[glamcem]

How would you compare your Turbo Miata to 1LE at track? If you had another change, would you still modify the Miata or just use 1LE instead?

Thanks in advance

[HGR Z1LE]

Lol, I guess I should start with car journal first next time? But anyway, dealer accepeted my order, but nothing offical yet according to them. Hopefully some good news this week.

Since I decided to get the camaro, I'm eager for any kinda info related to track. Your post definitely caught my eye. Looking forward to meet you in future track day at Gingerman and Grattan!

I wonder what compund do the stock pad use. if they can lock up the front wheel, they are pretty aggressive.

[Corner carver]

Originally Posted by glamcem

How would you compare your Turbo Miata to 1LE at track? If you had another change, would you still modify the Miata or just use 1LE instead?

Thanks in advance

Oooo, good question!

[Ryephile]

Originally Posted by glamcem

How would you compare your Turbo Miata to 1LE at track? If you had another change, would you still modify the Miata or just use 1LE instead?

Thanks in advance

That is a great question! I'll be able to give you a more apples-to-apples comparison after this weekend. I've had the most seat time with the Miata at Grattan, and that's where I'm taking the 1LE this weekend.

My hunch answer is, I probably would've just started with the 1LE. However I built the Miata in 2014, well before the 6g Camaro, let alone the 1LE was announced, so it's not entirely fair. I'm also a top-down fan, and doing 135 down the front straight at Grattan, or blasting through The Dragon with the top down is quite exciting. Both cars have their place.

Originally Posted by HGR Z1LE

Lol, I guess I should start with car journal first next time? But anyway, dealer accepeted my order, but nothing offical yet according to them. Hopefully some good news this week.

Since I decided to get the camaro, I'm eager for any kinda info related to track. Your post definitely caught my eye. Looking forward to meet you in future track day at Gingerman and Grattan!

I wonder what compund do the stock pad use. if they can lock up the front wheel, they are pretty aggressive.

Yea definitely start a Journal! It's always great to read individual's stories. See you at the track in the near future!

The stock pads are Ferodo HP1000, which are roughly equivalent to DS2500's, which is a nice auto-x compound and quite resilient to abuse, but honestly it'll overheat at the track. Of course they can activate the ABS within their temp range.

I just put the Power Stop Track Day pads back in the car for this weekend. I've been driving on the street with the Power Stop Z26's, and actually once I bed them in the pedal feel is similar to stock Ferodo's, their emergency braking grip is stout, and there's almost zero brake dust. IMO a good option for street.

[HGR Z1LE]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Yea definitely start a Journal! It's always great to read individual's stories. See you at the track in the near future!

The stock pads are Ferodo HP1000, which are roughly equivalent to DS2500's, which is a nice auto-x compound and quite resilient to abuse, but honestly it'll overheat at the track. Of course they can activate the ABS within their temp range.

I just put the Power Stop Track Day pads back in the car for this weekend. I've been driving on the street with the Power Stop Z26's, and actually once I bed them in the pedal feel is similar to stock Ferodo's, their emergency braking grip is stout, and there's almost zero brake dust. IMO a good option for street.

Ok, so stock is the rebranded DS2500 then. Look like camaro's brake duct help a bit. I used a set before on 4 piston brembo with no brake duct and it started to fade in just few laps.

I'm a fan of carbotech, used almost every track compound they have. They never fail me at the track, but the brake dust...... Will definitely try power stop pad in the future, the price is awfully good How is the their track day pad compare to other track pad you have use?

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

That is a great question! I'll be able to give you a more apples-to-apples comparison after this weekend. I've had the most seat time with the Miata at Grattan, and that's where I'm taking the 1LE this weekend.

My hunch answer is, I probably would've just started with the 1LE. However I built the Miata in 2014, well before the 6g Camaro, let alone the 1LE was announced, so it's not entirely fair. I'm also a top-down fan, and doing 135 down the front straight at Grattan, or blasting through The Dragon with the top down is quite exciting. Both cars have their place.

Same reasons (roadster, gokart-like feeling) why I liked my Miata and S2000 I was seriously considering to keep my S2000 then I asked to myself "Will I ever be happy with a slower car at the track days and able maintain two track cars at same time?".

Especially after going with FI on my BRZ and had to fix something every other track day, I decided to stick to a V8 and only concentrate on some handling mods. I know they don't compare and "Miata is always the answer" Maybe in the future I might get another Miata. There are so many ways to get the fun out of cars for sure; electric car is a lot of fun in city driving and small market trips, Miata/S2000 when some warm days with top down, V8 at the track days.. etc Will look forward to hearing about the comparison at the track

[Ryephile]

Originally Posted by HGR Z1LE

Ok, so stock is the rebranded DS2500 then. Look like camaro's brake duct help a bit. I used a set before on 4 piston brembo with no brake duct and it started to fade in just few laps.

I'm a fan of carbotech, used almost every track compound they have. They never fail me at the track, but the brake dust...... Will definitely try power stop pad in the future, the price is awfully good How is the their track day pad compare to other track pad you have use?

On the Camaro I've only tracked on the Power Stop Track Day pads. To me they feel really similar to a Carbotech XP12 / G-Loc R12. Ironically I find Carbotech's brake dust a big positive, as it's non metallic and doesn't eat wheel paint like a sintered or semi-metallic pad.

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Ran at Grattan yesterday with the Audi Club, which are a great group to run with. Jaymsu was there on Friday, bummer to have missed him! There was also a modded white 5th gen Camaro, and a super clean 4th gen SS.

