[laynlo15]

I think dyno numbers on these manifolds are all worthless numbers. You have to take these cars to the track to really see the benefits. I've had parts that showed no gains on the dyno but picked up at the track. The dyno will most always disappoint you unless you have an operator that manipulates the number for you. My C7 only picked up 15 rwhp on the dyno with long tubes and no cats, went to the track and picked up 4 tenths and 4 mph. Went from a Lt1/87mm IM to a MSD/95 mm lost torque on the dyno and ran slower at the track because my 60ft times and 660 times were slower. We had to raise the rpms shift points and continue to extend the shifts points to get it to run 10.90@128 from the 11.00s we were running with the LT1 IM, but it took more than a 1/2 dozen passes to get it there. So, once again dynos are for tuning, the track shows the true torque and hp if you can hook the car on the launch.

[Anslkyn]

Originally Posted by laynlo15

I think dyno numbers on these manifolds are all worthless numbers. You have to take these cars to the track to really see the benefits. I've had parts that showed no gains on the dyno but picked up at the track. The dyno will most always disappoint you unless you have an operator that manipulates the number for you. My C7 only picked up 15 rwhp on the dyno with long tubes and no cats, went to the track and picked up 4 tenths and 4 mph. Went from a Lt1/87mm IM to a MSD/95 mm lost torque https://casinosanalyzer.com/bonuses-by-countries/germany-deu has reviews on best no deposit casino bonus codes. on the dyno and ran slower at the track because my 60ft times and 660 times were slower. We had to raise the rpms shift points and continue to extend the shifts points to get it to run 10.90@128 from the 11.00s we were running with the LT1 IM, but it took more than a 1/2 dozen passes to get it there. So, once again dynos are for tuning, the track shows the true torque and hp if you can hook the car on the launch.

I see dyno numbers as a valuable tool for tuning and understanding the capabilities of a car.

The well-calibrated dyno that I go for provides accurate and repeatable measurements of horsepower and torque. And this really helps me compare different parts and modifications, and diagnose performance problems.

Ok, while it is possible for dyno numbers to be manipulated, this is usually only done by unscrupulous operators... A reputable dyno shop will use calibrated equipment and follow standard procedures to ensure that the results are accurate.

In the case with your C7 Corvette,I suppose that the long tube headers and no cats did not provide a significant increase in horsepower on the dyno, but they did improve the car's performance at the track. This is because the headers and cats can also improve the car's exhaust flow and scavenging, which can lead to better performance at high RPM.

Additionally, your experience with the LT1/87mm intake manifold and the MSD/95mm intake manifold is consistent with what I would expect. The MSD intake manifold is a larger volume intake manifold, which can improve airflow at high RPM. However, it can also reduce torque at low RPM. This is why your car ran slower at the track with the MSD intake manifold, even though it lost torque on the dyno...

[Mountain]

Originally Posted by Megahurtz

Old news, but Pray actually made another YouTube video walking back some of his claims on the LT2 intake manifold.

Old news....

You mean where a video was put out stating the LT2 manifold was worthless, then another video posted soon-after, six (6) days later, doing a comparison between un-touched 87mm TB and LT1 manifold, then a 95mm TB on the following manifolds: LT1 ported, LT2 ported and MSD ported, to come to the similar conclusion that has been documented? Meaning that the LT2 manifold isn't worthless and has it's place...

GM, themselves, tested, documented and put out tech info that the LT2 intake is the largest contributor to the power bump in the LT2 engine over the LT1... it does something and is not a waste.

Now, is it the best option? No! That's quite dependent on the application (engine build, car use, budget goals). Just like there is a reason to go with an 87mm TB over a 95mm or 103mm. With that in mind, the LT2 was design-optimized around an 87mm TB, a TB chosen for particular reasons, although there were available options for them to source a larger TB, but GM didn't.

[6spdhyperblue]

Originally Posted by Anslkyn

I see dyno numbers as a valuable tool for tuning and understanding the capabilities of a car.

The well-calibrated dyno that I go for provides accurate and repeatable measurements of horsepower and torque. And this really helps me compare different parts and modifications, and diagnose performance problems.

Ok, while it is possible for dyno numbers to be manipulated, this is usually only done by unscrupulous operators... A reputable dyno shop will use calibrated equipment and follow standard procedures to ensure that the results are accurate.

In the case with your C7 Corvette,I suppose that the long tube headers and no cats did not provide a significant increase in horsepower on the dyno, but they did improve the car's performance at the track. This is because the headers and cats can also improve the car's exhaust flow and scavenging, which can lead to better performance at high RPM.

Additionally, your experience with the LT1/87mm intake manifold and the MSD/95mm intake manifold is consistent with what I would expect. The MSD intake manifold is a larger volume intake manifold, which can improve airflow at high RPM. However, it can also reduce torque at low RPM. This is why your car ran slower at the track with the MSD intake manifold, even though it lost torque on the dyno...

I understand what you’re saying but I would be surprised if many on this forum have more experience with dyno and track time than laynlo.

I can hypothesize how this can be true. These controllers are setup on delivering torque delivery more than any other before it. The strip provides an array of different load throughout the interval. Do you have different cam timing, ignition timing, fuel mixture in second than 4th gear? I think so.

The dyno makes it difficult to fully simulate. Just a thought

[Megahurtz]

Originally Posted by Mountain

Old news....

