[RLHMARINES]

Originally Posted by Mountain

I didn't forget that point, on the prior Z/28. An awesome car, but it didn't quite "earn" or justify it's price point for customers to buy into it at the time. For what the car was capable of, what the car actually was, what was available in the current market and the cost of buy-in ($75k MSRP that was marked up obscenely by everyone)... hey, the last "true" Shelby also just came out during that time of the 5th Gen Z/28, and it started at a lower MSRP.

The angle I think the car could've had, or "has", today, is that the stage is open and prime: the electric future is near and Camaro has been slated to die several times already; the Gen 6 Camaro has been pretty dry the last few years in SS (2016)->SS 1LE+ZL1 (2017)->ZL1 1LE (2018)->nothing (2019)->nothing (2020)->nothing (2021)->nothing (2022); there isn't much out there for a recent, special FR American V8 sportscar: Corvette is mid-engine, Mustang's GT350 is dead, the GT500 was old news when it was released, the Mach 1 is too "parts-bin" akin of a thing (hey, it's a good car!), the Charger/Challenger thing is well worn out... do something special in the name of "pinnacle American V8, RWD, NA, can-have-a-manual" and market it that way, have it last model year of production. If GM split the Blackwing twins, only did one, used the other half of the budget towards this thing...

I am 100% not interested in buy anything new that has come out recently, nor anything that is coming out. A 6th Gen Z/28 is definitely something that could change my mind, knowing how awesome the SS 1LE is, considering an "upped" and more special version of that...

Lol, it wont happen. Just a bunch of "I wish" thinking.

I totally agree that the Z/28 doesn't have to be a ZLE killer...it just needs to be a naturally aspirated high revving alter ego...akin to what the P cars have in the 911 Turbo/GT3/GT2 siblings. They all target a specific buyer without cannibalizing one another's legion of loyal buyer demographics.

The regular Z/28 would be a ZL1 without the LT4 supercharged engine and with MR shocks for a lower downforce car while the Z/28.R or Z/28 1LE would be dressed in the ZLE hardware with DSSV's and wings/canards with maybe a Z07 like option for carbon brakes and carbon wheels but also without the LT4 supercharged engine. Flat plane crank Z06 like engine and manual trans for the win.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by RLHMARINES

I totally agree that the Z/28 doesn't have to be a ZLE killer...it just needs to be a naturally aspirated high revving alter ego...akin to what the P cars have in the 911 Turbo/GT3/GT2 siblings. They all target a specific buyer without cannibalizing one another's legion of loyal buyer demographics.

The regular Z/28 would be a ZL1 without the LT4 supercharged engine and with MR shocks for a lower downforce car while the Z/28.R or Z/28 1LE would be dressed in the ZLE hardware with DSSV's and wings/canards with maybe a Z07 like option for carbon brakes and carbon wheels but also without the LT4 supercharged engine. Flat plane crank Z06 like engine and manual trans for the win.

The problem is then where does it fit in the line up and who is it for? With all that stuff, it would most likely cost more than the ZLE yet not be able to outperform it. the 5th gen car kind of put the Z/28 name in a trick bag because it was the ultimate camaro.

Porsche can get away with that kind of stuff, not sure GM can.

[90503]

Put a Z/28 Sticker Package on a 1SS 1LE and call it a day....sheesh....

Or better yet, a Z/28 Sticker Package on a V-6 1LE...Those aren't over the cubic inch limits of the original Z/28's...

[Mountain]

Originally Posted by shaffe

The problem is then where does it fit in the line up and who is it for? With all that stuff, it would most likely cost more than the ZLE yet not be able to outperform it. the 5th gen car kind of put the Z/28 name in a trick bag because it was the ultimate camaro.

Porsche can get away with that kind of stuff, not sure GM can.

Maybe not? lol

The car would serve less as "x-level Camaro in the line up" and more as the "good-bye edition" to what Camaro has been. The Z/28 name is the performance name that has stuck around in Camaro the longest and most frequent.

