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Old 06-29-2020, 07:25 AM   #29
oldman


 
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large duration gentle lift cam is the cat's meow with the M6.


Not a bang for $$$ mod, but if you DIY the cost is not bad. 7200 RPM shift in a high compression direct inject V8 sounds amazing... My exhaust is NOT loud the engine is scare the pants off you loud, reminds me of my DZ302 back in the day.


Check out this FBO M6:
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Old 06-29-2020, 09:35 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Will View Post
In order to answer your question to the level in which you demand, he would have to put in more time than its worth.
For instance with the same level of detail you're demanding, prove him wrong. Not so easy is it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by RageWorx View Post
We are all very happy you are a proud owner of a ZL1 and believe it just can't be matched by any commoner lower trim that dares to mod and have aspirations of getting anywhere near a ZL1 ... but who are you really trying to convince with your argument here ... yourself ?

No one owes you line item proof of anything so stop acting like without that their Opinions aren't valid you don't get to create the rules for debate sorry .... lets remember here this is Opinion and not some set in stone fact that everyone must accept because you demanded something that no one owes you and if they don't provide then YOU WIN

There is a such thing as Intended Use of the Vehicle ... If you are not going to use some of those NASA grade features you payed extra for and mentioned in regards to the ZL1 then why bother with the extra cost in the first place ... And possibly you do use them all and rely on them as your life blood but other owners could care less and don't want some of the extras so why pay for them and save money for specific modifications that they want for their intended use ... to me that is efficient rather than paying more for some things you may not want or need for the cars intended purpose.

In the end there is No Wrong way just what works best for the individual.

Don't get me wrong I like the ZL1s and thought about grabbing one when they came out ... but after thinking about how I would use and how I use my boosted 16 SS ... decided not to bother and just keep having fun and modding my SS (which I definitely don't have ZL1 money into btw sorry I know you needs receipts but I don't care lol) .

Plus I like to leave the extra $$$$ to buy other cars I mean who wants just one Fun Toy when you can have many.
-Jon
He's creating a debate that was never intended from the start. When people are supercharging their SS's they aren't trying to turn the interiors and electronics into a ZL1, they are just looking for the engine performance.

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Originally Posted by arpad_m View Post
You and us SS owners both know no 100% transformation is possible at any reasonable cost, so this is just a hollow taunt.
My car pretty much has all that has value for me out of a ZL1, except small software features that GM in their pettiness left out and made near impossible to retrofit (HUD shift lights, configurable launch control etc.).
I think something similar is what OP has in mind, he cares for certain ZL1 aspects and not for others, and his question is where the best balance or tradeoff lies in our opinion.
Yep!

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Originally Posted by Evansa22 View Post
I went from a '16 1ss to an '18 zle. Put a lot of thought into the same dilemma. For me I liked the look of the zl1 more and because I was a 1ss, was missing a lot of the interior features. In the end, test drove one and it was what I was looking for. Personally it made sense for me and decided to go that route before I put any money into mods on the 1ss. Once the warranty is up I'll mod this for around another 100 whp and call it good. Handling wise I dont think there's much more to add to the car so none of that will be touched. Just offering my personal experience and it made sense for me, but I wanted more than just the power, also wanted the elsd, as well as the handling this car brings to the table. Not to say the ss couldn't match it especially being lighter but I wanted something pretty much ready to go out of the box
Perfect analogy

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Originally Posted by oldman View Post
amen, it is personal choice based on $$$$ and wants. Clearly the SS currently owned is cheaper, clearly a ZL1 / ZLE is "better" in most ways.
also perfect analogy
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Old 06-29-2020, 09:46 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman
amen, it is personal choice based on $$$$ an
d wants. Clearly the SS currently owned is cheaper, clearly a ZL1 / ZLE is "better" in most ways.
That was all that I was looking for. The contention started when I said people would say they can build a SS to be a ZL1 or better than a ZL1. Oldman did and I challenged him to prove his claim. If he would have made this statement, at the beginning, then things would have ended there.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:35 AM   #32
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I never claimed the SS could be built into a Zl1, obviously FBO is about and limited to engine performance not handling, ergonomics etc. FBO can range from $1700 to $6000 and would probably add to the 5 year resale $1000. So the cost over 5 years is $700 to $5000.

I did say that IMO most guys with an SS would be "happy" with PS4s, never said nor alluded to an SS would out handle a ZL1 with said tires.

Cheap FBO: E85, tune, CA front cat deletes, cut air box + green filter, Pray ported intake and TB say $1700

I got money to burn: E85, tune, LTs + green cats, RotoFab, ported MSD, 103MM TB, 3" exhaust say $4500 to $6000.

I'd say off the cuff WHP difference 20. Clearly the cheap FBO, - increase in resale would only cost $700 over 5 years... chump change for the fun added.
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:54 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Lafourche1 View Post
It is more expensive to try to build a Camaro SS into a ZL1 than it is to just buy the ZL1. There are a couple of people that always pop up and say that you can do this cheaper. However, when challenged they never provide any type of line item listing for the costs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman View Post
I disagree here, it is relatively cheap to bolt on and E85 a LT1, FBO I did beat a Hellcat thru the gears, he was closing on me in when I shut down at 110 MPH. Probably near even in a 1/4 mile both of us on street tires not DRs (Hellcat high trap for sure). I felt FBO on the M6 (still could use NLS) was a near ideal street car, light, fun, bout as much power that can bee hooked to the ground. There are cheap was to do this too, for instance a Pray ported intake and LT5 TB (stock off the shelf) is really near a MSD and 103 MM, for 1/3 the price......
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman View Post
I never claimed the SS could be built into a Zl1, obviously FBO is about and limited to engine performance not handling, ergonomics etc.
Seems you did disagree with my statement that it is more expensive to build an SS into a ZL1.
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Old 06-29-2020, 04:31 PM   #34
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Neither I nor the OP want to build a SS in the ZL1. It is in your own deluded mind.
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Old 06-29-2020, 05:41 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman View Post
large duration gentle lift cam is the cat's meow with the M6.


Not a bang for $$$ mod, but if you DIY the cost is not bad. 7200 RPM shift in a high compression direct inject V8 sounds amazing... My exhaust is NOT loud the engine is scare the pants off you loud, reminds me of my DZ302 back in the day.


Check out this FBO M6:
That lope:

Reminds me of my old Trans Am LT1 that I cammed, except mine had less lope and wasn't as loud, but still, brought back memories. That car ran well for its time.

I agree on the high rpm sound of a nice high compression American V8. Like the Gen 3 Coyote...12.0:1, 7500 rpm, DI (and port injection for other times).
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Old 06-29-2020, 06:20 PM   #36
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I wish Ford would put the flat plane crank into the 5.0 Mach 1, I'd toss in a set of equal length headers (which only work with FPC)... pure love.

Here it is with a 90% stock exhaust from factory header to chrome tailpipe tips. It has the driver's side CA front cat delete. Still heck of loud at WOT...
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Old 06-29-2020, 06:22 PM   #37
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disappointing to see a video dedicated to one of the quickest bolt on m6 cars and they’re doing 30 rolls. fun cars though.
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Old 06-29-2020, 06:33 PM   #38
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He is at 10.8 on stock ported IMO and ported TB. The ported MSD and 95mm is putting out 30 or so HP along with a very strong 5800 to 6300 power bump (2" headers would help also). so 10.65s?? FBO M6 is possible.
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Old 06-30-2020, 01:33 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman View Post
He is at 10.8 on stock ported IMO and ported TB. The ported MSD and 95mm is putting out 30 or so HP along with a very strong 5800 to 6300 power bump (2" headers would help also). so 10.65s?? FBO M6 is possible.
That same car went 10.63 at 131mph with a high ram, 95mm TB, and otr cai. Then they put 2" headers and it went 10.32 at 134mph fbo.

He also had another m6 car with an MSD, 95TB, headers, and E go 10.83. I'm sure a well sorted MSD fbo m6 car is capable of 10.6
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Old 06-30-2020, 07:44 AM   #40
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My only issue with the hi-ram is the hood needed to run it on the street. There was a Vette at the last get together with his hood cut for a hi-ram, looked pretty good actually.
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Old 06-30-2020, 08:53 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman View Post
My only issue with the hi-ram is the hood needed to run it on the street. There was a Vette at the last get together with his hood cut for a hi-ram, looked pretty good actually.
Same, but it's growing on me with a black paited high ram. That's why I'm excited about Texas Speed's line of high rams and low rams coming out soon for the LT's.

Even if you have to cut the hood it'd be great if you somehow didn't have to cut the plastic cowl trim piece with the incoming Texas Speed units.
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Old 07-08-2020, 12:14 PM   #42
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I appreciate all of the view points and experiences from you guys. I’m attempting to pull from all of my past experiences and the experiences from info here on the forums to determine what I’m going to be the most satisfied with long term.

I have had a history of selling or trading my vehicles every 1 to 2 or years, but I’m ready to get a car a that I can commit to for a change lol. Ironically the girlfriend wants the same commitment change from me as well haha. Anyways I’m drawn to the ZL1 for the added performance out of the box and the specialness of the Zl1 vs the SS. However, as someone mentioned before as good as the A10 is I am concerned that I might miss the M6 for fun factor. This is going to be 98% a street car. I’ll eventually take it to the drag strip to see what times I can run, but this will be rare for me. What I miss about my C6 Z06 was the N/A LS7 and the uniqueness of the car. Like I said the LT1 feels very close to the LS7 under 4500PRMs, but I do miss the top end pull of that motor. I’m thinking that with the MSD and other bolt ons that will help get the LT1 to closer resemble the LS7 and maybe I’ll be happy at that point, but what I’m concerned with is if I spend the cash on bolt ons then I’m still not satisfied lol. At that point my investment would be better spent on the ZL1 from the beginning.
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