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Old 06-26-2019, 11:17 AM   #29
protovack
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slickcas View Post
My Company makes parts for the mustang and have not even seen anything on the S650. Usually start seeing stuff about 18 - 24 months out. Now the S550 we actually have some new equipment ramping up higher production. I wish we made parts for Camaro but GM is very ...... nicest way to put it is not reliable on their suppliers and likes to put them out of business Lol
Read...has higher quality standards
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Old 06-26-2019, 11:23 AM   #30
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“Delayed untill further notice” is corporate talk for It’s really canceled but we’re embarrassed that the information got leaked so we changed it to delayed until further notice.
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Old 06-26-2019, 11:58 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Jeb114 View Post
GM said it is Shelved, That alone will kill sales, watch them drop over the next 6 month's. The new LT1 is their way of reducing V8 engine stock. The Z/28 was used to eliminate the stock of LS7 engines. Also the 2020 election will change the direction of automobiles in this country forever. Car companies are trying to read the Tea leaves, I am sure its shelved until the election! The auto industry does not want to get caught going in the wrong direction!!!
Yea if that was the case then I'm sure they'd have no problem telling us that.
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“Delayed untill further notice” is corporate talk for It’s really canceled but we’re embarrassed that the information got leaked so we changed it to delayed until further notice.
I'll keep that in mind when the 7th Gen rolls out.
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Old 06-26-2019, 12:27 PM   #32
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Yea if that was the case then I'm sure they'd have no problem telling us that.

I'll keep that in mind when the 7th Gen rolls out.
Wow , so confident. hoping your still a active member in 3-4 years.
Time will tell.
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Old 06-26-2019, 01:01 PM   #33
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Sadly, this was what I feared was coming but hoping wasn't. When GM pulled Al O out of being in charge of the Camaro division and put a parts and accessories guy in charge, that was rather telling. "Delayed" is corporate spin-speak for the purposes of damage control so they can continue to sell through existing inventory.

It's starting to look like they want to go the same direction Ford has; discontinue sedans altogether, and focus on trucks and SUV's. Except Ford has enough smarts to understand their market for the Mustang and make it work. GM apparently doesn't have that, or doesn't care anymore which is the way the "shelved" statement comes across. No camo models seen anywhere is pretty much confirmation.

The frustrating part is under the skin the Camaro is a world-class car. I put the blame on the design department; most likely management, who just didn't know what to do with the car. That was painfully evident in the refresh designs which looked like an attempt to blatantly pander to the toy robot crowd, while completely ignoring the demographic they'd priced it in. It wasn't too expensive for the way it performed, it was too expensive for the way it looked more than anything else. Once you go above $40k, the competition for that demographic is extremely intense; everybody wants them. Now you aren't competing against Mustangs, you're competing against BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Jaguar, Alfa Romeo just to name a few. Camaro doesn't and didn't have the prestige or snob appeal that so many of those other names have, and it doesn't have the looks; either on the outside or inside to compete for the same dollars everybody else is competing for.

I realize the fans here think the Camaro is fantastic and will be offended by the thought that it doesn't match in looks to the "famous" brands, but the problem is Chevy needs to make the Camaro appeal to more than the fans here to keep it alive, and it just hasn't.

I've tried over the years to come up with design ideas in some of the threads I've posted, predicting and forecasting this very time; concerned that it was coming. I still believe the Camaro is a very viable car IF they would go back to what made it such a success to begin with, and reinvent that. However it now appears not only are they not going to do that, they don't really care. They aren't paying any real attention to any other sedan either, which is corporate stupidity in the extreme. Meanwhile, Japan and South Korea are happily taking over the affordable sedan segment that American companies pretty much handed over to them.

SUV's and trucks are a market bubble. As the price keeps climbing, the same thing is going to happen to them that happens to the housing market. Once the price hits a certain point which is very hard to predict... pop goes the weasel. Suddenly people stop buying and holding onto what they have, and a "hot" market becomes an over-saturated fire-sale because the production that was hoping the gold rush would never end, has way over-produced. Then what? GM and Ford will have shot themselves in the foot as customers start looking for a nice and affordable alternative, which Japan and South Korea will have readily available. A market that GM and Ford used to own, but just gave away.

