[Hops]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Electric SUVs are what people are begging for. People killed manual transmission cars by choosing automatics, so they hold their phone and coffee. They killed sedans, wagons, hatches and coupes by buying SUVs. They killed handling with both of those (weight and CG) and all you are left with is acceleration...which is where EVs are far superior.

Wow, this describes the situation far more concisely than I've read anywhere!

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

Too long...didn't read it all.


For me, that sound stirs my soul. The roar of the exhaust adds to the excitement of the drive. For me, my stock Camaro SS is already too damn fast for the street. When I had my V6, sure it would quickly get up to "go to jail" speeds also, but at least I could nail it more often without worry. A high performance Tesla would also be too fast if you were to start pushing it, so then it comes down to what else does it do for you? For me, the ICE Camaro checks more boxes past just feeling fast.

Also as others have pointed out, I am curious to see what these car manufacturers come up with to make an EV sports car special, compared to any other high powered EV. As it stands now, for me, I see no reason to buy a fast car EV over a fast SUV EV. When you can get a Blazer EV with 650 HP, is a 650HP Camaro EV any better? I guess the Camaro should theoretically handle better, but both will be heavy with a low center of gravity.

Agreed, to your point, I am mostly interested in knowing what a Camaro EV or whatever they call it could offer. And to your point, how do you differentiate performance trims when they are all quick and pretty much feel the same? I mean I own a Tesla Model 3 SR+ and owned a Performance. They both shove you back in the seat enough to make you smile, one is quicker but everything else is basically the same.

[Hops]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

Also as others have pointed out, I am curious to see what these car manufacturers come up with to make an EV sports car special, compared to any other high powered EV. As it stands now, for me, I see no reason to buy a fast car EV over a fast SUV EV. When you can get a Blazer EV with 650 HP, is a 650HP Camaro EV any better? I guess the Camaro should theoretically handle better, but both will be heavy with a low center of gravity.

I'm thinking the ability to do a few 20min sessions at track day with consistent performance, yet not weigh so much. So maybe a smaller but quicker charging battery, and lot of battery cooling.

[CHASLT1]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

I can only echo these observations. Gave EGO a try in 2017 with a lawnmower, then gradually expanded the "arsenal" with a leafblower, a weedwhacker, even a chainsaw, plus a couple spare batteries so as to always have one available for uninterrupted work while recharging (these things only last 30-45 minutes on one charge). Perfect for light duty regular jobs.

When real power and much longer cycles are required, however, these are no competition to gas or diesel equipment. As far as I'm concerned, they can coexist very well, thank you, and there is no need for one to "obsolete" or "phase out" the other.

I got a smaller yard so it works perfect for me. But a small reg cab pickup would be nice in a EV version with 350 or more HP. I miss my S10's i had for years.

[digitalfutur]

If the Camaro EV looks similar to the Ferrari Purosangue SUV (with a V12), with its rear-hinged (suicide) rear doors, it'll sell well.

BTW, there's huge demand for EVs, and of course the shift away from ICE will be incremental, especially for commercial vehicles. But it will happen because there's money to be made, along with human ingenuity and smarts that don't suddenly disappear in spite of the luddite few. Car makers listen to consumers collectively.

[Devstrike]

Of course carmakers listen to consumers when it concerns their profits. They will dictate whether they want EVs or not. Manufacturers follow the profits. The performance vehicle segment is small and only Ford is willing to please enthusiasts like us with a new ICE Mustang generation. In the US they need to convince every market of consumer to go EV. Some countries are easier than others but I think it will be more difficult in the US.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by digitalfutur

If the Camaro EV looks similar to the Ferrari Purosangue SUV (with a V12), with its rear-hinged (suicide) rear doors, it'll sell well.

BTW, there's huge demand for EVs, and of course the shift away from ICE will be incremental, especially for commercial vehicles. But it will happen because there's money to be made, along with human ingenuity and smarts that don't suddenly disappear in spite of the luddite few. Car makers listen to consumers collectively.

Look at the pic, if you call that human ingenuity and those pointing it out luddites, I'm not sure what you're on.

The point about money to be made is true, though, and indeed ICE development has reached a plateau, so left alone the technology would carve out a final niche and stay there while EVs ramp up (and eventually do the same), nobody is arguing that.

