[17rsvert]

... when it comes to staying in the automotive press with the introduction of new trim levels.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/enth...ns/ar-BB15z2sW

It seems that every year Ford is rolling out a new Mustang that keeps the brand in the news. I don't even follow this that closely, but off the top of my head I can name the Boss, Bullitt, Shelby GT350, Shelby GT500 and I think there's performance packs as well as a higher level EcoBoost, and now the Mach 1.

Not saying Mustang's are better cars, but the marketing seems to be better. New trim levels mean more road testing, reviews and write ups.

Where's IROC Z, Z/28, and Berlinetta?

[HCI2000SS]

Seems like Ford cares about the Mustang a whole lot more than Chevy does about the Camaro. Too bad

[bobby35ny]

GM thinks customers are stupid. Hey lets change the paint colors and add more decals to the Camaro, They will buy anything. At least when Ford or Dodge does it they throw in 10 or 15hp!

[carguy55]

Title should be Ford keeps making Mustangs to try to beat Camaro. I agree Chevy needs to up there game with some more HP like the new 570HP LS7 in a new Z/28.

https://www.chevrolet.com/performanc...s/ls/ls427-570

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

They are keeping their product relevant - smart marketing, like Dodge with the Challenger. Who has had more trim levels introduced in the last 5 years (since 2015) - Dodge Challenger or Mustang?

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by carguy55

Title should be Ford keeps making Mustangs to try to beat Camaro. I agree Chevy needs to up there game with some more HP like the new 570HP LS7 in a new Z/28.

https://www.chevrolet.com/performanc...s/ls/ls427-570

Looks like a great engine. It's been a while since I looked, but don't those cam specs. look similar to a Stage 1 comp cams level duration and lift?

If GM introduces a Z28 with this engine, Ford will have to re-introduce a Cobra with the Aluminator 5.2 XS: https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6007-A52XS

[Brudda*Termite]

Just saw the Mach 1 preview in an article today. Ford kills it with the marketing for sure, but the proof is in the test drive...

[Spartan268]

Fords main halo sports car is the Mustang hence all the attention/advertising towards it. Chevy cares more about the Corvette in that department, otherwise in general they seem to focus more on trucks than anything else. The Camaro has always been an afterthought in my opinion. The only type of publicity we get is generally at launch or whenever a Transformers movie gets released.

[BlaqWhole]

The only thing Ford does is put the same car out but just with a different badge. A ZL1, ZLE, SS, SLE, C8, Z06, they all have varying levels of performance, different characteristics, different aftermarket appeal, etc. What's the difference between the PP2, Bullitt, and Mach1? Coolers and an auto option. Other than that they are the same car.

The Mach1 should have been somewhere between the R and the GT500. It should have been a supercharged 670-ish HP Mustang coming in around mid $65K fully optioned with PP1-ish levels of suspension. That would have been worth talking about. I'm not sure if the R is still for sale but if they wanted to protect the R then they could have made it so that it loses around a track to the R but beats everything other than the GT500 in a straight line. But this crap they're putting out here is the same ole crap that they've been putting out since the PP2.

[17rsvert]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The only thing Ford does is put the same car out but just with a different badge. A ZL1, ZLE, SS, SLE, C8, Z06, they all have varying levels of performance, different characteristics, different aftermarket appeal, etc. What's the difference between the PP2, Bullitt, and Mach1? Coolers and an auto option. Other than that they are the same car.

The Mach1 should have been somewhere between the R and the GT500. It should have been a supercharged 670-ish HP Mustang coming in around mid $65K fully optioned with PP1-ish levels of suspension. That would have been worth talking about. I'm not sure if the R is still for sale but if they wanted to protect the R then they could have made it so that it loses around a track to the R but beats everything other than the GT500 in a straight line. But this crap they're putting out here is the same ole crap that they've been putting out since the PP2.

You make some good points.

But regardless of whether it's a noticeably different trim level, like the GT500 was to the GT, or just some minor tweaks with a new badge and name, it generates press. Also since it's "new" it gets new write ups/reviews and gets included in comparison road tests against competitors. You rarely see much about 2 year old packages. By comparison, new Camaro trim level introductions are much less frequent than Mustang's. So even if it is "the same old crap" with a new name, there's a lot more press coverage out there regarding Mustangs. Smart marketing.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The only thing Ford does is put the same car out but just with a different badge. A ZL1, ZLE, SS, SLE, C8, Z06, they all have varying levels of performance, different characteristics, different aftermarket appeal, etc. What's the difference between the PP2, Bullitt, and Mach1? Coolers and an auto option. Other than that they are the same car.

