROC

Just MHO and random thoughts:
-Losing the V8 sound and feel is a HUGE thing to me personally. As someone who has loved cars since I was a kid, rode in my grandparents Corvette and Cadillac at an early age, fell in love with my uncle's 66 Mustang, and just had a natural love of cars, the V8 sound and feel is the heart and soul of my personal passion for cars. There is NOTHING in the automotive world as great as the sound and feel of a cammed V8, nothing. Not even going 0-60 in 2 seconds, or an 8 sec 1/4 mile in dead silence. Shoot, I remember the first time on a track with a helmet on, my senses were so out of whack from not being able to hear what the engine was doing, since I was used to driving without a helmet. I get it, not everyone feels the same about V8's or ICE, but many of us do. It's just part of the passion and hobby.

The problem is we are a tiny minority. I think most people buying cars could care less what it’s powered by.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by jamala00

I have a 2015 Impala that we bought brand new. All we have done to is is tire rotations and oil changes. Standard maintenance... Not saying that a Tesla doesn't require less of that, but just saying going 3 years with no issues isn't a big deal. Why do you think every auto manufacturer has a warranty for 3 years... (Generally nothing happens in that time frame). I'd like to see what Tesla did if they were the size of any of the big 3. Can you imagine them trying to employee enough techs to do house calls? lol.. They can do that now because they are so small compared to the big 3. How many Fords, GMs, Chrysler's, etc. are out in the world today that need tire rotations or other service that doesn't require a lift? Can you imagine one of them trying to employee enough techs to make house calls as a business model?

Agreed, I always wonder how Tesla will be able to scale. The interesting thing about Tesla is they stated that they never planned to make cars long term. Their business plan was to show the world it could be done and help drive the shift to EVs. I wouldn't be surprised if they remain a niche automaker long term and possibly sell/license the advancements they make in technology.

EVs just seems to change the game when it comes to who can actually build them. Now we have Sony releasing a vehicle. Apple announced a self-driving car for 2025. The whole industry is being shaken up and it was long overdue.

From and manufacturing perspective EVs are more like computers with wheels and suspension now. At least that is what my Tesla Model 3 feels like.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by MightyBobo

That's not correct. The First Edition that I reserved has all the option boxes checked. The RST you can order will be more flexible when the time comes.

The flexible order RST will not happen until after the First Edition, all boxes checked RST trucks are sold and distributed.

[MightyBobo]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

The flexible order RST will not happen until after the First Edition, all boxes checked RST trucks are sold and distributed.

Correct. Which will be end of 2023 for the FE, and Summer 2024 for the normal RST.

All I'm saying is that you aren't shoehorned into a loaded RST if you reserve right now. People aren't understanding the reservation process right now, and with good reason: GM definitely made it confusing.

[Fast4wd]

[QUOTE=BuckeyeROC;11117343]Just MHO and random thoughts:

-Losing the V8 sound and feel is a HUGE thing to me personally. As someone who has loved cars since I was a kid, rode in my grandparents Corvette and Cadillac at an early age, fell in love with my uncle's 66 Mustang, and just had a natural love of cars, the V8 sound and feel is the heart and soul of my personal passion for cars. There is NOTHING in the automotive world as great as the sound and feel of a cammed V8, nothing. Not even going 0-60 in 2 seconds, or an 8 sec 1/4 mile in dead silence. Shoot, I remember the first time on a track with a helmet on, my senses were so out of whack from not being able to hear what the engine was doing, since I was used to driving without a helmet. I get it, not everyone feels the same about V8's or ICE, but many of us do. It's just part of the passion and hobby.

-V8's, and ICE eventually, are literally being forced out due to a collaboration between corp lobbyists and govts around the world. I won't go further into politics, but you can see what GM and other auto makers have lobbied for yourself with some research online.

-I see many positives of EVs, but also many negatives. There are plenty of you shouting about the positives, and many of those are true and great. But here's where I some problems with EVs:

1. Recharge time. Sure, it will improve, but still has a ways to go to be practical for many.

2. Recharge time and people who live in areas where charging at home is impossible or extremely difficult. I can't imagine living in an apartment building or something like a brownstone where you park on the street and trying to run an elecric cord out your 10th story window or across the sidewalk. I guess they will just have to find a recharging station and the time every day or few days to sit at one for awhile?

