[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by shaffe

But aren't the low end models where the bulk of the volume is made up and thus needing the low end models to succeed to keep the top trims around?

Kinda sorta but not really. How’s that for a straight answer?

Let me ‘splain.....

Since Camaro shares architecture with Cadillac models, the cost side of this equation is less important. Selling more top trims would actually be better because the ATP is better on the top trims. Where the low trims are important is CAFE. If that’s what you mean by “needing the low models to succeed”, then yes. Chevy needs to sell more 2.0T and 3.6L to offset the CAFE hit of the 6.2L and 6.2SC that they have very little trouble selling. Number 3 makes a VERY SOLID point that advertising the hot cars would require selling substantially more V8 cars to recoup the cost of the advertising. Then Chevy would have to sell even more 4 and 6 cylinders to balance the CAFE equation.

Al’s comments were highlighting the fact the GM recognizes the need to be more competitive on the 4 and 6-cylinder end of the product line. That’s why (in my opinion) so much work was done on improving the LT and RS appearances for 2019 as well as the addition of the 2.0T 1LE. There is no denying the EcoBoost Mustang wipes the floor with the 2.0T Camaro. The 1LE at least allows the 2.0T to beat it on the track, though still not at the strip (or stoplight).

[the_swiSS]

Right now, the annual Auto Zurich show is being held here. Chevy didn't have an "official" presence there, but rather a somewhat famous importer/garage had a booth. There were a few Camaros, some Z06's and a CTS-V. I'm kinda bummed about Chevy's marketing here, because the current performance lineup is world-beating.

[Snrub]

The 2.3L EcoBoost provides effective thrust, but it's a terrible engine. I drove it back to back with a 1.6L turbo Hyundai and the Hyundai was a much better engine. The Camaro engines are both good, the 3.6L exceptional.

[Akura]

Chevrolet in EU is only Camaro & Corvette, so no need to spend the advertising budget in other models...

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

They can do a funny ad for Cadillac, ...


but can't do ANY ad for Camaro. A bold Camaro ad would be cool just to be seeing your car in action on TV...Chevy can't figure it out yet.

LOL...that handsome four eyed skinny guy is cool. All the chicks dig him.

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

And when was the last time you saw a RAV4 advertisement? It manages to sell quite well without ads. Marketing? Yes. Ads? No. At least not ads that reach my demographic.



And again, this is largely achieved without ads. I do see an occasional CR-V ad in a magazine here or there, but can't recall ever seeing a TV ad or hearing a radio spot.


The difference here is that when you spend 35 - 55k on an SUV or a crew cab pickup, it can handle more than 90% of the family's duty requirements. It can be a daily driver, take kids to school / practice / games / scouts etc. It can be the family travel horse. With a Camaro (or Mustang) it becomes more of a "me" car and the family still needs a "we" car. Challenger and Charger fit the family role much better than Camaro or Mustang.



Advertising (ime) is best used to build awareness of a new product (My Pillow, Roomba) or significant change in an existing product. It is also used to build brand equity or pound a brand message or slogan into peoples' brains ("Dilly-Dilly", or "Where's the beef?")




One thing to consider is this...at GM, there is the Camaro Product Development Team (Al O's team) and there is a Chevrolet Marketing Team. They are separate teams with separate goals, but they do interact. Chevy Marketing people sit on Al's team and participate in the meetings. The goals of the Product Development Team are to produce the best possible product with the resources (people & $$) that they are given. Part of the measure of the goal is achieving a certain level of profitability and hitting average transaction price (ATP) goals.

The goals of the Marketing Team is to support the Product Development Teams (every car and truck team) in meeting those goals and to promote the most profitable product sales mix for Chevrolet. It is my OPINION that if Chevrolet is meeting its overall sales and profitability targets AND Camaro is meeting its ATP targets, the Marketing Team is more likely to twist the bigger knobs
( Silverado, Equinox, Traverse, Malibu ) to achieve their profitability targets. They are not likely to lose sleep over Camaro missing sales numbers if Camaro is still profitable and ringing the ATP bell. It's certainly what I would do if I were in that role.

I disagree with each point you made. The RAV4 is an inexpensive grocery getter appliance. Can't even be compared to a Camaro. I bet the percentage of Rav4 buyers are women who have seen one on the road or an ad. Or they simply walk into a Toyoto dealership and the salesman sells them one. Cheap inexpensive boring appliance. They are a dime a dozen. The Camaro is performance car, the only people interested are performance oriented people who have seen it and will seek it out, then you have some who may very well be performance oriented and don't know it because they have never been exposed to performance cars...this is who chevy ads should be targeting. Get the car out there where it can be seen in action and any red blooded American kid with with an ounce of desire for excitement is a possible customer. Dodge did some really cool video ads which show their performance heritage since the days of the Dodge Bros all the way up to the Hell cat. A now they sell as many if not more Challengers as the Camaro. When was the last time you saw an exciting Camaro ad?...Right. Never. If I wasn't an enthusiast chances are I would have forgotten the Camaro was again in production. Some millennials probably don't even know what a Camaro is. Like I said the cars will not sell themselves unless you know what you are looking for. Chevy can't figure that out.