It's a very sad day to know that the Camaro we've known and loved, wasn't loved enough by the people in charge to make it be what it could and should be. No visionaries; just another American corporation after all.
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Old 06-26-2019, 01:10 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc View Post
SUV's and trucks are a market bubble. As the price keeps climbing, the same thing is going to happen to them that happens to the housing market. Once the price hits a certain point which is very hard to predict... pop goes the weasel. Suddenly people stop buying and holding onto what they have, and a "hot" market becomes an over-saturated fire-sale because the production that was hoping the gold rush would never end, has way over-produced. Then what? GM and Ford will have shot themselves in the foot as customers start looking for a nice and affordable alternative, which Japan and South Korea will have readily available. A market that GM and Ford used to own, but just gave away.

It's a very sad day to know that the Camaro we've known and loved, wasn't loved enough by the people in charge to make it be what it could and should be. No visionaries; just another American corporation after all.



Absolutely agree with this. I think it's extremely short sighted to go after the CUV market so hard and (almost) abandon most everything else. The market WILL change again, then GM will be YEARS out of development to try to play catch up. GM has solid trucks and sales, they just need to hire some real designers. I don't know what is happening there with the way some of these vehicles look.

As I said in another post, they need to go after Gen Z and start building and designing for them, at prices they can afford. Millenials might be a lost cause, at least on pony cars.
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Old 06-26-2019, 01:13 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by BlaqWhole View Post
No you just chose to interpret it the way you want for whatever reason. And you are, like other media outlets, using words and language to make people think a certain way instead of reporting honestly. So going by your interpretation of the definition of "shelved", the S650 Mustang and the next Gen Chally are both "shelved" also. And I guess you could say 2 years ago before we knew any info on the C8 Vette than it was "shelved" at that time as well. Am I correct? Let's go around and find every vehicle that is currently "shelved".
I interpreted it by its literal definition. The car is shelved based on the reports coming out.

What you decide to speculate will happen after the post-shelving is where the actual debate lies. But for you to keep saying it's "not shelved" is inaccurate.

I frankly have no idea what point you're trying to make in the meandering latter part of your post. I have no idea if all the cars you're listing have actually halted their plans at some point, but if they have, those were shelved. If not, they weren't shelved. You're overcomplicating this greatly...
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:14 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by RealG View Post
Wow , so confident. hoping your still a active member in 3-4 years.
Time will tell.
I probably won't be as active in 3-4 years. At least not on C6. I'll be on the 7th Gen Camaro forum, LOL!! Actually I'll be on the C8 Vette forums since I'm moving away from this segment of vehicles. I'm stepping it up to the next level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc View Post
Sadly, this was what I feared was coming but hoping wasn't. When GM pulled Al O out of being in charge of the Camaro division and put a parts and accessories guy in charge, that was rather telling. "Delayed" is corporate spin-speak for the purposes of damage control so they can continue to sell through existing inventory.

It's starting to look like they want to go the same direction Ford has; discontinue sedans altogether, and focus on trucks and SUV's. Except Ford has enough smarts to understand their market for the Mustang and make it work. GM apparently doesn't have that, or doesn't care anymore which is the way the "shelved" statement comes across. No camo models seen anywhere is pretty much confirmation.

The frustrating part is under the skin the Camaro is a world-class car. I put the blame on the design department; most likely management, who just didn't know what to do with the car. That was painfully evident in the refresh designs which looked like an attempt to blatantly pander to the toy robot crowd, while completely ignoring the demographic they'd priced it in. It wasn't too expensive for the way it performed, it was too expensive for the way it looked more than anything else. Once you go above $40k, the competition for that demographic is extremely intense; everybody wants them. Now you aren't competing against Mustangs, you're competing against BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Jaguar, Alfa Romeo just to name a few. Camaro doesn't and didn't have the prestige or snob appeal that so many of those other names have, and it doesn't have the looks; either on the outside or inside to compete for the same dollars everybody else is competing for.

