[Richard0nee]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The way I see it...
On the other hand, the Vette stands out from the Camaro. It is a more mature car. Guys who buy Vettes to me seem like they wanna distinguish themselves from the Camaro crowd. So I can't really see the Camaro taking the Vette's place because the Camaro doesn't have the appeal or draw the same customer base.

This is the truth right here. Corvettes compete with GTR's, Porches, etc while the Camaro competes with Mustang and Dodges. Even though performance is close with the same engine it's a step up going to a Vette in terms of status symbol.

Also, the ZL1 1LE being a fantastic track car that it is isn't faster around the track than a Z06 w/Z07.

At the ring, the Z06 posted a 7:13 sec lap (driven by Germany's Sport Auto) while the ZL1 1LE posted a 7:16 sec lap. The A10 ZL1 posted a 7:29 and all these have videos to prove. The only time the Z06/Z07 had a slower time than a ZL1/1LE was at Laguna Seca (Although a different year test wise) when the Z06 had cooling issues and pulled timing.

On a smaller track the ZL1 1LE will be right there with the Z06 tho.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

It's an interesting prospect I can see happening.

They've certainly got a point re: performance figures.

Yet...Corvette people who cannot afford the price of entry for a mid-engined Vette may not be very happy with the forced choice. Corvette is, and has always been (regardless of performance capability) a status symbol for Americans. The Camaro will likely never achieve that same status, even though - on paper - it could...

I agree performance wise its pretty much there.

However, I don't care how you slice it and I know this will be an unpopular opinion here. The Camaro will NEVER be the Corvette. It will NEVER have the prestige, history or allure that the Corvette has. I've said it many times on this forum, buying a brand new Corvette is one of my bucket list things. I have always loved Corvettes. From the time I got really into cars, the Corvette has always been a favorite of mine. It is America's sports car. It is America's Porsche 911.

If the Corvette goes midengine and with that goes into the 100K price range for a base model and the Camaro fills that slot the Corvette used to occupy, sorry not buying a Camaro if im finally at teh stage I can have my third car be a toy. I don't care if the next gen SS is faster than a Z51, it's not a Corvette. Now I am not saying I would never consider the Camaro. I am saying I would/will never consider the Camaro an alternative to the Corvette.

So obviously my opinion is if that is there thinking, I think it is a horrible miscalculation.

[rjacobs]

Tadge(the Corvette VP) has stated moving to mid-engine would add about 10k to the Vette.

BUT I dont see them building a mid engine stripper model. MAYBE a non FI car, maybe different brake options, etc... but I cant see them going to a mid engine "cheap" model. So the 100k+ price point for an entry level is about as cheap as I think a mid engine vette would be.

[greaser2]

Originally Posted by Glen e

The majority of C7’s are currently selling to retired guys that have always wanted one.... they never even considered the Camaro....That was me. And in talking to one of the biggest dealers on the East Coast in New England, they agreed that that’s their market. The mid engine in my opinion is being made because a lot of people in GM have inferiority complex when it comes to the Ford GT and want to show that they can do it too. It’ll come in over 100K for sure. I don’t see the C7 going away either. Because it’s really a different market. Let’s see what develops.....BTW, C7 sales are in the dumper so far this year.....looks like they’re running out of retired guys, they are ALL OVER south Florida these days, I must see 4-5 daily, just running errands....

Agree, I think they need to distance the two Corvette’s as the markets are different. One for retirees and one for supercar market.

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by FNxR3DNECK

Here's where I think this is wrong... Yes we are getting a mid-engine Vette soon, but I don't think the front engine Vette will end with the C-7s.

Yes the performance offered by a mid-engine setup will be a step forward from the classic front engine setup! BUT... with that comes higher costs!!! I expect the new mid-engine Vettes to come out with a base price of at least $100k, maybe even close to $150k depending on how crazy Chevy goes with it. So in my mind that right there would put the Vette out of reach for the vast majority of the current consumer base, as in the over 50+ with disposable income and the Retirees, because yes more and more younger people are buying Vettes but the majority of owners are still over 45-50.

So I think along with the mid-engine Vette we will also get a new C8 front engine model with a starting price in the $50-55k range to keep it affordable for the masses. That would give us the best of both worlds, and wouldn't hurt Chevy's bottom line.

Just my 2 cents, what do you guys think?

What makes the mid engine design more expensive? People assume mid engine means expensive, but that’s only because most mid engine cars are expensive performance cars. The MR2 was mid engine and in the $30k range. I’m sure GM could build a mid engine car for a similar price as the front engine, if they wanted to.

[Atomic Ed]

Already happened in my house. I spent many weekends last spring shopping for a Corvette; playing around with the entire range of C7's available.

It was my S.O. who drug me over to the Camaro sitting on the showroom floor and talked me into a test drive. The test drive made me realize that the Camaro had the road feel that I wanted and she liked the styling better. (No " white haired, old man" stereotype from her viewpoint, even though that is what I am.) While I still think the C7 is one of the most stylish vehicles on the road, the Camaro rings my bell from the driver's seat just like the C7's did.

