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Old 09-14-2021, 02:05 PM   #1
LTwin86
 
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Finished my tune, stage 2.5

Finally complete my config.
Hybrid turbo
Upgraded intercooler
Forged pistons and connecting rods
Ti valve springs
Upgraded throttle body
KnN filter
Transmission advanced chip
So happy with my car now, running so fast.
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Old 09-14-2021, 02:59 PM   #2
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E85 or straight 93 octane?

By "Transmission advanced chip", can we assume you mean that the transmission tuning was done as well as engine power?

Also, "Hybrid turbo" I assume is referring to a larger wheel in a bored out stock TD04 housing? (Similar to the ZZP "Big Wheel turbo")?

Which pistons/rods did you go with? Did they rebalance the entire assembly, or just bolt them in? (Honestly, most vendors state you don't need a full rebalance)... Also, kept the stock balance shafts?

Intersting on the Ti valve springs. Did you upgrade the cams where you needed to change out the springs?
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Old 09-14-2021, 03:29 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by 95TA - The Beast View Post
E85 or straight 93 octane?

By "Transmission advanced chip", can we assume you mean that the transmission tuning was done as well as engine power?

Also, "Hybrid turbo" I assume is referring to a larger wheel in a bored out stock TD04 housing? (Similar to the ZZP "Big Wheel turbo")?

Which pistons/rods did you go with? Did they rebalance the entire assembly, or just bolt them in? (Honestly, most vendors state you don't need a full rebalance)... Also, kept the stock balance shafts?

Intersting on the Ti valve springs. Did you upgrade the cams where you needed to change out the springs?
Do not know so many details about my tune, but can say:
1. Yes, transmission control unit was adjusted also. It helps to delete power restrictions in the gearbox.
2. Yes, stock housing with bigger wheels.
3. Don't know which pistons and rods installed, looks like it was already balanced.
4. No cams tune, just changed springs to get more power.
5. In Russia fuel types different. I run on 100 octane before and after all modifications, in other way, on stock engine pistons become broken very soon, fuel is very low quality.

Last edited by LTwin86; 09-15-2021 at 07:41 AM.
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Old 09-14-2021, 06:14 PM   #4
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Too bad the graph is in NM, and is that Din??? Also the gear selection is obviously low on the dyno. HP and TQ are crossing at like 3800 RPM's?? Lol?
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Old 09-14-2021, 08:35 PM   #5
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Well, honestly, the valve springs don't add any power. The stock valvesprings are fine with the stock cams, so that is why I asked.

And I concur, the crossover should be at 5200RPM (or is it 5280RPM???) , but not at 3800rpm. Some weird stuff being done in Russia there.

Doesn't really matter because it is a direct comparison of pre-mods/tune to post-mods/tune which is all that matters.

And based on what you said it was probably "out of the box" installation of pistons/rods. Like I mentioned before, most of the suppliers say it is close enough that a full rebalance is not necessary. Basically, most places just installed the pistons/rods straight out of the boxes. If it works, it works.

So, to sum up, your power output is via bigger turbo (modified TD04), bigger intercooler, forged pistons/rods and a tune WITHOUT E85.

Good data point to know. Honestly, the forged rods/pistons don't gain you any power, neither do the valvesprings, the upgraded turbo is a known (plenty of vendors offer the same), and the upgraded intercooler is the wildcard datapoint here, but figure 10-15hp at most. The tune just allows everything to work together, and as you stated, removes the built-in power limits.

Did you remove the stock catalytic converter? Does it have a catalytic converter?

Did you upgrade the intercooler piping? (Personally I doubt there is anything to be gained there but a lighter wallet)

Just trying to ascertain what kind of real output people can expect with a max-effort tune without E85 and with forged pistons/rods. The intercooler is a plus and those are actually pretty cheap as a "stock replacement".
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Old 09-14-2021, 08:44 PM   #6
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I forgot to add, per my own calculations, I figured about 365-375AWHP as a MAX output available for the modified TD04 turbos with forged pistons/rods and a drop-in K&N filter.

Mine is AWHP because I have a Cadillac CTS-4 AWD vehicle. I, like you, went with an upgraded TD04 (ZZP Big Wheel turbo) unit and a K&N drop in filter. I had Trifecta build me an Elite tune for the mods and I figure I am somewhere in the 325-335AWHP range. I figure forged pistons/rods would net me about 40HP more (only because of tune aggressiveness).

Again, with the more aggressive tune an upgraded intercooler just makes sense.

For my needs and use I am fine where I am, but I always like to have the upgrade path planned out for "what comes next".

