[harner]

I have dealt with CSP for my old car's bastardized tune that was done at another shop. Andrew sat with me and went over every table in HP Tuners, showing me why he was making changes and theorizing what the previous tuner may have been thinking, etc. Long story short, he's a gadget guy and knows his way around HPT and is super friendly and honest. He's also disconnected with a lot of the pricing and business operations, and that is where Alex steps in and does a great job.

Their techs are funny, down to earth, and knowledgeable. I just wish they were closer to me. A 2 hour drive on the highway and in traffic to get to them isn't fun when you're a DIYer just looking for a tune.

Your car is in good hands with them. Haven't used RPM personally as my pockets aren't that deep, but rarely do I hear anything bad. When you do, the negative posts/feedback tend to "go away" since they sponsor most forums, or used to. Every good shop will have some negativity though, it's just nature of the business. Avoid a place with too many red flags or throw money away like I did lol.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by MartinLe

Hey Radz28, kind of off the thread, but I am thinking of just doing the 2650R, appropriate TB and headers (cat delete), CAI and nothing else on NT05R's. Of course, tuned properly (detuned?) What can I expect HP-wise or ET?

To be up front: I haven't dyno'd my car. I also haven't made it to the track yet (I installed all this over the Summer and am still tinkering but am close to being done). BUT - I've been working with another Member, and my set-up is nearly the same as his. In comparing some air flow data, I'm pretty much requiring the same air flow as their car (within a couple g/s), and they've put down a bit more than 700 to the tires (our spark tables are about the same - I'm probably running a tiny bit more, and I thinkwe're both on 91). I'm running full OEM exhaust. If you add LTs, you'll probably be somewhere between 720-750, on 93. You WILL likely be at the limit of OEM-fueling. I'm right around 5.5-6 ms right now (average pretty much at 5.5), and that's pushing the threshold (I'm still holding full fuel pressure).

Another reference: Magnuson's old CEO had an M6 Z06 with an OEM-car, that only upgraded the OEM air box to a CARB-GM CAI and upgraded 5-inch intake tube and 103mm Mamo, and it put down about the same power on 91, around 6500 (he ran it out to near 7000 were it was close to 730). Stock everything else.





There's a good video by a Nickey tuner with an A10 ZL1 with LTs, Big Gulp, 103mm Mamo and at about 16-psi, it was near 750, but right on the fuel limit. I believe that was on 93 (it was near Chicago and in Winter), but the fueling and timing were relatively conservative because of the way the driver used the car (a lot of 1320' and a lot of hot-lapping for competition). So those are pretty safe numbers to keep the car happy and safe.





IMO - you should always be honest with yourself and start modifications by knowing, at least close, what you want and will be doing with the car. The Nickey customer was drag racing in a series where the competition required hot-lapping the car. So the car was mod'd and tuned with those in mind. The customer could easily go faster, for more money, than that, but the car was built and tuned to how it would be used. If you have a power goal greater than about 750, then you should be looking at alternatives to fueling and make sure you take those into account for the budget of the build. You probably already know all that, so if you're looking for about 750 to the tires, you should get there really easily with basic bolt-ons and a 2650. I bet with good air, good tune (torque tuning is a beesh), good fuel, and good track & traction, 9s shouldn't be hard to hit.

[radz28]

And to bring it back to CSP - I purchased the 2650 and BG from them, lol.

[KingLT1]

5.5ms on the injectors is plenty safe. I wouldn't worry until you are steadily over 6ms if the fuel pressures are solid.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by KingLT1

5.5ms on the injectors is plenty safe. I wouldn't worry until you are steadily over 6ms if the fuel pressures are solid.

Thanks King . I've heard 5.5-6.5 but I'm only at the low side and fuel seems to be holding steady with no hiccups. I'd rather stay on the conservative side and play it safe.

[MartinLe]

Originally Posted by radz28

To be up front: I haven't dyno'd my car. I also haven't made it to the track yet (I installed all this over the Summer and am still tinkering but am close to being done). BUT - I've been working with another Member, and my set-up is nearly the same as his. In comparing some air flow data, I'm pretty much requiring the same air flow as their car (within a couple g/s), and they've put down a bit more than 700 to the tires (our spark tables are about the same - I'm probably running a tiny bit more, and I thinkwe're both on 91). I'm running full OEM exhaust. If you add LTs, you'll probably be somewhere between 720-750, on 93. You WILL likely be at the limit of OEM-fueling. I'm right around 5.5-6 ms right now (average pretty much at 5.5), and that's pushing the threshold (I'm still holding full fuel pressure).

