05-06-2021, 08:58 PM | #8275 | ||
Account Suspended
Drives: 2017 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: May 2012
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,692
|
Quote:
Quote:
In all realness, there was a lot of truth to that debate back then. A bolt on GT with proper gearing and weight reduction and on an E85 tune COULD potentially keep up with a stock ZL1 even if only for a short burst. I'd say by 70-80 the ZL1's rate of acceleration will be higher than the GT tho. And that kinda just means that in their own particular environment certain cars can beat other cars even if they are ultimately slower. The C8 will beat a GT500 to 60 MPH for sure. But it is all over after that. There have also been some C8s that were able to keep up with ZL1s on a roll up to a certain point. And not for nothin, but outside a timed event, it is possible that a ZL1 could cover a quarter mile distance quicker than a GT500 as we saw with the Throttle House (or whoever they were) comparo. FTR, I raced a highly modded WRX to about 130. This was in my HC and it was on a private track. We started off from about 50 MPH and I got the jump...until about 80 MPH or so when he basically flew by me. This happened 3 times. |
||
05-06-2021, 10:11 PM | #8276 | ||||
Drives: 2021 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,209
|
Quote:
Like Blaq said, it was only momentary, as a ZL1s extra hp would have widened the gap the longer the theoretical race went on. Horsepower is work over time, and 3 seconds just isn't much time for the extra hp of the ZL1 to do the extra work of accelerating the car. It was a stat I cherry picked as being close because I was surprised at the time. And as far as a ZL1 not being comparable to a GT500...I disagree. They are comparable in every performance metric except for a straight line. Even then, in street conditions from a low speed, they aren't that far off 0-80 mph or so. I agree from a 50+ roll the GT500 is going to walk a ZL1 assuming the GT500 can hook up (again, ZL1 = better weight distribution). The C6 stock ZL1 fast list has a couple of high 10.9s in the high 120s, which is slower than a GT500 fast time, but not world's apart. And we know in braking and handling the ZL1 is easily comparable to a GT500. Every test I've seen the ZL1 actually stops better than the base GT500 and on par w/ the GT500 CFTP. The ZL1 has a quicker Motortrend figure 8 time than even the GT500 CFTP: ZL1 is 23.1 sec vs 23.5 sec. for the CFTP and 24.1 sec for the base GT500. I'm not saying the ZL1 is faster than a CFTP GT500 around a track, it's not; that's the ZLE's level. I think the figure 8 times are evidence of the better Alpha chassis, better weight distribution, superior eLSD diff., and lighter weight. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
It had 3.55s, which helped for short bursts. That combined with the 4.7 first gear allowed it to send ~7,500 ft-lbs to the rear tires, which is a lot. See my previous post which shows the ZL1 can send ~8,700 ft-lbs to the rear tires - neither of which the cars can fully put down on street tires in 1st gear. And in the form I had my GT it was ~180 lbs lighter than a stock ZL1. Gearing+lighter weight+flat high rpm torque curve meant my GT could sort of hang for a short moment before the extra work the LT4 is capable of would lay my GT to rest. I think that is a similar comparison (but in reverse) to the ZL1 and GT500 in a straight line. The ZL1 is lighter and less powerful, but can sort of hang for a bit at lower speeds (and definitely from a dig with the extra torque and better weight distribution). The GT500's extra hp will show over time and walk away from a ZL1 as the race goes on. I can honestly say that I don't regret getting my ZL1 instead of paying more for a base GT500. I've seen 3 GT500s up close since I got my ZL1 and wasn't envious of any of them (they were sweet though). I thought about how my car performs as good or better (except in the 1/4 mile), but for less money. That's how I know I made the right choice.
__________________
2021 Camaro ZL1 A10
2022 GR Supra 3.0 Past: 2018 Mustang GT Premium w/ PP1, MR, and A10 2007 MazdaSpeed3 1995 Pontiac Trans Am 1987 Camaro Z28 |
||||
05-07-2021, 01:14 AM | #8277 |
Drives: like an old lady Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: indiana
Posts: 2,395
|
i say they aren't comparable bc of the price points.