Like said, just take the ZL1 (non-1LE)*, use a NA engine and change up some of the aero/front end a bit. In addition to Z/28 badging, give it special Camaro emblems, to add: something like replacing the red, white and blue in the emblem to checkers or checker the red, white and blue.

Haha, make the car only come in red, white and blue, too.

*For 2022, whenever those end up being built, you can essentially get a ZL1 with an LT1, minus the front end, as you can now option the ZL1 brake package on an SS/SS 1LE. So maybe you just make a unique front end for the Z/28.

Originally Posted by 90503

Put a Z/28 Sticker Package on a 1SS 1LE and call it a day....sheesh....

Or better yet, a Z/28 Sticker Package on a V-6 1LE...Those aren't over the cubic inch limits of the original Z/28's...

[RLHMARINES]

Dedicated track rats who long for a lighter weight car above the SS 1LE with more factory warranted power that would be easier on consumables but approaches the ZL1 1LE’s abilities on track.

GM could save money by co-certifying this and the Z06 together with the same engine maybe, I’m just spit balling here on what’s possible from an enthusiasts perspective.

[Bhobbs]

GM missed the opportunity to develop a naturally aspirated engine for the C7 GS and Z/28. Probably didn’t want the GS to step on the toes of the C7 Z06.


As for where it fits, does it matter at this point? Whoever wanted a ZLE probably bought one already. Not many people are buying the Camaro. They could easily drop the ZLE package and revive the Z/28 at this point. It would inject some life in a dying car.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Mountain

Maybe not? lol

The car would serve less as "x-level Camaro in the line up" and more as the "good-bye edition" to what Camaro has been. The Z/28 name is the performance name that has stuck around in Camaro the longest and most frequent.

Like said, just take the ZL1 (non-1LE)*, use a NA engine and change up some of the aero/front end a bit. In addition to Z/28 badging, give it special Camaro emblems, to add: something like replacing the red, white and blue in the emblem to checkers or checker the red, white and blue.

Haha, make the car only come in red, white and blue, too.

*For 2022, whenever those end up being built, you can essentially get a ZL1 with an LT1, minus the front end, as you can now option the ZL1 brake package on an SS/SS 1LE. So maybe you just make a unique front end for the Z/28.

Aren't you just suggesting an SS w/ 1LE package?

Originally Posted by RLHMARINES

Dedicated track rats who long for a lighter weight car above the SS 1LE with more factory warranted power that would be easier on consumables but approaches the ZL1 1LE’s abilities on track.

GM could save money by co-certifying this and the Z06 together with the same engine maybe, I’m just spit balling here on what’s possible from an enthusiasts perspective.

For an engine, you are certifying the model, not the engine. Even the SAE HP requires correct intake and exhaust if I recall correctly.

There are still costs to calibrate the engine in the model as well. A lighter, more aerodynamic Corvette with a completely different transmission is a completely different calibration.

From what I was told several years ago it's not a huge cost to put an engine in with a common block. That can maintain engine mounts and packaging.

But change the mass up front, lighter or heavier and you are also doing chassis calibration as well.

Change the HP and or add a SC/Turbo, more calibration.

And more HP requires durability, and if the HP is above what is available it's more than just engine on a dyno.

There are a ton of little complexities to putting a new engine in an existing model.

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

GM missed the opportunity to develop a naturally aspirated engine for the C7 GS and Z/28. Probably didn’t want the GS to step on the toes of the C7 Z06.


As for where it fits, does it matter at this point? Whoever wanted a ZLE probably bought one already. Not many people are buying the Camaro. They could easily drop the ZLE package and revive the Z/28 at this point. It would inject some life in a dying car.

As for a NA engine above an LT1, well that was LT2 but designed for the C8 and that was a nice 40 HP bump. But from what I've read, that engine doesn't package as is in the Camaro and that's, you guest correctly, more engineers time and money not going to EVs

I think if they just rebadged the ZL1 1LE as a Z/28 this place would explode and I doubt Reuss would ever approve such a thing as it was his idea to change the Z/28 to ZL1 on the Gen5 in the first place.