3. You are kidding yourself if you think the Karens of the world aren't going to be scared when they are getting passed by all these quick EVs on the road or God forbid, they accidentally hit the accelerator too hard on a 3 second 0-60 EV themselves, just LOL. There WILL be mandatory software updates to slow EVs down. "Nobody needs to drive that quick and it's a waste of electricity and resources anyway." Just wait.

Your point number 3 is spot on. When there are 5000 plus pound vehicles with 3 sec 0-60 the damage in accidents will be way up. I believe this will be a major problem as more people adopt EVs.


4. Another push will be self driving. Once the satellites and rest of the self driving tech is in place, it'll be mandatory b/c "safety" (going back to more Karens).

Number 4 I disagree with. Self driving is decades away, no matter what Elon will have you believe.

[jamala00]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

Agreed, I always wonder how Tesla will be able to scale. The interesting thing about Tesla is they stated that they never planned to make cars long term. Their business plan was to show the world it could be done and help drive the shift to EVs. I wouldn't be surprised if they remain a niche automaker long term and possibly sell/license the advancements they make in technology.

EVs just seems to change the game when it comes to who can actually build them. Now we have Sony releasing a vehicle. Apple announced a self-driving car for 2025. The whole industry is being shaken up and it was long overdue.

From and manufacturing perspective EVs are more like computers with wheels and suspension now. At least that is what my Tesla Model 3 feels like.

Boy... If that is true, that would concern me enough to not buy one. I shy away from getting a Google Pixel Smart Phone because I don't think Google is in the phone market long term.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Hops

Your last sentence sums it up for me, EV's have accelerated the idea of having the car give you a ride vs driving the car!

The Porsche Taycan and Audi eTron GT beg to disagree. Also the new AMG EQS might have something to say about that.

Yes, a different experience, but the intent is these are driver's cars.

[MightyBobo]

Originally Posted by Number 3

The Porsche Taycan and Audi eTron GT beg to disagree. Also the new AMG EQS might have something to say about that.

Yes, a different experience, but the intent is these are driver's cars.

The people spelling doom and gloom about EV's losing their driving soul are going off of nothing but misguided emotion.

Just check out these guys. They look awesome! https://www.alphamotorinc.com/

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Hops

Your last sentence sums it up for me, EV's have accelerated the idea of having the car give you a ride vs driving the car!

Originally Posted by BuckeyeROC

Just MHO and random thoughts:

-Losing the V8 sound and feel is a HUGE thing to me personally. As someone who has loved cars since I was a kid, rode in my grandparents Corvette and Cadillac at an early age, fell in love with my uncle's 66 Mustang, and just had a natural love of cars, the V8 sound and feel is the heart and soul of my personal passion for cars. There is NOTHING in the automotive world as great as the sound and feel of a cammed V8, nothing. Not even going 0-60 in 2 seconds, or an 8 sec 1/4 mile in dead silence. Shoot, I remember the first time on a track with a helmet on, my senses were so out of whack from not being able to hear what the engine was doing, since I was used to driving without a helmet. I get it, not everyone feels the same about V8's or ICE, but many of us do. It's just part of the passion and hobby.

In the enthusiast market, this will likely be the biggest issue. NVH can ruin or enhance the driving experience. In certain segments, eliminating NVH has been a huge undertaking. In the C8, steps were taken so the driver could hear the engine sound more.

-V8's, and ICE eventually, are literally being forced out due to a collaboration between corp lobbyists and govts around the world. I won't go further into politics, but you can see what GM and other auto makers have lobbied for yourself with some research online.

Not the only reason as much as the government might like it to be this way. GM made the switch to EV prior to the current administration. GM is doing it the enhance shareholder value. Tesla is worth 10x what GM is and they are far less profitable on far fewer units. GM and the rest of the industry aren't doing this just because the government and lobbyists want them to. They are doing it to be even more profitable with Tesla being the model.



-I see many positives of EVs, but also many negatives. There are plenty of you shouting about the positives, and many of those are true and great. But here's where I some problems with EVs:

1. Recharge time. Sure, it will improve, but still has a ways to go to be practical for many.

GM just announced 100 miles in 10 minutes with fast charging. That's getting close enough for even me. And as you point out, it's only getting better.