Having rented a Ferrari 488 for an afternoon in Italy this summer, I was very surprised how well my Camaro with a SC compared from a performance standpoint. Kind of a disappointment in some regards. The Ferrari lost some of its golden status for me.

[FNxR3DNECK]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

What makes the mid engine design more expensive? People assume mid engine means expensive, but that’s only because most mid engine cars are expensive performance cars. The MR2 was mid engine and in the $30k range. I’m sure GM could build a mid engine car for a similar price as the front engine, if they wanted to.

I agree that they "could" make a mid-engine for close to the same price point but as someone else said I think the whole point of going mid-engine is to push the performance boundary, and of course show Ford that their $400k GT is over priced and slow haha just think of how a mid-engine Vette with the LT4 or new LT5 with some active aero would compare to the GT, and if they kept with the steel/aluminum chassis and fiberglass body it would be heavier than the GT but WAY cheaper to build!

You could be right, but I think a mid-engine Vette will start around $100k and there will still be a front engine variant in the price range that we are used to.

[Jim50thSS]

In 2015, I was working on designing some assembly tools/machines for GM Bowling Green plant. The project was for a smaller DOHC V8 with twin turbos and was definitely a mid engine. We were told it was for a Cadillac but to design with the consideration of a possibility to retool it for a larger V8 for the corvette. We were told it would be public knowledge fall of 2016, however I still haven't seen this Cadillac. I wouldn't be surprised if these spy shots of the newer mid engine vette is actually a much pricier Cadillac.

[MrChrisLS3]

The Corvette began, and in many respects, still is a 'baby boomer's" car. When the troops came back from Europe after WWII, there was a surge in imports of the British and Italian roadsters, MG, Triumph, Alpha Romero. This was the birth of the Corvette idea. As the boomer's grew up, and earnings went up, so did their requirements, and the Corvette grew up with them. First it was power, C2-C3. Then it was refinement and technology, C4. Then, around the late 90's, as these boomers got older, it was about adding comfort, the C5 and C6 were much easier to get in and out of than the previous models. Point is, the baby boomer generation has always been Corvette's base market focus.

However, today, their strategy has to change. The Corvette is losing it's fundamental base market through simple attrition. The C7 was the beginning of that move. They are moving the car more and more in the direction of attracting that market of buyer that buys the German and Italian cars. That part of the market that shrugged off the Corvette as that "cheap and cheesy" American muscle car. The C7 was solid step in that direction, but a lifetime perception is not going to change overnight. Now they need a 'hook'.

That hook is going to be the mid engine model. It will likely be the new and permanent home for the LT5. It will likely get AWD, and perhaps even some hybrid technology. Maybe a DCT transmission, or at least the A10 that won't fit in the current chassis. They're going to give this car everything they can throw at it, along with interior refinement, gadgetry, you name it. And it will probably still be about 1/3 to 1/2 the price of the Italian or German cars.

But it won't be the only Corvette they make. The mainstream Corvette will still be made in the grand touring fashion that we have come to know and love. The bread and butter of this car is the fact that it can be daily driven, provide ample room for luggage or golf clubs or shopping bags. There will always be a market for the Corvette, it's an icon.

[brantley847]

Originally Posted by Glen e

The majority of C7’s are currently selling to retired guys that have always wanted one.... they never even considered the Camaro....That was me, had one for 2 years and loved it. And in talking to one of the biggest dealers on the East Coast in New England, they agreed that that’s their market. The mid engine in my opinion is being made because a lot of people in GM have inferiority complex when it comes to the Ford GT and want to show that they can do it too. It’ll come in over 100K for sure. I don’t see the C7 going away either. Because it’s really a different market. Let’s see what develops.....BTW, C7 sales are in the dumper so far this year.....looks like they’re running out of retired guys, they are ALL OVER south Florida these days, I must see 4-5 daily, just running errands....

http://www.automobilemag.com/news/20...8-zora-expect/

The corvette mid engine will not break 100k (at least not before options). Hold that.. let me rephrase. The corvette, of any kind excluding the rare trims like ZR1, will never adequately sell over 100k. It might for the first year. After that, I'd venture to say it won't sell above 85. So while it may come in with an MSRP between 70-95 as the articles suggest, we will see 15-20k off MSRP just like we are now in some dealers here in Florida. There are multiple dealers selling Z06 1LZs below 72 in South Florida with a sticker of 84.... and those are 18s, not 17s.

The corvette does exceptionally well mid-engine if it stays in the 65 for your 1LZ up to 85 for 3LZ and 90-105 for the Z06 or similar variant. The suggestion is the C7 continues producing alongside the mid-engine for a year and then transitions to all mid-engine suggests that if they go 100 across the board the Corvette is done.

I love my American cars. I love what they mean to those of us who shed blood and tears for this country, but if you want to go toe to toe with a 911S or 9114S then that will be the death of the Corvette. The argument you are making is "guys that always wanted them". You are correct, but part of that was the realistic price window.

