[genxer]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

This is actually a very interesting point. There are a number of large suppliers that have been hard at work making ICE more efficient. It’s more the big Tier I suppliers like Continental, BorgWarner, Bosch, Denso that are doing the heavy lifting on engine tech. Some engines from Toyota, Mazda, Hyundai-Kia are getting thermal efficiency in the 40%+ range for gasoline. This approaches the efficiency of diesel. Thing is, more and more countries and municipalities are pushing zero emissions, so a lot of that tech will go unused as OEMs pivot to electrification.

I actually didn't have efficiency in mind, just hopeful things pertaining to Camaro's with engines: LT5+ strip car, 427 Z28, awd SS & base, keeping sticks. If stuff like pre-chamber combustion comes, it should take on already liked engine layouts.

We had the change to pcv, cats, egr. Then fuel injection and overdrives. We're now at the remainder of the remainder of the remainder. Forcing engines to copy Honda or others wasn't good for likability

7 years ago, I considered the 1st gen Volt. A charge would've cost roughly a buck more now at $2.40 here, not great anymore. I picked a Cruze TD, largely because the front axle weight is better in winter. Early on, that car made an 800 mi. no stop, packed cooler-aided, no stop trip to TN; and the way back hit the Dragon. The now aging particulate filter is annoying. I'm really not saving anything over the old pushrod 4-bangers.

I just don't consider the idea of fearing climate change, anymore. It's clear, that Paris was opportunistic bending of research to fit their desired outcome. EPA & CARB's technocracy deserve to be voted down, at least for private individuals.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by dpevans

The battery tech GM is using is closer to 400+ miles per charge and most people are pretty much ready for a break after 400 miles. Stop in for a 1.5 hour dinner rest break and you're ready to go another 200 before you park it and charge it for the night. Tesla lith tech is limited to 300-350 the Ultium tech range is 400+. At about .15 a KW a 100 miles will cost you 3.50-$4 at $3 a gallon at 20mpg a car will cost $12 per hundred not including the cost of maintenance. People and corporations will start flocking to electric due to the cost savings once electric cars are priced for the masses. Need to start building the infrastructure to handle the KWs needed and soon.

True. The vehicle we’ll likely wind up with (Cadillac Lyriq) is coming in at 300+. At least for the first year. I’m not forecasting powertrain anymore, so I don’t have timing for the higher capacity packs on the tip o’ the brain anymore. If a 400 mile pack is offered for Lyriq, we’ll likely opt for it unless it is priced super stupid.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by 90503

I like my Impala and it's mileage for longer...300 plus miles....5-600 round trip, over 500 miles on one tank...Gas up maybe once on the road...It's good to make a stop anyhow...

For an EV it would have to be a very low priced economy model. The around town trips could very easily be less than 50-100 mile range each day, if not zero. I would not be interested in a 40, 50, 100K Ev. and would not use it for longer trips. It would be major overkill...and with the Impala, unnecessay.

GM should make a Volkswagen bug type cheap-o EV for around town, charge at home/overnight, no need for highway fast charge....and price it very, very affordably...like 10K for new....A true entry level EV....All that is available now is too pricey and overly equipped for what is needed by most around town...

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

This one has a 238 mile range.

or this, $4,300 in China......from GM.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ic-car-from-gm

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Number 3

or this, $4,300 in China......from GM.



https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ic-car-from-gm

That's something that will more likely succeed as a Kei car in Japan if it fits within the Kei car standards.

Chinese car buyers are actually similar to North American buyers in that they prefer bigger cars like SUVs as long as it's not too horrendous on fuel. Small cars do better in Europe and Japan.

Wuling's specialty is actually small cargo vans, which you can clearly see in this small EV. The problem is that EVs can't work as a cargo van for now due to range and charging time issues. A $2k small cargo van can have good range as long as it has a big enough gas tank, but there is only so much you can expect with the quality and quantity of batteries in a $2k EV. Very few people use Wuling to commute in China BTW; those who do probably have the Wuling cargo van for their full-time job.

[90503]

Originally Posted by Number 3

or this, $4,300 in China......from GM.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ic-car-from-gm

...Exactly..."The MINI EV’s runaway success underscores the latent demand for electric cars at the right price point. Tesla earlier this week said it plans to build a $25,000 EV in about three years. One of the biggest challenges in making EVs cheaper is the battery, which currently represents about one-quarter of a car’s cost because of the expensive metals used, such as lithium, cobalt, nickel and manganese."

No thanks on the Bolt lease. For $4,300, I'll buy two of these. But alas, where are they?

Heck they look like a Scion...I think one or two sets of golf clubs would fit...lol...

[FarmerFran]

Originally Posted by 90503

...Exactly..."The MINI EV’s runaway success underscores the latent demand for electric cars at the right price point. Tesla earlier this week said it plans to build a $25,000 EV in about three years. One of the biggest challenges in making EVs cheaper is the battery, which currently represents about one-quarter of a car’s cost because of the expensive metals used, such as lithium, cobalt, nickel and manganese."

No thanks on the Bolt lease. For $4,300, I'll buy two of these. But alas, where are they?

Heck they look like a Scion...I think one or two sets of golf clubs would fit...lol...

Attachment 1066871

The amount of trucks on the road around me will prevent me from being in anything remotely that small.

[90503]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

The amount of trucks on the road around me will prevent me from being in anything remotely that small.

Believe it or not, it's a four-seater!!

https://www.carscoops.com/2020/08/ti...-50000-orders/

It's perfect for in town, short trips. Some people ride motorcycles, right? How safe is that?


Gotta love those pedals....What could go wrong?

[Hops]

Originally Posted by 90503

Heck they look like a Scion...I think one or two sets of golf clubs would fit...lol...

Given how Transformers helped market the 5th gen Camaro, I think the Minions movie could make this car a hit!

[V8 Firebird]

The battery is going cheaper and improving quickly. Most issues are going to disappear soon.

I don't see Camaro EV would be like kind expensive and get poor performance number. I could see Camaro EV getting 800V charging capacity and over 500 miles battery range with amazing HP number like Model S Plaid.

If GM wants to catch buyer attention, I can't think any better nameplate without Camaro, Corvette, and Suburban for their upcoming Chevy EVs.

I could see combustion Camaro would continue in the market and might get last redesign or last upgrades just like Escalade. Escalade would get V-series soon, and GM would continue current Escalade until 2030 although Escalade EV would come 2025.

[43Camaro]

Originally Posted by V8 Firebird

The battery is going cheaper and improving quickly. Most issues are going to disappear soon.

I don't see Camaro EV would be like kind expensive and get poor performance number. I could see Camaro EV getting 800V charging capacity and over 500 miles battery range with amazing HP number like Model S Plaid.

If GM wants to catch buyer attention, I can't think any better nameplate without Camaro, Corvette, and Suburban for their upcoming Chevy EVs.

I could see combustion Camaro would continue in the market and might get last redesign or last upgrades just like Escalade. Escalade would get V-series soon, and GM would continue current Escalade until 2030 although Escalade EV would come 2025.

Once again if they name it Camaro, Corvette or Suburban no one in my family or friend circle will buy it. Start fresh and don't desecrate these cars. If they start fresh I'll be happy to look at one and potentially buy one. "You can put lipstick on a pig and it's still a pig".

[redcoats1976]

make a sporty electric car,style it like a 6th gen camaro or late model rustang,sell it at a reasonable price and include a home charger.if its only a 5 second 0-60 car thats fast enough for most people.but i wouldnt need one until my trusty 5th gen camaro either falls apart or gas is unavailable.

[grampi]

There are certain cars that just don't fit the EV mode. The Camaro is one of them. It needs to remain V-8 powered...

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

The amount of trucks on the road around me will prevent me from being in anything remotely that small.

Same here, and it doesn't help that 9 out of 10 pick-up trucks I see on the road drive like a-holes.

Again, if I live in Europe or Japan, that's a different story.

Originally Posted by 90503

Believe it or not, it's a four-seater!!

https://www.carscoops.com/2020/08/ti...-50000-orders/

It's perfect for in town, short trips. Some people ride motorcycles, right? How safe is that?


Gotta love those pedals....What could go wrong?

Attachment 1066876

Since this thing is marketed in China, the 2-door body form is quite puzzling to me.

In China, it's pretty common for the older generation to live with the younger generation. The young couple both go to work while their parents take care of the child. So seating 4 is not enough, and asking an older person to crawl into the back seats? Are you out of your mind? That's why people buy an SUV that can seat 5 comfortably, not to mention it can handle some of the rural roads that are unpaved.

So okay, this is pretty much only good for young, unmarried couples. As soon as they marry and their parents move in, they are gonna dump it for an SUV.

A motorcycle is even cheaper to purchase and insure. I will also run circles around one of these Kei car things on a motorcycle. Electric scooters are everywhere in China. Much easier to maneuver around than a car, no matter how tiny.

It's not like small, ultra-cheap cars haven't been tried before in China. It's not like Chery QQ is everywhere. Not to mention, the Wuling has a few competitors right now as well from some of the Chinese domestic carmakers.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by redcoats1976

make a sporty electric car,style it like a 6th gen camaro or late model rustang,sell it at a reasonable price and include a home charger.if its only a 5 second 0-60 car thats fast enough for most people.but i wouldnt need one until my trusty 5th gen camaro either falls apart or gas is unavailable.

Low 0-60mph times are easy peasy for EVs. What the market is missing right now is a EV sports car, something like you said, that looks and handles like a Camaro.

If they ever release an EV Camaro, I would expect the slow base trim to do 0-60mph in about 4 sec and the 1/4 mile in just under 12 sec. A SS 1LE trim would would do mid 3s 0-60mph and 1/4 in mid 11s and handle like it is on rails. A ZL1 equivalent should hit 0-60mph in 3 sec or less and 1/4 in low 11s. If they put a 2 speed transmission then it would get into the 10s.

Make it look sporty inside, keep some of the gauges and wrap the dash around the driver, put in some sporty seats and lots of nerd knobs for tuning the software so the car behaves the way you like it to.