[Lucky1]

Thanks....

[haggler]

Originally Posted by keep_hope_alive

Nice catch, i'll update the graphic. ESP and Supercar were super close before anyway. Thanks!

EXPx3 still seems to be the most different of the three. But does Mo' Hazardous = Mo' Betta?

If you notice, the main difference there is percentage of 1-5% ingredients vs % "distillates, heavy..c18-50"

Well I spent alot of time on BITOG, the distillates is GTL base oil (made from natural gas). Both have similar PAO (5-10%). So x3 might have a bit less GTL and some group iii to thicken up the HTHS. A higher HTHS requires a thicker base oil. Based on my non-scientific analysis, the formulas look very similar. Both should perform well.

[keep_hope_alive]

Originally Posted by haggler

If you notice, the main difference there is percentage of 1-5% ingredients vs % "distillates, heavy..c18-50"

Well I spent alot of time on BITOG, the distillates is GTL base oil (made from natural gas). Both have similar PAO (5-10%). So x3 might have a bit less GTL and some group iii to thicken up the HTHS. A higher HTHS requires a thicker base oil. Based on my non-scientific analysis, the formulas look very similar. Both should perform well.

Thanks for your input! BITOG is a good resource. Bummer about the Kia oil smelling like gas - unspent fuel sneaking past the piston rings was one of the primary reasons I avoided a new Honda. I'm assuming you don't get that up to a sustained operating temp often enough given 600 mi/mo?

Is there a BITOG post comparing these I can reference?

[Dave88LX]

Originally Posted by keep_hope_alive

Thanks for your input! BITOG is a good resource. Bummer about the Kia oil smelling like gas - unspent fuel sneaking past the piston rings was one of the primary reasons I avoided a new Honda. I'm assuming you don't get that up to a sustained operating temp often enough given 600 mi/mo?

Is there a BITOG post comparing these I can reference?

I created a post a couple weeks ago here:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...fusion.360760/


There is also a post about Supercar:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...er-car.357422/

[haggler]

Originally Posted by keep_hope_alive

Thanks for your input! BITOG is a good resource. Bummer about the Kia oil smelling like gas - unspent fuel sneaking past the piston rings was one of the primary reasons I avoided a new Honda. I'm assuming you don't get that up to a sustained operating temp often enough given 600 mi/mo?

Is there a BITOG post comparing these I can reference?

direct injection + kia thetaII engine + 87 octane + transmission that short shifts alot + 80% city driving. I've done an oil analysis and 6 months is a good interval. While its true honda's have alot of fuel, they don't have a reputation for exploding like these kia thetaII engines. In oil analysis I've seen, the honda engines work ok even with fuel. If I had one I'd use a thicker viscosity oil to combat that.

DexosR is a money making move. If dexos2 was previously sufficient, what changed? The engine surely didnt. With the Camaro going away, this is going to be the "corvette" oil for 12-15 bucks a quart. What other oil producer besides mobil 1 is going to pay for certification with GM for "super cars"? With dexos2, it at least included a wider range of diesel engines and still readily available oils were slim pickings. Mobil is in bed with GM. The whole reason why they shifted to Dexos2 for factory fill is because GM is on the hook for the federal emissions warranty 8yr/80k and before they advised to use Mobil 1 15w50 full synthetic on the track. If look at the specs of this oil, it is much higher in in zinc/phosphorus which supposedly poisons the cat converter. That is why they instruct you to change back to 5w30 after track. With the ESP oil, they don't have to worry about that because its "mid SAPS" and has less of zinc/phosphorus which will get you through the warranty period. This oil is also thicker with higher HTHS = high RPM protection. Incidentally, this is also better for diesel particulate filters or gasoline particulate filters.

All this to say: its not bad oil, and I do like Mobil 1 in general. But I'm not falling for this BS just because my vehicles a '23. Especially when they concede (even in the '23 manual) that Dexos1 5w30 will be sufficient for street use. Any Dexos2 0w40 oil will be much more stout than Dexos1 5w30. M1 ESP 0w40 X3 is available for 6 bucks a quart and looks to be an excellent product.

[keep_hope_alive]

Originally Posted by haggler

direct injection + kia thetaII engine + 87 octane + transmission that short shifts alot + 80% city driving. I've done an oil analysis and 6 months is a good interval. While its true honda's have alot of fuel, they don't have a reputation for exploding like these kia thetaII engines. In oil analysis I've seen, the honda engines work ok even with fuel. If I had one I'd use a thicker viscosity oil to combat that.