I realize the fans here think the Camaro is fantastic and will be offended by the thought that it doesn't match in looks to the "famous" brands, but the problem is Chevy needs to make the Camaro appeal to more than the fans here to keep it alive, and it just hasn't.

I've tried over the years to come up with design ideas in some of the threads I've posted, predicting and forecasting this very time; concerned that it was coming. I still believe the Camaro is a very viable car IF they would go back to what made it such a success to begin with, and reinvent that. However it now appears not only are they not going to do that, they don't really care. They aren't paying any real attention to any other sedan either, which is corporate stupidity in the extreme. Meanwhile, Japan and South Korea are happily taking over the affordable sedan segment that American companies pretty much handed over to them.

SUV's and trucks are a market bubble. As the price keeps climbing, the same thing is going to happen to them that happens to the housing market. Once the price hits a certain point which is very hard to predict... pop goes the weasel. Suddenly people stop buying and holding onto what they have, and a "hot" market becomes an over-saturated fire-sale because the production that was hoping the gold rush would never end, has way over-produced. Then what? GM and Ford will have shot themselves in the foot as customers start looking for a nice and affordable alternative, which Japan and South Korea will have readily available. A market that GM and Ford used to own, but just gave away.

It's a very sad day to know that the Camaro we've known and loved, wasn't loved enough by the people in charge to make it be what it could and should be. No visionaries; just another American corporation after all.
This is a very logical response. Thank you for being realistic and putting things in reasonable terms. I do agree with you on the looks. And partially on how the looks compare to cars like the M4 etc. Good points.
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:23 PM   #37
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Keep drinking the Kool-Aid BlaqWhole spin it any way you want but until further notice the new Camaro is dead unless GM has a change of heart in the next year or so, if they want to be ready for 2024.
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:30 PM   #38
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Keep drinking the Kool-Aid BlaqWhole spin it any way you want but until further notice the new Camaro is dead unless GM has a change of heart in the next year or so, if they want to be ready for 2024.
My Kool-Aid is C8 Z06 Vette flavored so...it doesn't really matter what happens with the Camaro for all that concerns me. Like I've been saying for the past year now, the ZL1 I have is the last Camaro I'll buy. That is unless GM throws the LT5 in it as a going away send-off. If that happens I'll be ditching my Hellcat for whatever name they'll be giving it..."Z28", "Z/28", whatever.

I know you think this stings so I hate to burst your bubble. But if it does end then the Camaro will have ended as the best all-around performing car with the absolute best value ever. GM truly made a one of a kind vehicle that no other company could hope to match in price and performance. And it destroyed cars that cost the same price while keeping up with cars that cost much much more. So if it does end, it'll be like Michael Jordan retiring on top of his game!!
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:38 PM   #39
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GM is putting out the "delayed, not terminated" story to protect current Camaro sales. Call it whatever you want, but there is currently no development team for a 7th gen Alpha2 platform Camaro. The team was disbanded because the Camaro7 under development had exactly the same flaws that compromised sales of the Camaro6, and to fix the flaws they would have had to basically throw out years of development time and money to start over.

Given Camaro6 sales, it would have been a hard sell to bring the Camaro7 to market, but to ask for extra development funds in order to fix the Camaro7 design flaws carried over from Camaro6? It would have been ludicrous.

No Camaro based on the Alpha2 platform will ever be available for sale short of a seismic change in the sports car market. A future VSS-R based Camaro is a possibility, but by the time we get one it will probably feature dual motors instead of a V8.
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:40 PM   #40
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Ah screw it...I give up. If you can't beat em, join em.

Yes everyone, the Camaro is doomed. It's over. We had a good run...bye forever...in 4 years that is. I mean, anything can happen in 4 years but I'll just assume that the Camaro is doomed.
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:45 PM   #41
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Yehhh...Not Shelved....Yeh!!MCGA!!! Make Camaro Great Again
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:48 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZCamaroFan View Post
there's only about 5 threads that have been started yesterday on Camaro 5 and 6 based on that baseless article.

is that really enough?

smh
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