How much boost before changing ring gap? - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

TuneAFish · 01-11-2021, 04:28 PM

I'm just doing some exploration, but I was thinking about twin turbos, and I'm wondering how much boost can you add to a stock bottom end car (intake has never even been off) before you have to take it apart and adjust ring gap?

I tried to look through the existing threads but couldn't find this being discussed.

Thanks

dreksnot · 01-11-2021, 05:46 PM

You're going to be limited by cylinder pressure and the strength of the thin ring lands on a stock LS3/L99 (which ain't that robust), and the aluminum block. If you're going to be taking apart the motor, might as well beef up the pistons/rods with forged components and you'll be able to make a few more hundred HP. That being said, numbers I have seen and experienced range from 700-850rwhp on the SBE motor, and 850-1000rwhp with forged components. Your longevity will depend on your tune and the continuous amount of power you're pushing.

Tarendor · 01-12-2021, 02:37 PM

For what its worth: I asked the guys at GPI the same question and they told me they see guys all the time running just fine with 12psi but that was the limit. (Thats what I am doing)

TuneAFish · 01-19-2021, 08:50 AM

Thanks for the replies.

Tarendor - I was reading through some of your build threads and I was wondering, did you ever get that thing to the dyno? I'm also curious, are you still using that ZL1 pump? I was wondering if you'd run out of fuel with it at 12psi in the upper RPM range.

Tarendor · 01-21-2021, 01:18 PM

I have not gotten to the dyno, I am down for winter.

When I talked to the guys at GPI when I was looking to buy my injectors they were confident that with the ZL1 pump (fpcm programmed by me using HPT) AND the ID1050x plus methonal that I would be good to 12psi with no issues. (SAID the methonal was optional too)

I have not even turned on the methonal yet.

However I am adding a msd bap. that I got in a trade because....why not? lol.

I have not ran out of fuel at all, but in tuning I only got up to 8psi before crappy weather hit and I parked him.

TuneAFish · 01-22-2021, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarendor

...because....why not? lol.

Seems logical :-)

It will be summer before I'm ready to add boost, so please keep me posted. I'm curious to hear how things go as you turn the PSI up!

Tarendor · 01-22-2021, 10:31 AM

At 8psi its very sketchy hahaha I can't wait to see the final result myself. (I have full suspension and good tires but its sketchy still and I am not going to put slicks on him)

racesloth · 01-22-2021, 12:38 PM

I am around 13psi on the SBE but running E85 and two pumps on 105lb injectors.

HOJO · 01-22-2021, 12:39 PM

I'm sure you have done your research on the forum but just for nothing...back in September I installed a BTR stage 2TT camshaft along with the AGP twin kit. Turbos are 57/57's, Injectors are AUS 1000's and I have a JMS voltage booster for fueling,all else is stock. On a loaded hub dyno I made 650 RWHP and 619 RWTQ on 8lbs of boost. I did not have my 1LE dynoed before the install but assuming the low end of what I have seen on this forum (370 RWHP), I am making 35hp per pound of boost. Just take this for what it's worth we all know dynos are just a tool. I'm sure you are already amazed at the power, it's stupid fun!!

Tarendor · 01-22-2021, 01:25 PM

As funny as it may seem...I don't care about the hp numbers.
What I want is 12psi of boost at a solid lambda and decent timing. Then I am going to add the methonal and add more timing...its all relative...compared to when I got the car its crazy lol. Their will always be faster cars out there but I plan on hurting some feelings this summer for sure.

TuneAFish · 01-23-2021, 09:23 PM

Thanks for the insights!

JANNETTYRACING · 01-27-2021, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TuneAFish

I'm just doing some exploration, but I was thinking about twin turbos, and I'm wondering how much boost can you add to a stock bottom end car (intake has never even been off) before you have to take it apart and adjust ring gap?

I tried to look through the existing threads but couldn't find this being discussed.

Thanks

Ring gaps can not be tied to a boost number as there are too many variables that effect actual combustion temperatures which is what really determines ring gap requirements.

You could butt the rings by overheating the engine all stock.

You can make 800 Wheel and never butt the rings.

It is all about temps and ring growth.

Ted.

Tarendor · 01-27-2021, 10:08 AM

Ted,

Do you reccomend converting to the 4 corner steam port vs staying with the factory 2 corner to help prevent hot spots?

JANNETTYRACING · 01-28-2021, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarendor

Ted,

Do you reccomend converting to the 4 corner steam port vs staying with the factory 2 corner to help prevent hot spots?

All of our high powered engines have 4 corner, but not always possible with all combinations.

01-11-2021, 04:28 PM	#1
TuneAFish Drives: 2015 Camaro SS M6 Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Cleveland, OH Posts: 57 View My Garage	How much boost before changing ring gap? I'm just doing some exploration, but I was thinking about twin turbos, and I'm wondering how much boost can you add to a stock bottom end car (intake has never even been off) before you have to take it apart and adjust ring gap? I tried to look through the existing threads but couldn't find this being discussed. Thanks __________________ -Rad Air CAI -GPI SS3 Cam & BTR Springs -2" Texas Speed Headers -AEM Wideband AFR -3" Full Exhaust w/Hi-Flow Cats & Single Chamber Flowmasters -McLeod RXT twin-disc w/Aluminum Flywheel -Yukon 4.11 -Nitto 555 G2