Another reference: Magnuson's old CEO had an M6 Z06 with an OEM-car, that only upgraded the OEM air box to a CARB-GM CAI and upgraded 5-inch intake tube and 103mm Mamo, and it put down about the same power on 91, around 6500 (he ran it out to near 7000 were it was close to 730). Stock everything else.





There's a good video by a Nickey tuner with an A10 ZL1 with LTs, Big Gulp, 103mm Mamo and at about 16-psi, it was near 750, but right on the fuel limit. I believe that was on 93 (it was near Chicago and in Winter), but the fueling and timing were relatively conservative because of the way the driver used the car (a lot of 1320' and a lot of hot-lapping for competition). So those are pretty safe numbers to keep the car happy and safe.





IMO - you should always be honest with yourself and start modifications by knowing, at least close, what you want and will be doing with the car. The Nickey customer was drag racing in a series where the competition required hot-lapping the car. So the car was mod'd and tuned with those in mind. The customer could easily go faster, for more money, than that, but the car was built and tuned to how it would be used. If you have a power goal greater than about 750, then you should be looking at alternatives to fueling and make sure you take those into account for the budget of the build. You probably already know all that, so if you're looking for about 750 to the tires, you should get there really easily with basic bolt-ons and a 2650. I bet with good air, good tune (torque tuning is a beesh), good fuel, and good track & traction, 9s shouldn't be hard to hit.

Thank you for the detailed answer. As far as goals go, LOL, I can't say I have one other than having a "Badass Over-the Top" car. Roseburg, Oregon isn't a hotbed of high HP cars. We have a handful of semi-fast riceburners, I don't think many of them get 500 whp, a couple of hell-kitties and I haven't seen a gen 6 Zl1 or Shelby. I guess I'm just one of those "Can't have too much HP" guys.

You mentioned IPW's of 5.5 to 6 as being the limit. A stock cam can do this - Reliably? I'm ok with broken axles and similar stuff, but not a smoked motor. My wife would lose her mind! LOL In the end, having a 9 sec DD would be plenty and way satisfying! Hah! but for how long?

Once again, thanks for the well thought out answer. And, by the way, I grew up on 40th and H st., downtown Crapamento.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by MartinLe

Thank you for the detailed answer. As far as goals go, LOL, I can't say I have one other than having a "Badass Over-the Top" car. Roseburg, Oregon isn't a hotbed of high HP cars. We have a handful of semi-fast riceburners, I don't think many of them get 500 whp, a couple of hell-kitties and I haven't seen a gen 6 Zl1 or Shelby. I guess I'm just one of those "Can't have too much HP" guys.

You mentioned IPW's of 5.5 to 6 as being the limit. A stock cam can do this - Reliably? I'm ok with broken axles and similar stuff, but not a smoked motor. My wife would lose her mind! LOL In the end, having a 9 sec DD would be plenty and way satisfying! Hah! but for how long?

Once again, thanks for the well thought out answer. And, by the way, I grew up on 40th and H st., downtown Crapamento.

Well - a 2650 or 2.9 Whipple will probably satisfy your need for horsepower, HA. You couldn't go wrong, mostly, with any of the options. I'm not the only one, but I try to pay attention to the details, and I arrived where I am because of that, and couldn't be happier. If I do anything else, it will be a secondary cat' delete just to ?possibly? reduce a little heat in the exhaust from more power (that theory is to remain CARB-compliant, which is the biggest constraint I have). But - you have many options, and I can attest a 2650 was perfect for me.