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by shaffe

But aren't the low end models where the bulk of the volume is made up and thus needing the low end models to succeed to keep the top trims around?

Exactly....let them walk in and look at the low end models...chances are they will sell them an SS. Thats the key getting them interested in the car. If chevy refuses to advertise and promote the basic product they can't expect to make a basic sell. Thats advertisement 101. I have been suspect of Chevy's market dept. because even their Camaro you build it website has sucked each time I visited it for the last few years and I know that website falls under the marketing dept. To have such a lackluster you build it site says a lot about Chevys lackluster marleting dept. If I were running that outfit someone would be fired

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by Number 3

I've tried to get this across without success.

GM does not need to advertise to anyone on this site. So anyone that comes here and says GM needs to advertise??? To whom?

For GM to make a "hot commercial" would cost probably a few million dollars. And then for all the folks that want "hot commercial" on the Super Bowl for Camaro, well that was $5,000,000 last I checked so lets just say making a commercial and 1 Super Bowl add would run GM $10,000,000. Well if GM had a WHOPPING 10% margin on a Camaro with an average ATP of $35,000 you would need to sell an additional additional 3,000 Camaros to just break even. Of course that's one example, but running multiple, regular ads on primetime TV would probably add up to even more.

Pretty sure GM knows far more than you or I do on whether that is a good business decision.

The Camaro is being actively marketed. And as I've also tried to point out there is a difference between advertising and marketing.

With the right effective exciting ad they could sell an additional 3000 cars in a months time. That gives them 11 more months to duplicate those sales. Its chump change if you believe in the product you are selling. Maybe Chevy doesnt really believe in it...who knows?

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Deputy Dog

I disagree with each point you made. The RAV4 is an inexpensive grocery getter appliance. Can't even be compared to a Camaro. I bet the percentage of Rav4 buyers are women who have seen one on the road or an ad. Or they simply walk into a Toyoto dealership and the salesman sells them one. Cheap inexpensive boring appliance. They are a dime a dozen. The Camaro is performance car, the only people interested are performance oriented people who have seen it and will seek it out, then you have some who may very well be performance oriented and don't know it because they have never been exposed to performance cars...this is who chevy ads should be targeting. Get the car out there where it can be seen in action and any red blooded American kid with with an ounce of desire for excitement is a possible customer. Dodge did some really cool video ads which show their performance heritage since the days of the Dodge Bros all the way up to the Hell cat. A now they sell as many if not more Challengers as the Camaro. When was the last time you saw an exciting Camaro ad?...Right. Never. If I wasn't an enthusiast chances are I would have forgotten the Camaro was again in production. Some millennials probably don't even know what a Camaro is. Like I said the cars will not sell themselves unless you know what you are looking for. Chevy can't figure that out.

Only because it doesn't fit your view. GM knows what it's doing here. Just not sure why everyone here that hasn't worked in Sales or Marketing for an OEM can't grasp that.

Originally Posted by Deputy Dog

With the right effective exciting ad they could sell an additional 3000 cars in a months time. That gives them 11 more months to duplicate those sales. Its chump change if you believe in the product you are selling. Maybe Chevy doesnt really believe in it...who knows?

I really doubt it. GM has reams and reams of data on this. If they really could sell 3,000 more Camaros PER MONTH (I meant in a year) they would do so. 3,000 Camaros a month is 36,000 cars per year or about $100,000,000 more in margin, assuming my 10% is remotely close. I think they would if it were even close to that.

Originally Posted by Deputy Dog

Exactly....let them walk in and look at the low end models...chances are they will sell them an SS. Thats the key getting them interested in the car. If chevy refuses to advertise and promote the basic product they can't expect to make a basic sell. Thats advertisement 101. I have been suspect of Chevy's market dept. because even their Camaro you build it website has sucked each time I visited it for the last few years and I know that website falls under the marketing dept. To have such a lackluster you build it site says a lot about Chevys lackluster marleting dept. If I were running that outfit someone would be fired

Everyone's an expert on social media these days. But even you confused advertising with marketing. There are so many products that don't need advertising to sell well. Corvette has been one for years. But it is very well marketed.