Finally, carmakers, just like most modern corporations, play the perception game and have gone well beyond listening to the customer.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Palutz

To each their own .. I've been in a few Teslas and it could never replace my V8 Camaro no matter how fast they are. Driving a sports car is more than just the 0-60 or quarter mile times.

Lol I get it but if the Gen6 had launched heavier and slower than a Mustang this place would have been a $hit show. And you know it.

And the Camaro isn’t a sports car, it’s a sporty car. The Gen 6 failed, sadly, almost like the Gen 5 did. V8 sales were robust until the end. Lower trims were in the tank. If I recall the Gen 4 numbers, V8s sold pretty close to Mustang V8 volumes at the end. Overall volume couldn’t keep the plant running.

[Martinjlm]

@arpad_m, the yellow highlight in your last post points out part of the reason for the demise of sedans and the rise of CUV. Those mpg targets are for cars. For smaller cars the numbers have to be even higher to balance out the numbers from larger cars. Set that aside for a second. The targets for trucks are lower because lawmakers understand a little bit of physics and realize bigger vehicles weigh more and will get lower fuel economy. Most CUVs get classified as trucks and have lower fuel economy targets than cars with the same shadow footprint (wheelbase x track). That’s why most OEMs might have one or two cars and 5 or 6 CUVs and SUVs. It’s easier to balance CAFE.

[Hops]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Lol I get it but if the Gen6 had launched heavier and slower than a Mustang this place would have been a $hit show. And you know it.

And the Camaro isn’t a sports car, it’s a sporty car. The Gen 6 failed, sadly, almost like the Gen 5 did. V8 sales were robust until the end. Lower trims were in the tank. If I recall the Gen 4 numbers, V8s sold pretty close to Mustang V8 volumes at the end. Overall volume couldn’t keep the plant running.

If it isn’t a sports car, what motor sports does the 6th gen Camaro fail channel to the driver? It seems more at home on a road course than about any other car available now, how many other cars have a manufacturer who will warranty a car that is driven in anger for hours on a track?

[N Camarolina]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Lol I get it but if the Gen6 had launched heavier and slower than a Mustang this place would have been a $hit show. And you know it.

And the Camaro isn’t a sports car, it’s a sporty car. The Gen 6 failed, sadly, almost like the Gen 5 did. V8 sales were robust until the end. Lower trims were in the tank. If I recall the Gen 4 numbers, V8s sold pretty close to Mustang V8 volumes at the end. Overall volume couldn’t keep the plant running.

Have you even owned a G6? Handling wise, it's way more sports car than sporty car, or straight-line drag car.

[FarmerFran]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

@arpad_m, the yellow highlight in your last post points out part of the reason for the demise of sedans and the rise of CUV. Those mpg targets are for cars. For smaller cars the numbers have to be even higher to balance out the numbers from larger cars. Set that aside for a second. The targets for trucks are lower because lawmakers understand a little bit of physics and realize bigger vehicles weigh more and will get lower fuel economy. Most CUVs get classified as trucks and have lower fuel economy targets than cars with the same shadow footprint (wheelbase x track). That’s why most OEMs might have one or two cars and 5 or 6 CUVs and SUVs. It’s easier to balance CAFE.

[KMPrenger]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Lol I get it but if the Gen6 had launched heavier and slower than a Mustang this place would have been a $hit show. And you know it.

And the Camaro isn’t a sports car, it’s a sporty car. The Gen 6 failed, sadly, almost like the Gen 5 did. V8 sales were robust until the end. Lower trims were in the tank. If I recall the Gen 4 numbers, V8s sold pretty close to Mustang V8 volumes at the end. Overall volume couldn’t keep the plant running.

I don't want to argue opinions...but....

Base Camaro = sporty car
Camaro SS = (toss up?)
Camaro 1LE and above = sports car.

Agree or disagree, but the level of performance that can be had with the 6th gen, makes it a true sports car. It may not be a Corvette, but when you have levels of performance that encroach into that territory and beyond, I think it deserves to be recognized as a sports car.

...aaand I'm out.

[AZCamaroFan]

what someone views as a sports car has been up for debate for decades. for some they cannot have back seats. well a 911 has a back seat, and so do some Ferrari's. Some said they had to be convertibles. it use to be a Camaro couldn't be because it had a live axle (even though a lot of old sports cars did too) well that's long since gone. when you look at the Camaro's handling performance, the notion that it's not a sports car at this point is not very credible.