2. Recharge time and people who live in areas where charging at home is impossible or extremely difficult. I can't imagine living in an apartment building or something like a brownstone where you park on the street and trying to run an elecric cord out your 10th story window or across the sidewalk. I guess they will just have to find a recharging station and the time every day or few days to sit at one for awhile?

This will only be resolved when recharge times are to the point where recharging is equivalent to fueling up. It's a big deal right now.

3. You are kidding yourself if you think the Karens of the world aren't going to be scared when they are getting passed by all these quick EVs on the road or God forbid, they accidentally hit the accelerator too hard on a 3 second 0-60 EV themselves, just LOL. There WILL be mandatory software updates to slow EVs down. "Nobody needs to drive that quick and it's a waste of electricity and resources anyway." Just wait.

Ok the Bolt and Bolt EUV, VW SUVs are not much faster than most cars on the road. All EVs aren't 3 motor 100 kW monsters.

You are correct though, I don't want an inexperienced driver behind the wheel of a Tesla Model S Plaid anymore than I want them behind the wheel of a ZL1.

4. Another push will be self driving. Once the satellites and rest of the self driving tech is in place, it'll be mandatory b/c "safety" (going back to more Karens).

A lonnngg way off

5. Right to repair. Good luck.

This issue exists today and wont' be worse in the future.

Issue will be for a 15 year old EV, replacing the battery has two issues. It's expensive (same as replacing an engine) but form factor may be completely different. If 15 years from now it's a completely new battery tech, and I am certain it will be, can you find a replacement. At least with an ICE you have a shot at a rebuild.

6. Subscriptions. Once self driving EVs are all but mandatory and you aren't allowed to work on them, you won't be able to buy one. They will be subscription based services. You'll own nothing and you'll be happy.

Again, a long way away. The saddest part for me is simply that this is very ok for a LOT of people right now. Lyft and Uber already have shown us people are ok with someone else driving them around. Whether it's driverless or not is simply the next stage in that.

Enjoy the ride.

Absolutely!!!!

[Hops]

Originally Posted by Number 3

The Porsche Taycan and Audi eTron GT beg to disagree. Also the new AMG EQS might have something to say about that.

Yes, a different experience, but the intent is these are driver's cars.

Of course those are given exceptions.... include the Evija and other cars many of us can't afford... LOL. I'm not against ev's for f sake. but when i see the cabin of a model 3, there is nothing that tells me they wanted to make this a drivers car (lack of HUD, force all interactions from a large screen). I guess the low center of gravity, and somewhat sporty suspension makes for up that.

[Hops]

Originally Posted by MightyBobo

The people spelling doom and gloom about EV's losing their driving soul are going off of nothing but misguided emotion.

Just check out these guys. They look awesome! https://www.alphamotorinc.com/

wow, that topcoupe is 4200 lbs.. No, i don't think people are upset about EV's, it's that EV's are not being added to the driving experience, but replacing ICE. I don't doubt EV's could be drivers cars at a reasonable price, but i'm not taking that chance on the first generation. That's why my current plan is to trade my current Camaro in on a 2024 Camaro.

[MightyBobo]

Originally Posted by Hops

wow, that topcoupe is 4200 lbs.. No, i don't think people are upset about EV's, it's that EV's are not being added to the driving experience, but replacing ICE. I don't doubt EV's could be drivers cars at a reasonable price, but i'm not taking that chance on the first generation. That's why my current plan is to trade my current Camaro in on a 2024 Camaro.

Nothing wrong with that. I'd say you should try driving one first before writing it off. I'm also not saying anyone should be switching RIGHT NOW - ya know? Clearly, I agree with you to a point: my new Camaro should be here in a month or so. I'm just saying: they are coming.

Originally Posted by BuckeyeROC

Umm yeah, that's part of the point. It's a passion/hobby. Some of the reasons we are even in the hobby at all are for the emotions and nostalgia. If I want to pass the time with no emotions, I'll do work or accounting or something.

Which is why I linked proof that there are EVs that will undoubtedly have soul, emotion, and style to them...hopefully, one day you step outside of the box when one comes along. Maybe even the new "Camaro" EV (or whatever they call it). Who knows, you might be surprised.