DexosR is a money making move. If dexos2 was previously sufficient, what changed? The engine surely didnt. With the Camaro going away, this is going to be the "corvette" oil for 12-15 bucks a quart. What other oil producer besides mobil 1 is going to pay for certification with GM for "super cars"? With dexos2, it at least included a wider range of diesel engines and still readily available oils were slim pickings. Mobil is in bed with GM. The whole reason why they shifted to Dexos2 for factory fill is because GM is on the hook for the federal emissions warranty 8yr/80k and before they advised to use Mobil 1 15w50 full synthetic on the track. If look at the specs of this oil, it is much higher in in zinc/phosphorus which supposedly poisons the cat converter. That is why they instruct you to change back to 5w30 after track. With the ESP oil, they don't have to worry about that because its "mid SAPS" and has less of zinc/phosphorus which will get you through the warranty period. This oil is also thicker with higher HTHS = high RPM protection. Incidentally, this is also better for diesel particulate filters or gasoline particulate filters.

All this to say: its not bad oil, and I do like Mobil 1 in general. But I'm not falling for this BS just because my vehicles a '23. Especially when they concede (even in the '23 manual) that Dexos1 5w30 will be sufficient for street use. Any Dexos2 0w40 oil will be much more stout than Dexos1 5w30. M1 ESP 0w40 X3 is available for 6 bucks a quart and looks to be an excellent product.

All great points.

I'm still studying the catch can debates. Seems unnecessary but also seems to have benefits.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...5#post-6269684
thread #88 details my concern with the new Honda turbo engines but this is the first i've seen a solution by changing oil and fuel.


Things are easier with my 210k mi Honda and 50k mi Toyota just wanting 0W-20 or 0W-16, respectively, of any type of Mobil 1 Full Syn I want to use, though the rabbit hole of oil additives and variants may change result in a more specific selection, and the higher mileage model may move to 0W-30 M1 ESP. Neither are turbo and neither seem to have issues with gas in the oil.

[haggler]

Yes, the honda issue is largely summed up by this post and also the persons driving style. Efficiency is at odds with warming up the engine in something like a CRV with a tiny 1.5t, these folks are not exactly opening up the engine. Toyota's solution with dual injection is the best solution, but I think only GDI can work if you maintain a conservative oil change interval factoring in your driving environment (city/hwy), ambient temps, and driving style. I won't use anything not Dexos1 spec'd.
For the SS, I don't anticipate this being an issue. For one my car is manual, so I tend to hold higher gears rather than upshift quickly, especially when warming up the vehicle. As far as the catch can, I don't think that is as big as an issue as some people make it. Yeah I don't expect the intake valves to be as clean as a port injected vehicle, but this largely hasnt been a widespread issue since maybe mid to late 2000s on various euro GDI engines (VW/Audi/BMW). Its an over blown issue especially when using high quality gasonline (top tier) and oil (mid SAPS). I personally wouldn't add another failure point on a 50k car under warranty, but thats just me. Some people supercharge the car with 500 miles.

[Gunkk]

Also, if you send oil samples off to Blackstone labs you can get direct feedback on any concerns of fuel dilution (or any other issues) arising from your driving style, oil and/or filter choice, and choice of oil change interval...

[Mich2112]

Originally Posted by Dave88LX

The Facebook Group was on fire this weekend about a post I made about the X3 oil, how it was wrong, my engine will get destroyed, oil analysis will be done, and then warranty will be denied because I used the wrong oil.

An oil that is on the list of oils GM says to use.

What gives?

The last change I did was x3 as well because I heard it was fine with the dexos2 certification. I think I may have seen some of that on FB as well and it scared me because I ordered 0w-40 esp and when I picked it up it said ESP X3 on the label. The next time it will be Supercar or nothing.

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by Mich2112

The last change I did was x3 as well because I heard it was fine with the dexos2 certification. I think I may have seen some of that on FB as well and it scared me because I ordered 0w-40 esp and when I picked it up it said ESP X3 on the label. The next time it will be Supercar or nothing.

ESP X3 is Dexos 2 certified. It is good to use.

[Dave88LX]

People still squawking about ESPx3 not being OK. Still no data to back up the claims. I don't get it.

[Dave88LX]

Had $35 in Rewards to use...might as well get 5 more quarts plus a filter for $7.39. Still need to return all my filters.

[pauly1119]

Originally Posted by Mich2112

I found that autozone had the esp 0w-40 in stock so I bought enough to change my ss 1le. When I picked it up the bottle says esp x3. I know the regular esp was suppose to change to supercar, but is this stuff equivalent? Is is dexos2.

Not according to mobil 1, give them a call.

[cvp33]

My guess is that GM asked Mobil1 to help reformulate the oil with more zinc and less phosphorus to protect the cats. I won’t own mine past warranty which is 2025 and 48K miles so I’m not buying SUPERCAR until the price is the same as ESPx3 Dexos2.