The 1LE is quick. Since I don't often run with the Audi Club, they just guessed and put me in Intermediate. In the first session I literally lapped most of the field twice. I actually felt bad because I was in everyones mirrors so often and so quick that I was messing up their runs as much as I couldn't get one clean lap. It wasn't fair for anyone. The hosts were very accommodating and put me in the Instructor group. That was much better but I also lapped those guys fairly easily. The only car/driver that was similar in my group was a nicely driven 997 GT3, and he was about 1 second slower a lap. A friend brought his amazing Caterham on Hoosier bias plies and we both turned 1.26.6 bests, his cornering was a couple tenths of a g better and I made it up with power. My friend Tim in his very well prepped and cleanly driven Exige S was the only car clearly quicker than me in the 1LE, roughly 1 second quicker a lap. I'm not trying to brag, I'm trying to highlight how quick the 1LE is. Unfortunately both those guys were in the Advanced group, I would've loved to dice it up. Next time!

I was also able to be quite consistent, staying within a few tenths, traffic notwithstanding. This video is when they moved me to the instructor group, and then I lapped all the instructors too.

Skip to 18:00 for roughly the start of the quickest of this session, a 1.26.6. I did a couple of those this weekend. This car is so easy to get the max out of it.



Sound this time, by request! You'll notice Grattan's asphalt surfacing makes the tires VERY loud. Grattan's grip is noticeably lower than other tracks; knocking a few tenths of a g off any tire vs. a normal concrete track.

Also, at the end of this session, a huge LOW FUEL popped up right at the end, so I immediately cruised back to the pits. 5.2 MPG on-track. She's thirsty!

[Ryephile]

-->glamcem: 1LE vs. turbo Miata at Grattan. The Miata feels like the right scale for the track, which is so tight with awkward elevation changes and both on and off-camber challenges. Yet the 1LE is sooo much easier to get the max out of it. In the 2nd session, I was already within 2 tenths of my quickest of the day, and stayed there. Boom there's the limit. The Miata isn't nearly as communicative at the limit, nor as compliant in the rough stuff like Grattan's terribly bumpy "back straight".

Some pictures: Super gloomy weather, and not warm either.

IMG_1374.jpg by Ryephile, on Flickr

IMG_1373.jpg by Ryephile, on Flickr

IMG_1381.jpg by Ryephile, on Flickr

Rotary Mazda!
IMG_1378.jpg by Ryephile, on Flickr

older ACR Viper, which thoroughly scared its owner as it was his first day with it.
IMG_1383.jpg by Ryephile, on Flickr

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

-->glamcem: 1LE vs. turbo Miata at Grattan. The Miata feels like the right scale for the track, which is so tight with awkward elevation changes and both on and off-camber challenges. Yet the 1LE is sooo much easier to get the max out of it. In the 2nd session, I was already within 2 tenths of my quickest of the day, and stayed there. Boom there's the limit. The Miata isn't nearly as communicative at the limit, nor as compliant in the rough stuff like Grattan's terribly bumpy "back straight".

Some pictures: Super gloomy weather, and not warm either.

I hear you I had a similar experience at the ORP this weekend. I also felt like the BRZ and S2000 felt a lot better match in tighter tracks (like ORP) than those heavier cars but it seems like the things are changing as they said in the MT ZL1 episode "world is upside down"

This past weekend I improved my personal best by a whopping 3 seconds with bone stock 1LE (compared to Rotrex build BRZ with Hankook Z214s) and then later that afternoon, I put the Trofeo Rs and improved another second. My best lap with the BRZ was 1:58.2 and with the 1LE 1:54.7. With that said, I only had one session with the Trofeo Rs and I feel there might be still some room for improvement. Z214s are still a notch above the Trofeo Rs also

I will post some detailed comparison and videos today

As you mentioned, the key difference is the confidence. Even with the weight disadvantage I also felt the 1LE communicates better than the BRZ and easier to catch a slide very composed track car (the best I've ever had simply put )

[Ryephile]

You nailed it right there, the confidence is what makes such a big difference to the pace.

I will say, that while at Gingerman my gut reaction was to go with a square tire setup, at Grattan it felt like the stagger was appropriate, as I was spending more time managing the rear than waiting for the front end. It could also simply be the very different natures of each track. On paper it still makes sense to have more tire where the weight is.

Oh, one more thing. It appears my front rotors are already starting to "spider"

Spidery cracks in rotors by Ryephile, on Flickr

[glamcem]

and that's after how many events? I also posted a picture of my rotors on the DBA thread:
http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showpo...3&postcount=34

[Ryephile]

LOL, we just cross posted. That after 3 full days. More specifically, nine 20 minute sessions, one 30 minute, and three 25 minute sessions. 285 minutes total, and pushing near or at the max every lap.

At Grattan, the tough braking spots are turn 1 from 140 down to 60 and then the back straight from 100 down to 45.

I managed to IR my brakes. Of course the IR can't read the discs themselves, but the disc hubs were showing 670F after cool-down lap, and calipers were 450F. Youch.

[Ryephile]

Just ordered some Alcon caliper temp strips. My hunch is I'll need to engineer a better brake cooling duct.

[HGR Z1LE]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

On the Camaro I've only tracked on the Power Stop Track Day pads. To me they feel really similar to a Carbotech XP12 / G-Loc R12. Ironically I find Carbotech's brake dust a big positive, as it's non metallic and doesn't eat wheel paint like a sintered or semi-metallic pad.

I think the brake dust issue I had is subject to heavy car and no brake duct cooling. I see brake temp well above 1000F all the time. I was black flag at Gingerman once becasue the corner worker at T11 saw my rotor glowing. Your brake temp is definitly warm, but I guess it's ok for stock set up. Adding a brake duct to the camaro seem pretty easy. Since there is a duct opening already, just need to mod the back plate and add the hose.

1:26.6 at Grattan is definitely fast! That's on par with GT350 and C7 Z51, or even faster.