__________________
2016+ camaro: everyone’s first car
|
05-07-2021, 11:19 AM | #8278 | |
Drives: 2017 Camaro 1SS Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: NH
Posts: 1,692
|
Quote:
Look, the basic idea that with enough modifications, the lighter N/A version of the car could, in some situations, get it close to the heavier/supercharged car, does have some basis. However, I maintain my opinion that you did not have enough work done on your own 5.0 to actually compete with a ZL1 in the way that you have said in the past. My own Camaro SS has some bolt on mods, so I do have some understanding on this subject. With old (3-1/2 years on the car) PS4S 275 tires on back, I ran 11.5@122, so this is a faster car than your 5.0 was. However, I still would not go so far as to say it was fully up to the ZL1. Best stock ZL1 I've seen here was 11.4, but they could do better than that. Which brings us back to the enough modifications part of the equation, as my car is far from a full bolt on. If my car was true full bolt on, would it then pull as hard as a stock ZL1 at certain speed areas like the theory, well, maybe. Note that I'm focusing on street tires, as giving one car the advantage of drag tires would make for an uneven contest. |
|
05-07-2021, 12:23 PM | #8279 | ||
Drives: 2013 C6Z06 Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: PA
Posts: 1,577
|
Quote:
Quote:
I was being naïve in my response just basing it on hp and didn't think it through. And yes my 480hp for JMartin's car was based on his bolt ons & E85 tune
__________________
Old Ride: 2016 Callaway SC630 Camaro SS
Last edited by TheRealJA105; 05-07-2021 at 12:42 PM. |
||
05-07-2021, 12:42 PM | #8280 | |
Drives: 2013 C6Z06 Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: PA
Posts: 1,577
|
Quote:
Nope I've never launched a 760 hp car but I've been down the strip faster than you with less car and I could lap you on the road course in a 15 min session. Oh wait I forgot you only go to private 200+mph road courses
__________________
Old Ride: 2016 Callaway SC630 Camaro SS
|
|
05-07-2021, 12:46 PM | #8281 | ||
Drives: 2021 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,209
|
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
2021 Camaro ZL1 A10
2022 GR Supra 3.0 Past: 2018 Mustang GT Premium w/ PP1, MR, and A10 2007 MazdaSpeed3 1995 Pontiac Trans Am 1987 Camaro Z28 |
||
05-07-2021, 02:37 PM | #8282 |
Account Suspended
Drives: 2017 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: May 2012
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,692
|
At this point my 18 GT has catted 1-7/8 LTs to a full 3" exhaust, 93 octane custom tune, cai, and I have a ported IM that I will be installing probably tomorrow. I would say that it is not the car to sleep on in a roll to about 110 MPH. I have the 3.55 rear option BTW. So far I was able to convincingly beat a SRT8 to about 120 and I do think that if I got the jump and if a ZL1 driver was to underestimate me, then I could potentially give him a hard time up to about 100-110. From what I can feel the GT does start to get lazy at about 110 whereas my ZL1 and HC always felt strong at that point. I figure the effects of the gearing are starting to come into play at those speeds.
I had a shot at racing a modded and blown Roush GT (18+) a few weeks ago. He was stick shift tho. I could tell for sure he had a blower and LTs at the very least along with other more cosmetic stuff (hood, etc). Anyway, from a 40 roll when we both hit it he got a slight jump but after that I was slowly reeling him in up to about 110 where he let off. At that point it was pretty obvious that I was overtaking him. Again, my ZL1 has nothing but a catback and cai. If he was auto trans then I suspect it would have gone differently tho. What are we talking about again...?? |
05-07-2021, 05:18 PM | #8283 | |
Drives: 2017 Camaro 1SS Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: NH
Posts: 1,692
|
Quote:
Now with you using fantasy or hero high-11 for the 5.0 baseline, are you also using a high-10 baseline for the ZL1? Instead of 11.4 magazine time as baseline for the ZL1? Because the latter would only be fooling yourself, pretending that the 5.0 is much closer than it really is in other words. |
|
05-07-2021, 08:43 PM | #8284 | |
Drives: 2021 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,209
|
Quote:
Anyway, yes, as I stated in my above post, high 10.9s for the ZL1 from the C6 best times list. Best to best, it's almost a second quicker in the 1/4 mile, and almost 10 mph better trap speeds (128-129 mph "best list" vs 119-120 mph for the GT's high 11 sec runs). That's a pretty big gap, no doubt.
__________________
2021 Camaro ZL1 A10
2022 GR Supra 3.0 Past: 2018 Mustang GT Premium w/ PP1, MR, and A10 2007 MazdaSpeed3 1995 Pontiac Trans Am 1987 Camaro Z28 |
|
05-08-2021, 07:58 AM | #8285 |
Drives: like an old lady Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: indiana
Posts: 2,395
|
what tires were on the car?
__________________
2016+ camaro: everyone’s first car
|
05-08-2021, 12:16 PM | #8286 | |
Drives: 2021 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,209
|
Quote:
That said, as I’ve said elsewhere, I’d rather have my stock ZL1 than my (former) GT boosted to 750 (crank) hp. And that was a Premium, A10, PP1, MagneRide, safe and smart, etc. The ZL1 is just in another class altogether than a GT even with the extra power and factory performance bells and whistles. That’s why the GT500 exists.
__________________
2021 Camaro ZL1 A10
2022 GR Supra 3.0 Past: 2018 Mustang GT Premium w/ PP1, MR, and A10 2007 MazdaSpeed3 1995 Pontiac Trans Am 1987 Camaro Z28 |
|
05-08-2021, 12:19 PM | #8287 |
Drives: 2021 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 1,209
|
When I did those acceleration splits I had Michelin pilot sport A/S 3+ on the car in factory sizes for cold weather. My summer tires were the factory Michelin pilot sport 4S. 255/40/19 front and 275/40/19 rear.
__________________
2021 Camaro ZL1 A10
2022 GR Supra 3.0 Past: 2018 Mustang GT Premium w/ PP1, MR, and A10 2007 MazdaSpeed3 1995 Pontiac Trans Am 1987 Camaro Z28 |
05-09-2021, 09:59 AM | #8288 |
Drives: like an old lady Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: indiana
Posts: 2,395
|
i have no idea how your car could accelerate that fast from such a low speed on those tires.
__________________
2016+ camaro: everyone’s first car
|
|
|
Post Reply
|
|
|