I wouldn't try to convince you that there's zero risk in running around those values, but it's pretty accepted that MANY people do successfully, and don't have issues. If you're "only" looking for about 700-750 to the tires, it seems like this is pretty darn safe. BUT - if you think you'll want more down the line, I'd make sure to get a cam with a fuel lobe, and you'll be good out another 100-horse' on good gas. I am in the same boat with a blown motor on a new car with the wifey, so I feel pretty confident. They way I see it, I get better efficiency with a larger blower, with a little more strain on the bottom end, but I get less heat and more power, so it balances out pretty well, for me. If you consider LT5, and the relatively minimal changes it is from LT4, maybe that might offer a little more confidence. The crank metal is slightly stronger, and there are new crank and rod bearings, but the rest of the long block (minus a slightly better cam in LT5) is LT4 all the way. It seems like good shops push a stock LT4 out to 1000-RWHP without much issue (with supporting fueling mods' and such), so me making another 100+ over stock isn't going to tax much. I feel pretty safe. It's all in the tune at the level I'm at.

NICE!!! I'm just down the road, at Watt and 50, so I'm familiar with your stomping grounds. Congrats' on escaping CA, HAHAHAHA. If I didn't have the ties I do, I'd escape, too...

Good luck on your efforts

[MartinLe]

Originally Posted by radz28

Well - a 2650 or 2.9 Whipple will probably satisfy your need for horsepower, HA. You couldn't go wrong, mostly, with any of the options. I'm not the only one, but I try to pay attention to the details, and I arrived where I am because of that, and couldn't be happier. If I do anything else, it will be a secondary cat' delete just to ?possibly? reduce a little heat in the exhaust from more power (that theory is to remain CARB-compliant, which is the biggest constraint I have). But - you have many options, and I can attest a 2650 was perfect for me.

I would try to convince you that there's zero risk in running around those values, but it's pretty accepted that MANY people do successfully, and don't have issues. If you're "only" looking for about 700-750 to the tires, it seems like this is pretty darn safe. BUT - if you think you'll want more down the line, I'd make sure to get a cam with a fuel lobe, and you'll be good out another 100-horse' on good gas. I am in the same boat with a blown motor on a new car with the wifey, so I feel pretty confident. They way I see it, I get better efficiency with a larger blower, with a little more strain on the bottom end, but I get less heat and more power, so it balances out pretty well, for me. If you consider LT5, and the relatively minimal changes it is from LT4, maybe that might offer a little more confidence. The crank metal is slightly stronger, and there are new crank and rod bearings, but the rest of the long block (minus a slightly better cam in LT5) is LT4 all the way. It seems like good shops push a stock LT4 out to 1000-RWHP without much issue (with supporting fueling mods' and such), so me making another 100+ over stock isn't going to tax much. I feel pretty safe. It's all in the tune at the level I'm at.

NICE!!! I'm just down the road, at Watt and 50, so I'm familiar with your stomping grounds. Congrats' on escaping CA, HAHAHAHA. If I didn't have the ties I do, I'd escape, too...

Good luck on your efforts

Wow! I also lived two streets down on Hurley - a little ways past Arden towards you in Rancho - right off Watt.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by MartinLe

Wow! I also lived two streets down on Hurley - a little ways past Arden towards you in Rancho - right off Watt.

Small world, HAHAHA

Side note: I change the sentence in my first response, as I missed it on my edit before posting.

[soceur77]

CSP has a interesting video they dropped last night where a brand new Calloway ZL1 came in with issues and making only 5xxwhp.

[radz28]

That's like the second or third Callaway vehicle that it seems like needs tuning that I've noticed. That video was posted one of a Tahoe not all that long ago, too.

[soceur77]

I almost went with Calloway back in 2017, my thought process was pay big now, but dont have to do much later...lol Glad I didnt and found CSP. *I understand Calloway is a great product, but they do have some lemons out there that should have never made it out the garage.

[Boomers18ZL1]

I am having it done October 19! The 775 HP package and a cam package. They have been great so far. Answered every question. I email and within a hour or less I have a answer. So far I give them 5 stars. Covid 19 is delaying things, but that’s not there fault.

[Dan82679]

Originally Posted by 20Bluezl1

I also live in jersey and thinking of Jannetty in CT to do my work. I heard mixed things about CSP just something about them that I don't like. Is that 750 rwhp?

It is 750 crank. I have same package from them but also with flex fuel ,DSX auxiliary pump.On 93 I got 625 wheel with a manual.They say Automatics get more HP on this car. With E40 I get 650 Wheel. Don't listen to the mmix reviews. I've been there to meet the mechanics and Andrew and there all good at what they do.