More rain/moisture related electronic issues – BCM short? – Need advice - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

InFiD3ViL · 08-30-2017, 07:34 PM

UPDATED BELOW>>>>> NOT THE BCM!!!

So I have posted a few times previously about how when it rains very heavily, my door locks would stop working for a few days. After a few days time to dry out, they would fix themselves. I am 100% certain this is related to the rain/moisture after it happening so many times.

I live in central Florida, where it has been very rainy for the last few days, even more so than usual. After the most recent rain event many other things are now not working properly.

Door locks not working
Power windows not working – Yet the window will still lower a bit when the door opens like normal and close when the door closes.
Dome light not activated by open doors, can be manually turned on still
Radio and accessories stay on after the key is removed and drivers door doesn’t turn them off. I have to turn everything off manually to avoid a dead battery.
Chime will ring even with door closed now (in ACC position), unless car is running
Factory alarm will not arm

I just can’t figure out what is getting wet enough to cause this to happen, as I know of absolutely zero leaks in the car. No musty smell or extra humid interior, no fogging of the windows inside, etc.

One possibility I have thought of is the rain is getting into the wiring harness in between the firewall and door jams, causing a short to the BCM for those specific functions. Either that, or somehow it is getting into the door switch that controls the windows, which in turn is causing a short condition in the BCM. Another possibility, however less likely, is the extreme humidity is causing issues with the actual BCM.

Also, I am trying to locate the BCM in my car. I have no idea where it is located, and Google has been no help. I can find plenty of info for the 4th gens, but nothing concrete for our cars. So if anyone that has replaced or worked on the BCM on a 2010 SS can answer that it would be greatly appreciated.

Any direction you guys can point me in regarding how to solve this issue would be great. If this time is anything last the last few times, everything will slowly start to work again within the next few days once whatever it is dries out. Unfortunately I do not have the resources right now to have the dealer check this. I am fairly sure this would cost a small fortune.

BTW, have tested all fuses and in the process of testing related relays. I will update this thread if anything else stops or starts working

Thanks guys!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
UPDATE:

Thanks to some very smart forum members, I have found the culprit. I still don't know how the water is getting in there, but at least I know mostly what is going on. This is what I found in the connector in between the driver's door and firewall area. I am going to try some WD40 for water displacement and then dielectric goo after it's all cleaned up. If this still doesn't take care of the connections, I may have to replace it. I still need to find out how the water it getting in there to begin with or I will wind up back at square one. That water in the 2nd pic is what I shook out of the connector.

Sorry for the sideways pics...

SlingShot · 08-30-2017, 07:41 PM

Here

Maybe this will help...

Spec · 08-30-2017, 07:57 PM

I have some electrical background, but ask me about the electrical on these cars and you will get the old deer/headlight look...

That said, I will say that when the BCM acts up, strange things happen. I replaced mine about a year ago or so now, when I just couldn't for the life of me get my passenger rear side markers to light up. Why just that light and not the others? I thought...

Quickly soon after, my passenger side tail lights went out. What the heck? Nothing else was acting weird, but for the life of me I could not get them to work after extensive troubleshooting myself... even with my fleet mechanic. He brought out the testers and all the fancy electrical tools, and obviously power wasn't getting to them, but why???

I finally said screw it, I'm taking it to a local Car Electrical shop that had banners and all that saying - we can solve any vehicle electrical problem. Okay, prove it! heh...

Took it in and a few hrs later, they tell me the BCM is having problems. Damn... so what's this going to cost me? In the end it was 450 in parts, 150 in labor. They order the part, it comes in the next day... I get the call and take the car back in... about an hour later I'm driving away, all problems behind me!

I was skeptical at first... too good to be true... I swear I struggled for at least a couple of weeks. But to this day have had no further issues.

I know that a lot of us would prefer to find the cause of a problem and work at it ourselves... but sometimes you really need to take it to people who study this, make this their lives, and are good at it, in order to fix these problems.

I would say definitely have it checked out... I have no idea where they pulled the BCM from, lol, but just glad they did. If I ever have to replace it again, I'll definitely dive deep towards doing it myself.

Not much help, but just my story.

InFiD3ViL · 08-30-2017, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spec

I would say definitely have it checked out...

Not much help, but just my story.

No man, it is very helpful. Sometimes you have to hear things you don't want to hear.

I take pride in doing nearly all my work myself, but some things are best left to the pros...like electrical gremlins. This is just driving me nuts. I cannot wait for the dry season!

Thank you too Slingshot. There is some seriously helpful information in those threads.

Another thing I noticed that has me worried for my battery... The glowing blue 'rings' around my speedo/tach will sometimes stay on after I leave the car (since this started). Usually that is one of the things that will timeout after 30 seconds or whatever. I am sure that it is super low draw, current wise, but add that to whatever else is not turning off that I cannot even see or notice.

Until I have this solved I may have to clear out the trunk and be prepared to pull the battery overnights or when I'm not using the car for a few hours.

Uhhhg!

gringo · 08-30-2017, 10:23 PM

$150 in labor just to unplug the old BCM and plug in the new one? Sheesh! What a ripoff!

InFiD3ViL · 08-30-2017, 10:27 PM

Does the BCM require VIN programming?

gringo · 08-31-2017, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InFiD3ViL

Does the BCM require VIN programming?

I'm pretty sure it does since it controls the various components that the car is optioned with. That's probably where a large part of the $150 labor comes from. Ugh! Still a big ripoff though.

Spec · 08-31-2017, 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gringo

$150 in labor just to unplug the old BCM and plug in the new one? Sheesh! What a ripoff!

Not really when you consider it took them hrs to troubleshoot to get to the root of the problem, then another hour to install it.

MrChrisLS3 · 08-31-2017, 08:04 AM

It really seems that there is a wiring issue/switch issue inside the door to me. I haven't pulled a door panel on anything made after 1996, but I know that there is a lot more to this stuff than those old systems.

The most common sense thing I'm thinking is that somehow a wire got pinched, either around the door hinge or inside the door. When moisture hits it, it shorts out on another wire.

Now finding something like that...I picture looking for a needle in haystack during a wind storm. But who knows, maybe it will be obvious once the panel is pulled...(which almost never happens, lol)

DvKillar · 08-31-2017, 08:48 AM

I agreed with MrChris until you mentioned dash halo's. you sure there isn't a windshield leak that is getting your BCM wet? any dampness near the BCM under your steering wheel?

Moto-Mojo · 08-31-2017, 09:09 AM

I came to the conclusion long ago that sometimes you just have to pay the man. The Man that learned the trade - any trade, made all of the mistakes before you and has to earn a living too. And when the really good ones make it look too easy, it's hard to swallow the cost but generally worth it in the long run.

I think we as humans tend to forget about the time and effort we put into fixing a problem. Stuff the pros charge for!

MrChrisLS3 · 08-31-2017, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DvKillar

I agreed with MrChris until you mentioned dash halo's. you sure there isn't a windshield leak that is getting your BCM wet? any dampness near the BCM under your steering wheel?

The dash lights are connected into the same interior lighting system as it relates to the door switch being the on/off for interior lighting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moto-Mojo

I came to the conclusion long ago that sometimes you just have to pay the man. The Man that learned the trade - any trade, made all of the mistakes before you and has to earn a living too. And when the really good ones make it look too easy, it's hard to swallow the cost but generally worth it in the long run.

I think we as humans tend to forget about the time and effort we put into fixing a problem. Stuff the pros charge for!

Yep, doing it yourself comes with it's own price tag, and it's not always cheaper at the end of the day. To quote Clint Eastwood from the "Dirty Harry" movies..."a man has got to know his limitations".

myold88 · 08-31-2017, 09:59 AM

Op. Did you buy this car new or do you know it's history? i hate to say it but your
multiple electrical problems are consistent with a flood/water damaged car. The
only reason I ask is because I don't remember other 5th Gen owners here on
camaro5 having the same issues. As an insurance adjuster and salvage vehicle
specialist, your problems are typical of water damage and those rarely ever get
resolved 100%. I hope for your sake I'm way off base here and good luck with
your repairs.

ATCK45 · 08-31-2017, 12:48 PM

Look at the switch and the connector at the switch for corrosion. In addition connector X500 that goes between the door and the A-pillar, (it might actually be in the door itself) might be corroded. The circuit uses a power window driver (module) that drives the window motor, this driver has a separate input directly from the BCM which is why the window will still go up and down when you open and close the door but it doesn't work from the switch. This sounds like a typical corroded connector at the switch or X500.

Couple thoughts.

08-30-2017, 07:34 PM	#1
InFiD3ViL Drives: 2010 CGM 2SS/RS LS3 Swapped A6 Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Spring Hill, FL Posts: 4,578	More rain/moisture related electronic issues – BCM short? – Need advice UPDATED BELOW>>>>> NOT THE BCM!!! So I have posted a few times previously about how when it rains very heavily, my door locks would stop working for a few days. After a few days time to dry out, they would fix themselves. I am 100% certain this is related to the rain/moisture after it happening so many times. I live in central Florida, where it has been very rainy for the last few days, even more so than usual. After the most recent rain event many other things are now not working properly. Door locks not working Power windows not working – Yet the window will still lower a bit when the door opens like normal and close when the door closes. Dome light not activated by open doors, can be manually turned on still Radio and accessories stay on after the key is removed and drivers door doesn’t turn them off. I have to turn everything off manually to avoid a dead battery. Chime will ring even with door closed now (in ACC position), unless car is running Factory alarm will not arm I just can’t figure out what is getting wet enough to cause this to happen, as I know of absolutely zero leaks in the car. No musty smell or extra humid interior, no fogging of the windows inside, etc. One possibility I have thought of is the rain is getting into the wiring harness in between the firewall and door jams, causing a short to the BCM for those specific functions. Either that, or somehow it is getting into the door switch that controls the windows, which in turn is causing a short condition in the BCM. Another possibility, however less likely, is the extreme humidity is causing issues with the actual BCM. Also, I am trying to locate the BCM in my car. I have no idea where it is located, and Google has been no help. I can find plenty of info for the 4th gens, but nothing concrete for our cars. So if anyone that has replaced or worked on the BCM on a 2010 SS can answer that it would be greatly appreciated. Any direction you guys can point me in regarding how to solve this issue would be great. If this time is anything last the last few times, everything will slowly start to work again within the next few days once whatever it is dries out. Unfortunately I do not have the resources right now to have the dealer check this. I am fairly sure this would cost a small fortune. BTW, have tested all fuses and in the process of testing related relays. I will update this thread if anything else stops or starts working Thanks guys! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- UPDATE: Thanks to some very smart forum members, I have found the culprit. I still don't know how the water is getting in there, but at least I know mostly what is going on. This is what I found in the connector in between the driver's door and firewall area. I am going to try some WD40 for water displacement and then dielectric goo after it's all cleaned up. If this still doesn't take care of the connections, I may have to replace it. I still need to find out how the water it getting in there to begin with or I will wind up back at square one. That water in the 2nd pic is what I shook out of the connector. Sorry for the sideways pics... Attached Images __________________ 2010 CGM Camaro 2SS LS3 Swapped A6 - GPI LS3 SS1 .647/.638, (224/237, 112 +4, 7º overlap) on CamMotion 8620 core, BTR Platinum .660" Dual Spring kit w/titanium retainers, CHE bronze trunnion upgrade, stock heads milled @ .015, Melling HV 10296 oil pump, TSP 1-7/8" long tube headers (W/Catless Off-road Pipes), Corsa Xtreme 3" Catback, GPI Ported/Rod Mod Intake, Stage 2 Ported Throttle Body, Vararam OTR CAI, Mike Norris Gen 2 catch can + GM 1LE clean side separator, 160º thermostat - Megan Racing adjustable coilovers (lowered 1.75"), MRR M017 10/11" wheels-Tuned by Ryan @ GPI Last edited by InFiD3ViL; 09-01-2017 at 07:51 PM. Reason: updated w/pics

08-30-2017, 07:41 PM	#2
SlingShot Drives: 2012 ZL1 - #670 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Seminole, Fl. Posts: 8,009	Here Maybe this will help... __________________

08-30-2017, 10:27 PM	#6
InFiD3ViL Drives: 2010 CGM 2SS/RS LS3 Swapped A6 Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Spring Hill, FL Posts: 4,578	Does the BCM require VIN programming? __________________ 2010 CGM Camaro 2SS LS3 Swapped A6 - GPI LS3 SS1 .647/.638, (224/237, 112 +4, 7º overlap) on CamMotion 8620 core, BTR Platinum .660" Dual Spring kit w/titanium retainers, CHE bronze trunnion upgrade, stock heads milled @ .015, Melling HV 10296 oil pump, TSP 1-7/8" long tube headers (W/Catless Off-road Pipes), Corsa Xtreme 3" Catback, GPI Ported/Rod Mod Intake, Stage 2 Ported Throttle Body, Vararam OTR CAI, Mike Norris Gen 2 catch can + GM 1LE clean side separator, 160º thermostat - Megan Racing adjustable coilovers (lowered 1.75"), MRR M017 10/11" wheels-Tuned by Ryan @ GPI

08-31-2017, 09:09 AM	#11
Moto-Mojo Fast Cars and Old Guitars Drives: 2015 2SS RS (L99, baby!) Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: N. CA Posts: 3,976	I came to the conclusion long ago that sometimes you just have to pay the man. The Man that learned the trade - any trade, made all of the mistakes before you and has to earn a living too. And when the really good ones make it look too easy, it's hard to swallow the cost but generally worth it in the long run. I think we as humans tend to forget about the time and effort we put into fixing a problem. Stuff the pros charge for! __________________ “I don’t want to belong to any club that would have me as a member.” - Groucho Marx

08-31-2017, 09:59 AM	#13
myold88 Drives: SUMMIT WHITE 2SS/RS CAMARO Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: 2018: Lakewood Ranch, Fl. Posts: 8,114 View My Garage	Op. Did you buy this car new or do you know it's history? i hate to say it but your multiple electrical problems are consistent with a flood/water damaged car. The only reason I ask is because I don't remember other 5th Gen owners here on camaro5 having the same issues. As an insurance adjuster and salvage vehicle specialist, your problems are typical of water damage and those rarely ever get resolved 100%. I hope for your sake I'm way off base here and good luck with your repairs. __________________

08-30-2017, 07:57 PM	#3
Spec Account Suspended Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS LS3 Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Riverside, CA Posts: 4,018	I have some electrical background, but ask me about the electrical on these cars and you will get the old deer/headlight look... That said, I will say that when the BCM acts up, strange things happen. I replaced mine about a year ago or so now, when I just couldn't for the life of me get my passenger rear side markers to light up. Why just that light and not the others? I thought... Quickly soon after, my passenger side tail lights went out. What the heck? Nothing else was acting weird, but for the life of me I could not get them to work after extensive troubleshooting myself... even with my fleet mechanic. He brought out the testers and all the fancy electrical tools, and obviously power wasn't getting to them, but why??? I finally said screw it, I'm taking it to a local Car Electrical shop that had banners and all that saying - we can solve any vehicle electrical problem. Okay, prove it! heh... Took it in and a few hrs later, they tell me the BCM is having problems. Damn... so what's this going to cost me? In the end it was 450 in parts, 150 in labor. They order the part, it comes in the next day... I get the call and take the car back in... about an hour later I'm driving away, all problems behind me! I was skeptical at first... too good to be true... I swear I struggled for at least a couple of weeks. But to this day have had no further issues. I know that a lot of us would prefer to find the cause of a problem and work at it ourselves... but sometimes you really need to take it to people who study this, make this their lives, and are good at it, in order to fix these problems. I would say definitely have it checked out... I have no idea where they pulled the BCM from, lol, but just glad they did. If I ever have to replace it again, I'll definitely dive deep towards doing it myself. Not much help, but just my story.

08-30-2017, 10:23 PM	#5
gringo Account Suspended Drives: Camaro V6 Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: U.S. Posts: 1,722	$150 in labor just to unplug the old BCM and plug in the new one? Sheesh! What a ripoff!

08-31-2017, 08:04 AM	#9
MrChrisLS3 Drives: 2018 1SS M6 Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Houston Posts: 2,617	It really seems that there is a wiring issue/switch issue inside the door to me. I haven't pulled a door panel on anything made after 1996, but I know that there is a lot more to this stuff than those old systems. The most common sense thing I'm thinking is that somehow a wire got pinched, either around the door hinge or inside the door. When moisture hits it, it shorts out on another wire. Now finding something like that...I picture looking for a needle in haystack during a wind storm. But who knows, maybe it will be obvious once the panel is pulled...(which almost never happens, lol)

08-31-2017, 08:48 AM	#10
DvKillar Drives: 2015 Chevy Camaro 2LS Join Date: May 2017 Location: MWC, OK Posts: 815	I agreed with MrChris until you mentioned dash halo's. you sure there isn't a windshield leak that is getting your BCM wet? any dampness near the BCM under your steering wheel?

08-31-2017, 12:48 PM	#14
ATCK45 Drives: 2012 45th Anniversary Convertible Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Michigan Posts: 18	Look at the switch and the connector at the switch for corrosion. In addition connector X500 that goes between the door and the A-pillar, (it might actually be in the door itself) might be corroded. The circuit uses a power window driver (module) that drives the window motor, this driver has a separate input directly from the BCM which is why the window will still go up and down when you open and close the door but it doesn't work from the switch. This sounds like a typical corroded connector at the switch or X500. Couple thoughts.