For me, your kind of setup is exactly where my end-point would be, as I have torque limits of the transaxle, transmission and differentials to worry about.
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Old 09-14-2021, 10:25 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95TA - The Beast View Post
And I concur, the crossover should be at 5200RPM (or is it 5280RPM???) , but not at 3800rpm. Some weird stuff being done in Russia there.

Doesn't really matter because it is a direct comparison of pre-mods/tune to post-mods/tune which is all that matters.
They don't cross at 5252 rpm because torque is measured on this dyno graph in Nm instead of lb-ft. The crossover point varies depending on units (hp vs kW, lb-ft vs Nm).
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Old 09-15-2021, 07:13 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95TA - The Beast View Post
Well, honestly, the valve springs don't add any power. The stock valvesprings are fine with the stock cams, so that is why I asked.

And I concur, the crossover should be at 5200RPM (or is it 5280RPM???) , but not at 3800rpm. Some weird stuff being done in Russia there.

Doesn't really matter because it is a direct comparison of pre-mods/tune to post-mods/tune which is all that matters.

And based on what you said it was probably "out of the box" installation of pistons/rods. Like I mentioned before, most of the suppliers say it is close enough that a full rebalance is not necessary. Basically, most places just installed the pistons/rods straight out of the boxes. If it works, it works.

So, to sum up, your power output is via bigger turbo (modified TD04), bigger intercooler, forged pistons/rods and a tune WITHOUT E85.

Good data point to know. Honestly, the forged rods/pistons don't gain you any power, neither do the valvesprings, the upgraded turbo is a known (plenty of vendors offer the same), and the upgraded intercooler is the wildcard datapoint here, but figure 10-15hp at most. The tune just allows everything to work together, and as you stated, removes the built-in power limits.

Did you remove the stock catalytic converter? Does it have a catalytic converter?

Did you upgrade the intercooler piping? (Personally I doubt there is anything to be gained there but a lighter wallet)

Just trying to ascertain what kind of real output people can expect with a max-effort tune without E85 and with forged pistons/rods. The intercooler is a plus and those are actually pretty cheap as a "stock replacement".
Im not so experienced in tech, but my tune company told me that Ti springs are stiffer, that is why valve closing faster and can help to gain some hp.
Catalytic totally deleted, just straight pipe on it's place.
Intercooler piping, yes, totally upgraded.
Forged pistons will give you a confidence, because a lot of camaros with 2.0 engines in Russia had blowed up pistons due to fuel quality after run on 95 octane even on stock config with less a 50 000 km. I saw a lot 2.0 on rebuild due to piston issue.
Regarding limits of the transaxle, transmission and differentials, there is no big difference from SS version, still have enough limits i think.
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Old 09-15-2021, 04:16 PM   #9
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So is the higher octane gas over in Russia refined worse than our higher octane in the states here, is that what you're saying?
I'm just curious is all.
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Old 09-15-2021, 06:37 PM   #10
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If this video is still true, the situation is pretty bad there: https://youtu.be/ymHHbHyD_Hw

(TL;DR: gas advertised as 92 octane actually tested at 80-82. Samples were taken from various gas stations.)
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Old 09-16-2021, 12:21 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by arpad_m View Post
If this video is still true, the situation is pretty bad there: https://youtu.be/ymHHbHyD_Hw

(TL;DR: gas advertised as 92 octane actually tested at 80-82. Samples were taken from various gas stations.)
Yes, that is true
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Old 09-16-2021, 01:56 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by aronSlusa View Post
So is the higher octane gas over in Russia refined worse than our higher octane in the states here, is that what you're saying?
I'm just curious is all.
Normally yes
Big problem with all turbo engines due to fuel octane
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:37 AM   #13
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So, ultimately, even MORE power could be gained if they had consistent, decent fuel availability like we do here in the states.

I will just add that no, valvesprings will never add power unless there is a problem with them and the ramp rates of the cam you are using. And there is no problem with the valvesprings stock with stock cams, so no power to be gained there.

So, the power gained is via upgraded stock TD04 turbo, intercooler and piping, no cat, K&N drop-in filter and a tune. But that is hampered by too low of octane fuel availability.

Good to know all around. Pretty much validates my own and a few others calculations and observations in regards to the LTG. If you had fuel like we do in the states you would probably be around 10-15hp more.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:39 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by arpad_m View Post
They don't cross at 5252 rpm because torque is measured on this dyno graph in Nm instead of lb-ft. The crossover point varies depending on units (hp vs kW, lb-ft vs Nm).
Yeah, I figured it was just a graphing representation issue. I did the calculations to ft/lbs tq and they cross at 5250ish.
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