[DaveC113]

A Z/28 w/FPC V8 really doesn't make sense given the new C8 Z06 is starting around $80k. Why would you possibly want to buy a slower, less desirable, ~400lb heavier, front engine version?

IMO this was all clickbait BS made-up by online "media". There was never gonna be a 6th gen Z/28.

[396ssrat]

Unfortunately the modern day Camaro is go fast in circles on sunday and sell less new Camaro's on monday. Build a 1/4 mile version and beat the Mopar and watch the sales skyrocket.

[waterman]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

A Z/28 w/FPC V8 really doesn't make sense given the new C8 Z06 is starting around $80k. Why would you possibly want to buy a slower, less desirable, ~400lb heavier, front engine version?

IMO this was all clickbait BS made-up by online "media". There was never gonna be a 6th gen Z/28.

C8 Z51 is a big ol' fat girl at 3577.

ZLE at 3821 manual/3885 auto is only 244 more.

Those are Chevrolet published curb weights.

Bear with me, I'm thinking outside of the box. No disrespect implied.

Take a ZLE; Replace the climate control electric Recaros with manual seats, save 50 lbs. LT6 (615/525 est.) is likely 75 lbs. less that LT4 (650/650). DCT's are heavy, TR6060 is easily 50 lbs. lighter. Delete some sound deadening, back seats, phone charger, heated steering wheel.

(I know what you are thinking...Replace the seats in your ZLE. One would have to be a electrical engineer to refit seats in this car. Code city. I am also aware that to meet safety standards Chevy would have to engineer side air bag into my hypothetical manual Recaros).

Heck you still have a stereo, infotainment screen and AC and you are already close in weight to C8 Z51. Dump those and you are under.

Depending on how much pork Tadge and his team trim out of C8 Z06, that car (Z/28) could be close in weight as well.

In my humble opinion, hypothetical G6 Z/28 would be quicker on most (especially technical) circuits than ZLE. Tracks like Nordschleife and Daytona road course will still favor ZLE.

It won't happen but it could be done at a reasonable price point...and Camaro could gloriously sail into the sunset.

[ZRacerLE]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

A Z/28 w/FPC V8 really doesn't make sense given the new C8 Z06 is starting around $80k. Why would you possibly want to buy a slower, less desirable, ~400lb heavier, front engine version?

IMO this was all clickbait BS made-up by online "media". There was never gonna be a 6th gen Z/28.

C8s are heavy. The stingray weighs almost as much as an SS1LE. Not sure the C8Z can get much lighter than the stingray with that heavier DOHC engine and beefed up components. They're already using lots of magnesium I believe.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by ZRacerLE

C8s are heavy. The stingray weighs almost as much as an SS1LE. Not sure the C8Z can get much lighter than the stingray with that heavier DOHC engine and beefed up components. They're already using lots of magnesium I believe.

Google suggests there is a 370 pound difference between the 2.

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by Number 3

As for a NA engine above an LT1, well that was LT2 but designed for the C8 and that was a nice 40 HP bump. But from what I've read, that engine doesn't package as is in the Camaro and that's, you guest correctly, more engineers time and money not going to EVs

That probably has a lot to do with the high rise intake and front mounted dry sump tank. The front mounted dry sump tank gives me the opinion that GM never intended to put the LT2 in the Camaro.

Originally Posted by Number 3

Google suggests there is a 370 pound difference between the 2.

Car and Driver weighed the C8 Z51 at 3647 pounds and the 6th gen SS 1LE at 3743 pounds.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

That probably has a lot to do with the high rise intake and front mounted dry sump tank. The front mounted dry sump tank gives me the opinion that GM never intended to put the LT2 in the Camaro.



Car and Driver weighed the C8 Z51 at 3647 pounds and the 6th gen SS 1LE at 3743 pounds.

Way more than GM's numbers which show 3366 dry for the Stingray and adding 40 pounds for the Z51