The Mach1 should have been somewhere between the R and the GT500. It should have been a supercharged 670-ish HP Mustang coming in around mid $65K fully optioned with PP1-ish levels of suspension. That would have been worth talking about. I'm not sure if the R is still for sale but if they wanted to protect the R then they could have made it so that it loses around a track to the R but beats everything other than the GT500 in a straight line. But this crap they're putting out here is the same ole crap that they've been putting out since the PP2.

Originally Posted by 17rsvert

You make some good points.

But regardless of whether it's a noticeably different trim level, like the GT500 was to the GT, or just some minor tweaks with a new badge and name, it generates press. Also since it's "new" it gets new write ups/reviews and gets included in comparison road tests against competitors. You rarely see much about 2 year old packages. By comparison, new Camaro trim level introductions are much less frequent than Mustang's. So even if it is "the same old crap" with a new name, there's a lot more press coverage out there regarding Mustangs. Smart marketing.

Both good points ^ at this stage in the S550 life cycle (going on 6 years old) its taking best parts from others and mixing them together to make a new model and drum up interest. At least it offers upgraded performance and it's not just a sticker or appearance package

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Spartan268

Fords main halo sports car is the Mustang hence all the attention/advertising towards it. Chevy cares more about the Corvette in that department, otherwise in general they seem to focus more on trucks than anything else. The Camaro has always been an afterthought in my opinion. The only type of publicity we get is generally at launch or whenever a Transformers movie gets released.

I feel like this is definitely why. Some trims of Gen 6 Camaro are very comparable some trims of C7 in terms of performance, while being cheaper and even more reliable(ZL1 doesn't overheat like Z06 does).

In a way, Camaro is the middle child nobody cares about. The trucks are where the money is so of course they will get more marketing, while Corvette's halo car status sells it. That said, C8 does change things up with the mid-engine setup and that puts it clearly above Camaro, so maybe there is no need to protect the Corvette as much as they needed to with C7.

Sent from toaster or something

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Camaro doesn't have quite as much history with special models as the Mustang. It essentially has the SS, Z28 (my first car), IROC-Z, and ZL1. I think if a new Camaro IROC-Z was released, it would drum up press. But, I'm not sure where it would fit in the current Camaro lineup, TBH.

Mustang has the Shelbys (GT350, GT500), Bullitt, Mach 1, BOSS 302, GT, Cobra, 5.0 LX (sort of) and the Mustang II (joking on that last one!). And the sub trims have additional features like the Cobra R, GT350R, GT500 CFTP, etc.

[Mountain]

I agree with everyone's sentiment on GM essentially, and basically abruptly, stepping away from further developments on the Camaro just after two model years (about around/after 2018 model year) and, basically, failing to market the vehicle for the 6th Generation in the general sense (yes, the SS, ZL1 and 1LE packages marketed greatly through various channels for performance enthusiasts, but marketing was severely lacking for the general public).

Nevertheless, even with the possibility of the point of self-inflicted poor sales, the below is something to consider towards not beating this topic to death time-after-time:

Originally Posted by Bob Lutz

“The GM organization is not prone to doubling down on unprofitable ventures that show no signs of imminent recovery. GM’s powerful Detroit-based planning and product development organization never really relinquished their tight grip on design and portfolio decisions…. Outgunned by the bulletproof reputations of the Germans, the onslaught of competitor crossovers, the relative failure of the new Cadillac sedans, the lack of traction of marketing initiatives and the steadily-sinking profitability of the brand, circumstances conspired to lead everyone concerned to one conclusion—let’s end it.”

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...blackwing-v-8/

The quote is directed towards Cadillac and the Blackwing V8, but the person the quotes comes from and basic subject matter is directly relative to the situation of Camaro and sport coupes/cars. I love the 6th Gen Camaro, it's a fantastic performance platform and very well engineered, but when it lacks is where sales matter the most for it: the general public. As much as one wants to argue the Camaro isn't a sportscar, I argue it is. By basic definition, no, it isn't, but by capability and the focused-direction of the platform in general, it certainly is. Enthusiasts=sports car. General public=sports coupe/sedan. This is why the Mustang and Charger/Challenger* end up beating out Camaro in sales.

*FCA has had so much time to recoup investment costs with these platforms, they are able to offer extremely lucrative finance deals/deals making them Charger/Challenger super easy accessible to basically anyone.