01-11-2021, 05:46 PM	#2
dreksnot Served USN - Atomic Chimp Drives: 13 Camaro LSX434 TT M6, 21 ZLE A10 Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Fort Collins, CO Posts: 1,603 View My Garage	You're going to be limited by cylinder pressure and the strength of the thin ring lands on a stock LS3/L99 (which ain't that robust), and the aluminum block. If you're going to be taking apart the motor, might as well beef up the pistons/rods with forged components and you'll be able to make a few more hundred HP. That being said, numbers I have seen and experienced range from 700-850rwhp on the SBE motor, and 850-1000rwhp with forged components. Your longevity will depend on your tune and the continuous amount of power you're pushing. __________________ In excess of 1,000WHP LSX434 \| AGP 65/65 TT \| BTR Equalizer Intake \| Trickflow 245cc cathedral \| BTR custom cam \| Cortex EBC \| n2mb WOT \| ID-1700x \| Brisk GR12S \| RPM Lv 7 TR6060 \| AGP's Triple 525LPH Fore Fuel \| Monster LT1-S Triple \| 4.11 DSS Proform 9", CF driveshaft, 1400hp axles \| Hurst Line Lock \| MGW Retro Short Throw w/old skool Hurst T-handle \| ADM solid subframe mounts \| Prothane Motor Mounts \| Revshift Poly Trans insert \| Moreno camber/caster plates

01-12-2021, 02:37 PM	#3
Tarendor Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: North Sioux city SD Posts: 446 View My Garage	For what its worth: I asked the guys at GPI the same question and they told me they see guys all the time running just fine with 12psi but that was the limit. (Thats what I am doing) __________________ 2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump

01-19-2021, 08:50 AM	#4
TuneAFish Drives: 2015 Camaro SS M6 Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Cleveland, OH Posts: 57 View My Garage	Thanks for the replies. Tarendor - I was reading through some of your build threads and I was wondering, did you ever get that thing to the dyno? I'm also curious, are you still using that ZL1 pump? I was wondering if you'd run out of fuel with it at 12psi in the upper RPM range. __________________ -Rad Air CAI -GPI SS3 Cam & BTR Springs -2" Texas Speed Headers -AEM Wideband AFR -3" Full Exhaust w/Hi-Flow Cats & Single Chamber Flowmasters -McLeod RXT twin-disc w/Aluminum Flywheel -Yukon 4.11 -Nitto 555 G2

01-21-2021, 01:18 PM	#5
Tarendor Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: North Sioux city SD Posts: 446 View My Garage	I have not gotten to the dyno, I am down for winter. When I talked to the guys at GPI when I was looking to buy my injectors they were confident that with the ZL1 pump (fpcm programmed by me using HPT) AND the ID1050x plus methonal that I would be good to 12psi with no issues. (SAID the methonal was optional too) I have not even turned on the methonal yet. However I am adding a msd bap. that I got in a trade because....why not? lol. I have not ran out of fuel at all, but in tuning I only got up to 8psi before crappy weather hit and I parked him. __________________ 2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump

01-22-2021, 10:31 AM	#7
Tarendor Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: North Sioux city SD Posts: 446 View My Garage	At 8psi its very sketchy hahaha I can't wait to see the final result myself. (I have full suspension and good tires but its sketchy still and I am not going to put slicks on him) __________________ 2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump

01-22-2021, 12:38 PM	#8
racesloth Dan Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS IOM Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Georgia, USA not the other one Posts: 1,041	I am around 13psi on the SBE but running E85 and two pumps on 105lb injectors. __________________ Dan 2010 IOM SS YSI-B, Pat G Cam, Ported CTS-V Heads, ARH LTs MBRP 3" exhaust http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...&highlight=ysi

01-22-2021, 12:39 PM	#9
HOJO Drives: 2014 Camaro SS/RS 1LE 1967 Camaro Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Fort Wayne, IN Posts: 874	I'm sure you have done your research on the forum but just for nothing...back in September I installed a BTR stage 2TT camshaft along with the AGP twin kit. Turbos are 57/57's, Injectors are AUS 1000's and I have a JMS voltage booster for fueling,all else is stock. On a loaded hub dyno I made 650 RWHP and 619 RWTQ on 8lbs of boost. I did not have my 1LE dynoed before the install but assuming the low end of what I have seen on this forum (370 RWHP), I am making 35hp per pound of boost. Just take this for what it's worth we all know dynos are just a tool. I'm sure you are already amazed at the power, it's stupid fun!!

01-22-2021, 01:25 PM	#10
Tarendor Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: North Sioux city SD Posts: 446 View My Garage	As funny as it may seem...I don't care about the hp numbers. What I want is 12psi of boost at a solid lambda and decent timing. Then I am going to add the methonal and add more timing...its all relative...compared to when I got the car its crazy lol. Their will always be faster cars out there but I plan on hurting some feelings this summer for sure. __________________ 2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump

01-23-2021, 09:23 PM	#11
TuneAFish Drives: 2015 Camaro SS M6 Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Cleveland, OH Posts: 57 View My Garage	Thanks for the insights! __________________ -Rad Air CAI -GPI SS3 Cam & BTR Springs -2" Texas Speed Headers -AEM Wideband AFR -3" Full Exhaust w/Hi-Flow Cats & Single Chamber Flowmasters -McLeod RXT twin-disc w/Aluminum Flywheel -Yukon 4.11 -Nitto 555 G2

01-27-2021, 10:08 AM	#13
Tarendor Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: North Sioux city SD Posts: 446 View My Garage	Ted, Do you reccomend converting to the 4 corner steam port vs staying with the factory 2 corner to help prevent hot spots? __________________ 2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump