[Nabush]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Firstly: there is no need to stagger brake pads torque wise on 1le as the system is designed for the same pads front and rear. No matter what pads you choose to run.

Secondly: if you felt any type of fade with oem Ferodo pads it is NOT the pads. It could be your fluid or perhaps pads havent been bedded in correctly. I run stockers on a variety of tracks in top groups (instructor/solo) up to 45min stints with zero fade.

Lastly: xp8s on the front are way too soft for the weight of the car. Xp10 is minimum imo but frankly it doesnt offer any improvement performance wise over a stock oem Ferodo as their characteristics are very similar. If for some reason you prefer Carbotechs over stock Ferodos then run xp10 front AND rear for proper braking bias.

Hope this helps. Cheers!

No fluid issues as the brake pedal stayed firm and consistent.

I don't know if stockers were bed in properly as I bought the car used at 10,000 miles... But I had the same issue as with my C7 GS with stock pads : vibrations due to pad deposits on the rotors.... it doesn't do that with the Carbotechs...But I did the bedding myself until I had no brakes....though to be honest I'm pretty disapointed with XP8 compared to my XP12/10 on the vette...(which is also lighter and has bigger rotors on the rear), they have way less bite, and lose grunt when really hot...

I have 10 miles plus hillclimbs near my home and load on the brakes is harder than on a roadcourse, because it is a lot of hard braking very close to each other, with very little time to cool down, and steep grades...

Should have bought XP12 like the vette, even for a daily, but was under this impression XP8 were superior to OEM anyway....

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Nabush

No fluid issues as the brake pedal stayed firm and consistent.

I don't know if stockers were bed in properly as I bought the car used at 10,000 miles... But I had the same issue as with my C7 GS with stock pads : vibrations due to pad deposits on the rotors.... it doesn't do that with the Carbotechs...But I did the bedding myself until I had no brakes....though to be honest I'm pretty disapointed with XP8 compared to my XP12/10 on the vette...(which is also lighter and has bigger rotors on the rear), they have way less bite, and lose grunt when really hot...

I have 10 miles plus hillclimbs near my home and load on the brakes is harder than on a roadcourse, because it is a lot of hard braking very close to each other, with very little time to cool down, and steep grades...

Should have bought XP12 like the vette, even for a daily, but was under this impression XP8 were superior to OEM anyway....

Weird as i have never experienced pad deposit issues with my car and i have tried 3 different pad types.
Hill climbs might be tough on brakes but so would be a 2 mile road course with 18 turns and elevation changes.
Again, zero fade.

Since you bought the car used i assume you have actually verified it had stock Ferodos on vs some other pad? If so was there enough pad left?

XP10 is on par with stock Ferodo imo. It performs in a very similar fashion torque level and longevity wise maybe with a slight edge re the latter going to the Ferodos. XP8 is not recommended as a front pad especially on heavy cars like ours. It is defo a big step down from XP10.
XP12 will offer more torque but wont last nearly as long as an XP10. Carbotech themselves warn about it.

There is no good reason not to run stock pads especially for dd (but not only) as they offer nice progressive torque levels and dont throw tons of heat et al (unlike higher torque pads). If somebody can get a better deal on Carbotechs then XP10 f and r would be my second choice.

Hope you will get it all sorted out. Cheers!

[Nabush]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Weird as i have never experienced pad deposit issues with my car and i have tried 3 different pad types.
Hill climbs might be tough on brakes but so would be a 2 mile road course with 18 turns and elevation changes.
Again, zero fade.

Since you bought the car used i assume you have actually verified it had stock Ferodos on vs some other pad? If so was there enough pad left?

XP10 is on par with stock Ferodo imo. It performs in a very similar fashion torque level and longevity wise maybe with a slight edge re the latter going to the Ferodos. XP8 is not recommended as a front pad especially on heavy cars like ours. It is defo a big step down from XP10.
XP12 will offer more torque but wont last nearly as long as an XP10. Carbotech themselves warn about it.

There is no good reason not to run stock pads especially for dd (but not only) as they offer nice progressive torque levels and dont throw tons of heat et al (unlike higher torque pads). If somebody can get a better deal on Carbotechs then XP10 f and r would be my second choice.

Hope you will get it all sorted out. Cheers!

The difference is that on hillclimbs the speeds is mainly between 40 to 80 mph (with some exceptions) and they are very twisty in my area, so not enough air to cool the brakes...sometimes you are on the brakes every 3-5 secs (and at the limit of grip of the Supercar 3 around 1.2G)

On a roadcourse, way often you have more time between corners, and you have straights to cool down your brakes (which in a way is good and bad as cinetical energy is square to the speed)

I found myself wearing more my tires and brakes on mountain roads than on a roadcourse, rapported to distance...
I'm originally from France, came in the US 2 years ago, was already the case there, except at Bugatti Le Mans which was really really hard on brakes, was eating 60% of my brakes pads In one day (50 laps) on my AP racing 6 pots 363mm + Pagid RS29 brakes on a track HR 350Z ...

Considering Gyrodisks on my C7 BTW...

Stock pads were in a good shape with plenty left..I'll check if they are Ferrodos. Perhaps I should give them another try but I'm assuming they are the same as the one I had on my GS and they didn't impress me much....

I think I remember Randy Pobst saying he was feeling brake fade on his hotlap at Laguna Secca with the 1 LE... So with stock pads...

Anyway it's a shame I choose the xp8 with the xp10 at 20 bucks more.

Putting xp8 on the rear should help for my braking balance I hope ...I can put xp10 later on on the front ?

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Nabush

The difference is that on hillclimbs the speeds is mainly between 40 to 80 mph (with some exceptions) and they are very twisty in my area, so not enough air to cool the brakes...sometimes you are on the brakes every 3-5 secs (and at the limit of grip of the Supercar 3 around 1.2G)

On a roadcourse, way often you have more time between corners, and you have straights to cool down your brakes (which in a way is good and bad as cinetical energy is square to the speed)

I found myself wearing more my tires and brakes on mountain roads than on a roadcourse, rapported to distance...
I'm originally from France, came in the US 2 years ago, was already the case there, except at Bugatti Le Mans which was really really hard on brakes, was eating 60% of my brakes pads In one day (50 laps) on my AP racing 6 pots 363mm + Pagid RS29 brakes on a track HR 350Z ...

Considering Gyrodisks on my C7 BTW...

Stock pads were in a good shape with plenty left..I'll check if they are Ferrodos. Perhaps I should give them another try but I'm assuming they are the same as the one I had on my GS and they didn't impress me much....

I think I remember Randy Pobst saying he was feeling brake fade on his hotlap at Laguna Secca with the 1 LE... So with stock pads...

Anyway it's a shame I choose the xp8 with the xp10 at 20 bucks more.

Putting xp8 on the rear should help for my braking balance I hope ...I can put xp10 later on on the front ?

Agree that most road courses permit for better cooling but the one i referred to does not. The straights are very short. One is on the throttle or brakes pretty much all the time. Yet ive never experienced any fade at all even when i really pushed hard for a whole stint.

Indeed Pobst did mention fade, but it is not clear whether it was a pad fade or soft pedal due to stock brake fluid. Who knows...Many folks on the forum run these cars at Laguna incl stock pads and i dont recall them complaining about fade (but the pads dont last long due to the nature of the course).

If i were you i would swap out the xp8s with xp10 or new stock pads asap. And then try re selling them if there is anything left of them I would also double check what pads the car came with on both front and rear. It is possible that the previous owner swapped put stock pads for street pads, etc.

Several folks here really like DC60s f and r for dual track and some dd purpose. Some also like st43s but then you must run SRF fluid as they will boil anything else.

Good luck!

[Nabush]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Agree that most road courses permit for better cooling but the one i referred to does not. The straights are very short. One is on the throttle or brakes pretty much all the time. Yet ive never experienced any fade at all even when i really pushed hard for a whole stint.

Indeed Pobst did mention fade, but it is not clear whether it was a pad fade or soft pedal due to stock brake fluid. Who knows...Many folks on the forum run these cars at Laguna incl stock pads and i dont recall them complaining about fade (but the pads dont last long due to the nature of the course).

If i were you i would swap out the xp8s with xp10 or new stock pads asap. And then try re selling them if there is anything left of them I would also double check what pads the car came with on both front and rear. It is possible that the previous owner swapped put stock pads for street pads, etc.

Several folks here really like DC60s f and r for dual track and some dd purpose. Some also like st43s but then you must run SRF fluid as they will boil anything else.

Good luck!

Thanks for your help

I'll take a look at the stock pads tomorrow. The thing is can I put back stock pads after Carbotech XP8 ? I will probably have to resurface my rotor heavily with sandpaper ....Are stock pads ceramic ?

Edit : Ferrodo HP1000/1 , so I Suppose it's OEM. Not a very racy coumpound for what I see...

[Nabush]

I put back OEM pads today....Found back good brake feel... And better stopping distances...No more messy ABS intervention...

I definitely :

- screwed up something with the XP8 when I did the bedding
- Or XP8 front, OEM rear affects badly brake bias
- Or Carbotech really need resurfacing rotors (I only used sandpaper like today)

What is strange is that the XP12 on the C7 work really well, and I had the OEM pads for 4,000 miles before I upgraded....And just sandpaper the rotors before putting new pads...

I may be interested in trying the Raybestos another time...

[carguy55]

Best place for OEM rotors is Rock Auto

ACDELCO 1771193 (177-1193) Left Front Rotor $ 329.79
ACDELCO 1771194 (177-1194) Right Front Rotor $ 329.79

[thescreensavers]

Just finished Installing Ti shims and ST43s

RC1382 is a better fit than the RC1405s on the fronts.

Edit: receipt says ST43R1382.16m , 16m is for 16mm thick.

There is more pad so should give a little more life.


Here is a pic comparing RC1382(Left) to Stoptech (309.14050) (Right) you can see there is more pad thickness.



From KNS Brakes

Raybestos only makes the 1382 and 1291 shape. It’s a better fit than the RC1405 which is made from a R1291

[Move_Over]

Originally Posted by carguy55

Best place for OEM rotors is Rock Auto

ACDELCO 1771193 (177-1193) Left Front Rotor $ 329.79
ACDELCO 1771194 (177-1194) Right Front Rotor $ 329.79

I would keep an eye on amazon prices for rotors. I just snagged 1193 for $239, and 1194 for $279. Prices went to $390 and $374 the following day.

[carguy55]

Originally Posted by Move_Over

I would keep an eye on amazon prices for rotors. I just snagged 1193 for $239, and 1194 for $279. Prices went to $390 and $374 the following day.

I always check before I buy

[Move_Over]

Originally Posted by thescreensavers

Just finished Installing Ti shims and ST43s

RC1382 is a better fit than the RC1405s on the fronts.

There is more pad so should give a little more life.


Here is a pic comparing RC1382(Left) to Stoptech (309.14050) (Right) you can see there is more pad thickness.



From KNS Brakes

Will you share where you purchased the ti shims from and the part number? Thanks!

[RUQWIKR]

I got my Ti shims off of eBay. Caliper temps dropped 40F front and rear.

[thescreensavers]

Originally Posted by Move_Over

Will you share where you purchased the ti shims from and the part number? Thanks!

From Girodisc

TS-1382-4 Fronts
TS-1718-4 Rears

[carguy55]

Originally Posted by Move_Over

I'll be trying out DTC60's at sebring this weekend. I'll let you all know how i like them VS stock pads.

How did it go with the DTC60's?