[Bosse'sBoss]

Originally Posted by Mountain

I enjoyed this review, but I can't help but have a problem with comparing to the ZL1 1LE. Yeah, the ZL1 1LE is Chevy's track-focused Camaro/ZL1 and the GT350R is Ford's track-focused Mustang/GT350... but, for what the ZL1 1LE is, it isn't the better to compare to the GT350R. I would have enjoyed the review more if it were ZL1 vs. GT350R as the cars are more equivalent. The ZL1 1LE, with the stiff bushings, hard suspension mounts, race-type dampers and race-type springs makes a very odd comparison on the street, where the GT350R is, although the track-est Mustang, is still extremely streetable.

A lot of attention was directed towards the ZL1 1LE's manners on the street, which I think was a complete waste of time in discussing. I would have rather heard their opinions on how Chevy's and Ford's versions of MRC felt. Furthermore opening the opportunity to talk about the chassis and suspension more. The focus of the ZL1 1LE's ill street manners diverted away from this potential discussion.

Yes I agree for street driving it should have been the ZL1 VS GT350R

[newmoon]

I really liked this review. Nice to hear from real world owners. Both are fantastic cars offering great performance. Pick your poison, there is no wrong answer.

[BlaqWhole]

I just don't think the GT350 R or non-R offer enough performance or options to justify the price. Every time I try to talk myself into considering buying one, it turns exactly into that...me trying to talk myself into it. Same with the GT.

[metros11]

I liked this review a lot, and I think both the owners were spot on.

[MaskedRacerX]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

I don't think Ford could match the ZL1 at all with the S550 chassis if they tried. I don't even think they wanna bang heads with it anyway. The ZLE is just on a completely different level from all these cars.

I think there's plenty of talent working at <wherever> (Ford, Chevy, Dodge, etc.) to respond from an engineering perspective. The bigger factors are from the bean counters and marketing people - can Ford do something with the GT500 AND do it in a package that fits their target market, has the right profit model, AND is in sync with marketing AND on top of all that, make up the deficit with their current platform (vs. GM's Alpha)?

It's like the old design adage: cheap, fast, good ... pick two.

I think GM has better modularity, resulting in better economy-of-scale, and I think Ford is a little late to the party - I'd assume BTT this car shows up, GM has something else on deck, and we've already seen Dodge bump the Hellcat, offer the widebody, AND create the new Redeye variants.

I guess you've probably seen the "tech specs" of the GT500 that recently circulated, of course it may be totally bogus, but I think it's probably not far off - for those that haven't some janky looking mystery document indicated this: 720HP @ 7500 RPM, 650 ft-lbs @ 4500 RPM, 4225 lbs curb weight. I'd say the big impact item is the [supposed] use of a 7-speed DCT - having driven a few I can say they're pretty awesome, it's not just about shift speeds, and if Ford builds the car around this single tranny, it'll be interesting.

Regardless, if there's not a flavor (talk of multiple model variants) that's faster around a track than the ZLE, or if it's not quicker in a 1/4 mile than the top model Hellcat, or it's not some kind of insane deal, I think a lot of folks are just going to kind of shrug.

Just to frame my response, I'm pretty brand agnostic, I shop specific cars (not manufacturers), that do the X/Y/Z that I want. I owned 4 Corvettes (including one NCM delivery), so I've been a GM customer, and I'm ready for more power stock-to-simple-bolt-ons (vs. a full tilt aftermarket FI setup), I want an auto, and I want that in a convertible package ... so I guess can you can figure out why I'm here

[Hasti]

Originally Posted by 1970judge

Any pics that you know of?

These guys annoy me just about more than any other driver. At the dream cruise, 90% of the annoying people out there were Mustang owners making an ass of themselves. it was always a 50/50 split of a 350/350-r owner or an Ecoboost. Something about these cars that make people drive like idiots. I am doing a track day with the Mohawk mustang people and am legitimately concerned for my safety now. I haven't seen a SINGLE 350/350-r owner drive like a normal person around here. Its always WOT or nothing.

Nah, we discourage that even if the guy was a dick. Don't want to make a bad day worse for anyone

[Supercup]

Enjoyed the review. The GT350R is hands down the best sounding Mustang - ever - and sounds way better than any stock Camaro - that being said the regular ZL1 would be a tougher head to head competitor for GT350R to compare to. When you factor in the ride quality of the ZL1 1LE, you eliminate most of the market, it is a track car.

I feel GM missed the mark on the ZL1 1LE - they said the Z/28 did not sell well cause it had no creature comforts - nope - it did not sell well because it was a track focused $75K Camaro at the end of the Gen 5 platform, when the Gen 6 was out shortly, which was a better platform.

The track focused car buyer is a extremely small segment of the market. Z/28 proved that was clearly the case. I have Z/28 and and it is a great car for what it is, but it is not an everyday car. I don't need any creature comforts to enjoy my Z/28. I would have preferred the ZL1 1LE come with better track seats, no creature comforts (other than AC) and was as low in weight as possible. Ceramic brakes would have been a nice option, but are not needed.

That being said if I find a GT350Rfor a reasonable price I would buy one in a heart beat - but I would be wary of too much track time as that motor is not stout - it is a great sounding, high reving, marketing motor, not a track motor. And any mustang guy who diputes that I would simply direct him to the 50 Shelby FP350s race cars, they do not have the FPC motor, cause it won't live on the track!

Both car will put a smile on your face and if you are at the track the 1LE will be the car I want to be in, but any other day of the week I would be in the GT350R - or a regular ZL1.

[NW-99SS]

^^ This picture shows the 5.2L 8250rpm Voodoo with the FP350s...am I missing something?

I do agree that the Voodoo has gained a quick reputation of not being reliable over time - plenty of disintegrated Voodoos out there from GT350 owners.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

^^ This picture shows the 5.2L 8250rpm Voodoo with the FP350s...am I missing something?

I do agree that the Voodoo has gained a quick reputation of not being reliable over time - plenty of disintegrated Voodoos out there from GT350 owners.

Where does it say Voodoo? It does not say Cross Plane Crank, but it is a known the FP350s have the CPC and not the FPC. Thus, not a voodoo, but same 5.2L block.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by Supercup

I feel GM missed the mark on the ZL1 1LE - they said the Z/28 did not sell well cause it had no creature comforts - nope - it did not sell well because it was a track focused $75K Camaro at the end of the Gen 5 platform, when the Gen 6 was out shortly, which was a better platform.

I think they nailed it. It is not a seperate model, like the Z28, it is JUST an option package for the ZL1.

It is insanely impressive for what it is, and the market seems to think so too.

To be more clear, I think it is a success because as a buyer you can choose the ZL1 which is everything the R is in performance and even more as a daily driver or you can check an option box, which is much easier and cheaper for the manufacturer, and have a an absolute track monster.

I think you are exactly right on why the Z28 was not so successful though, and that releasing it early in the 6th gen would have made it much more successful than it was in the 5th gen.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

Where does it say Voodoo? It does not say Cross Plane Crank, but it is a known the FP350s have the CPC and not the FPC. Thus, not a voodoo, but same 5.2L block.

To date, the only production 5.2L with an 8250rpm redline is the Voodoo with FPC.

Edit - I found a link to verify the FP350S without the FPC:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/...-shelby-fp350s

What is curious is why the Voodoo would have an FPC when Ford is capable of turning 8250 with a CPC?

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

To date, the only production 5.2L with an 8250rpm redline is the Voodoo with FPC.

Edit - I found a link to verify the FP350S without the FPC:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/...-shelby-fp350s

What is curious is why the Voodoo would have an FPC when Ford is capable of turning 8250 with a CPC?

I agree here. I think Ford just did it to prove they could. Largest FPC engine ever made. Pretty bad ass being able to claim that title. It was always planned to be a one model engine too, so they rolled the dice I think.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

I agree here. I think Ford just did it to prove they could. Largest FPC engine ever made. Pretty bad ass being able to claim that title. It was always planned to be a one model engine too, so they rolled the dice I think.

Could be - but given the choice, I would own the CPC version as I would rather have reliability

[oldman]

I highly doubt it is the crank design that is leading to the reliability problems... but who knows.