You mean where a video was put out stating the LT2 manifold was worthless, then another video posted soon-after, six (6) days later, doing a comparison between un-touched 87mm TB and LT1 manifold, then a 95mm TB on the following manifolds: LT1 ported, LT2 ported and MSD ported, to come to the similar conclusion that has been documented? Meaning that the LT2 manifold isn't worthless and has it's place...

GM, themselves, tested, documented and put out tech info that the LT2 intake is the largest contributor to the power bump in the LT2 engine over the LT1... it does something and is not a waste.

Now, is it the best option? No! That's quite dependent on the application (engine build, car use, budget goals). Just like there is a reason to go with an 87mm TB over a 95mm or 103mm. With that in mind, the LT2 was design-optimized around an 87mm TB, a TB chosen for particular reasons, although there were available options for them to source a larger TB, but GM didn't.

My takeaway was that with full bolt ons, the LT2 was superior up top to the LT1 but not the MSD. But it gave up some down low. However, it was half the price of the MSD.

[Mountain]

Originally Posted by Megahurtz

My takeaway was that with full bolt ons, the LT2 was superior up top to the LT1 but not the MSD. But it gave up some down low. However, it was half the price of the MSD.

Yep. Similar pattern to all other comparison testing and also piecing-together other, separate, tests that were done fairly well.

As far as performance:
3. LT1 (stock or very basic bolt-on, mild tune)
2. LT1 ported/LT2 (bolt-on, tune; wanting +HP over typical curve with low investment/wanting +HP up top with otherwise similar lower as LT1 without MSD price)
1. MSD (cam and/or heads, increased RPM)

[s346k]

i like dyno graphs for delta gains & a visual power curve.

[laynlo15]

Originally Posted by Anslkyn

I see dyno numbers as a valuable tool for tuning and understanding the capabilities of a car.

The well-calibrated dyno that I go for provides accurate and repeatable measurements of horsepower and torque. And this really helps me compare different parts and modifications, and diagnose performance problems.

Ok, while it is possible for dyno numbers to be manipulated, this is usually only done by unscrupulous operators... A reputable dyno shop will use calibrated equipment and follow standard procedures to ensure that the results are accurate.

In the case with your C7 Corvette,I suppose that the long tube headers and no cats did not provide a significant increase in horsepower on the dyno, but they did improve the car's performance at the track. This is because the headers and cats can also improve the car's exhaust flow and scavenging, which can lead to better performance at high RPM.

Additionally, your experience with the LT1/87mm intake manifold and the MSD/95mm intake manifold is consistent with what I would expect. The MSD intake manifold is a larger volume intake manifold, which can improve airflow at high RPM. However, it can also reduce torque at low RPM. This is why your car ran slower at the track with the MSD intake manifold, even though it lost torque on the dyno...

For tuning only, but so many people live and die by the dyno. Between my 16ss, C7 and 22 Lt1 I've go over 200 dyno pulls on the same dyno over the last 6 years. Every time I made a change it went to the dyno. I'm just saying if you drag race don't rely on the dyno to figure out how much hp it really makes, they just are accurate for that. I have a log for each of those pulls also and for just about every pass at the track. I had to finally delete some of my 16 SS log and some tunes. Just too many saved, but I've also been able to pass some of those tunes along to help some on this forum, so they have come in handy.

[6spdhyperblue]

I’m taking my 6spd to the track Sunday and the a10 the following week. I’ve put a ton of effort in all new torque tables. Cars seem strong on the street.
Let’s see what these LT2 manifolds can do.
Haven’t had much luck since selling the blue car but threw the kitchen sink at these two cars the last two months.

They are pulling clean and idling like factory. I’m really impressed with the results from the new torque tables.

If they don’t perform I give up!

[laynlo15]

Originally Posted by 6spdhyperblue

I’m taking my 6spd to the track Sunday and the a10 the following week. I’ve put a ton of effort in all new torque tables. Cars seem strong on the street.
Let’s see what these LT2 manifolds can do.
Haven’t had much luck since selling the blue car but threw the kitchen sink at these two cars the last two months.

They are pulling clean and idling like factory. I’m really impressed with the results from the new torque tables.

If they don’t perform I give up!

Hope it all goes well.

[6spdhyperblue]

Drove all the way there and they moved a rain date diesel event to today. Drove home. Doubt my car will get the test in before the end of the year now.

Sticking to the schedule. Moved the drag pack to the a10.
Then threw the wideband in it and did a final lean it out after all the tuning changes. Went from .875 to .89 lambda. Nailed down. In the auto 4th gear up a hill.

About 29* timing on E68

Car feels strong. Lifts the nose on the throttle more than I remember.
Running the same virtual torque tables in both cars. The dd is different in both cars but both up about 7% from stock. Confirmed the throttle is pegged open the whole way. C8 cam timing.
Hoping next Sunday is the day.

[6spdhyperblue]

Well they closed today because the forecast is 44* as the high and needed to hit 45 to open

Skunked two weeks in a row.

I’ll try next week but it’s just getting colder in the NE

[s346k]

id love to be closer to that fall brawl & cecil co. track rentals are the only way to go anymore.

[Joshinator99]

Originally Posted by s346k

id love to be closer to that fall brawl & cecil co. track rentals are the only way to go anymore.

Agreed. Went to the Cecil event in 2021 and it was way oversold. Sat in line for eternity to get a run in. Was there all day and got 4 or 5 runs in. Hopefully they scale down the car count going forward.