If any of us believe the target audience of men and women between the ages of 40-55 wouldn't pick up a 911, an M5, an AMG GT over the corvette if we were told the price would be the same, chevy would be 100% kidding themselves. I loved my 5th gen and will get into a 6th gen or a corvette..as other have said, the corvette is a status symbol to many but it does not hold the weight that a P car holds. If just the base mid-engine breaks 90, the scope of my car search just increased 10 fold and the vette is sliding down the ladder.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Glen e

The majority of C7’s are currently selling to retired guys that have always wanted one.... they never even considered the Camaro....That was me, had one for 2 years and loved it. And in talking to one of the biggest dealers on the East Coast in New England, they agreed that that’s their market. The mid engine in my opinion is being made because a lot of people in GM have inferiority complex when it comes to the Ford GT and want to show that they can do it too. It’ll come in over 100K for sure. I don’t see the C7 going away either. Because it’s really a different market. Let’s see what develops.....BTW, C7 sales are in the dumper so far this year.....looks like they’re running out of retired guys, they are ALL OVER south Florida these days, I must see 4-5 daily, just running errands....

Regarding the part in bold.... The next gen Corvette, wherever the engine may be placed, is not a response to Ford GT. Ford GT development probably started later then Corvette. Ferrari and 911 are the primary targets. Maybe GT-R to some extent, but it's so old that benchmarking that would require stepping back in time. Ford GT is now on the radar screen from a styling / performance perspective, but was never considered to be a primary competitor.

[Glen e]

That’s not the important point. The Important point is GM has always felt that they needed a car to compete with the high-end stuff. To show that they can do it.Because everybody else has a halo car above them. Call it what you want, it’s still an inferiority complex. It started when Hank the deuce won LeMans. The new mid engine will def be at
Lemans, soon...if not 6/18 then 6/19....

None of my comments are meant to be a slam. People get so defensive here…LOL

If I was at GM during that time, I’d feel the same way.

[camaro5]

Originally Posted by brantley847

http://www.automobilemag.com/news/20...8-zora-expect/

The corvette mid engine will not break 100k (at least not before options). Hold that.. let me rephrase. The corvette, of any kind excluding the rare trims like ZR1, will never adequately sell over 100k. It might for the first year. After that, I'd venture to say it won't sell above 85. So while it may come in with an MSRP between 70-95 as the articles suggest, we will see 15-20k off MSRP just like we are now in some dealers here in Florida. There are multiple dealers selling Z06 1LZs below 72 in South Florida with a sticker of 84.... and those are 18s, not 17s.

The corvette does exceptionally well mid-engine if it stays in the 65 for your 1LZ up to 85 for 3LZ and 90-105 for the Z06 or similar variant. The suggestion is the C7 continues producing alongside the mid-engine for a year and then transitions to all mid-engine suggests that if they go 100 across the board the Corvette is done.

I love my American cars. I love what they mean to those of us who shed blood and tears for this country, but if you want to go toe to toe with a 911S or 9114S then that will be the death of the Corvette. The argument you are making is "guys that always wanted them". You are correct, but part of that was the realistic price window.

If any of us believe the target audience of men and women between the ages of 40-55 wouldn't pick up a 911, an M5, an AMG GT over the corvette if we were told the price would be the same, chevy would be 100% kidding themselves. I loved my 5th gen and will get into a 6th gen or a corvette..as other have said, the corvette is a status symbol to many but it does not hold the weight that a P car holds. If just the base mid-engine breaks 90, the scope of my car search just increased 10 fold and the vette is sliding down the ladder.

That's the insider story.

C7 and C8 built at the same time at first, slowly ramp-up C8 production, and then cease C7 production.

Bowling Green has already gone through a massive add-on transition.

BG plant tours are cancelled to keep C8 secret.

PLANT TOURS

PLEASE NOTE: PLANT TOURS ARE UNAVAILABLE AND RESUME IN 2019.

Tours of the Bowling Green Assembly Plant will be closed after June 16, 2017. It will be approximately 18 months (January 2019) before tours resume after June 16th.

Gearing up: Retooled Corvette plant opened Nov. 6

The extended shutdown was for equipment installation, setting up the new car build process for the 2018 Corvette and finishing construction of the nearly $500 million paint shop.
Plant Manager Kai Spande said the total cost of reworking the plant comes to nearly $900 million.

Workers will be assembling 2018 Corvettes when the plant reopens and continue doing so through the week of Jan. 22, 2018.
They will then shift gears and start manufacturing the 2019 model of the iconic sports car Jan. 29.

http://www.bgdailynews.com/news/gear...f2734cdb6.html

Before new paint shop and other additions:


After:

[BrandX]

I am 46 years old......I find very few people in my age group see the Vette as a halo car. Most want the new Benz or BMW. If they make good money ($150,000+) they aspire to a Porsche or Maserati, etc......

I personally think the mid engine Vette will be a sales flop and a waste of Development money......

The auto industry is in the beginning stages of a transition....in 25 years both cars may become irrelevant.............

IMHO