[Camaro Dude]

Originally Posted by PYROLYSIS

Your guess is as good as mine. I think all the pieces are there from what we've seen so far. The only thing I think the current 1LE would have over a stock 6th gen SS is tires. The Goodyear Eagles are not daily driving year round tires even way down here in South Carolina. Lap for lap do I think a 6th gen SS could be quicker than a fifth gen 1LE with a less aggressive tire? My money is on the sixth gen and I've seen as much as everybody else on here.

Only thing I'm thinking though is that a stock/base Gen6 SS will still have to cater to the bread and butter (I want a comfortable ride) crowd as well.

I dunno just thinking out loud here.

A performance package like the 1LE believe it or not, for many is too stiff, sad as that may sound. You can't have both without sacrifices is what I'm getting at.

[KMPrenger]

Originally Posted by snarky

apparently I expect too much. 400 - 500lbs would be awesome. 200lbs is just one less passenger.

Originally Posted by suzook

Agreed. I was expecting 400 pounds. Thats a difference worth mentioning.

Originally Posted by snarky

The ATS 2.5, 2.0T and 3.6 all weigh 3300 - 3400 range so I don't see why 3400 - 3500 is not possible....

Yeah...400 or 500 lbs sounds nice...but it isn't happening. You may think 200 lbs isn't a big deal, but it is. I don't know how else to say it, but losing as much weight as you guys would like to see lost would put the Camaro at or under the weight of the Corvette. Again...not happening. Hope that puts it in perspective.

Look at how well the Camaro can perform at 3,900 lbs. This newer one will lose weight, and sounds as though it will have even less unsprung weight which will make it that much better. Be happy guys.

Originally Posted by PYROLYSIS

Your guess is as good as mine. I think all the pieces are there from what we've seen so far. The only thing I think the current 1LE would have over a stock 6th gen SS is tires. The Goodyear Eagles are not daily driving year round tires even way down here in South Carolina. Lap for lap do I think a 6th gen SS could be quicker than a fifth gen 1LE with a less aggressive tire? My money is on the sixth gen and I've seen as much as everybody else on here.

I don't doubt at all that we might see the 2016 SS (or maybe the SS with some type of performance package?) get close to the handling capabilities of the 1LE...but I wouldn't bet that it can outcorner it. That said, the increased handling, + the increase in acceleration could equal a 1LE beater.

But we all know the rave reviews the Alpha chassis has gotten on the ATS and the CTS.....it should be one heck of a good driver's car.

[mr02Z/28]

<~~~~~~ is definitely looking forward to buying a 2016 Camaro SS or maybe a Turbo 4( if available) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PYROLYSIS]

Originally Posted by Camaro Dude

Only thing I'm thinking though is that a stock/base Gen6 SS will still have to cater to the bread and butter (I want a comfortable ride) crowd as well.

I dunno just thinking out loud here.

A performance package like the 1LE believe it or not, for many is too stiff, sad as that may sound. You can't have both without sacrifices is what I'm getting at.

I don't find the 1LE harsh at all and its a huge improvement in ride quality over the 3rd and fourth gens I've daily driven since the year 2000. I don't think Al's comments about increased agility apply to just the high performance models. I would expect that across the board. You're right that they can't have a standard aggressive suspension setup with most of these just being daily drivers but I think they took a lot of feedback to heart. Many were saying that the 1LE is how the 2010 SS should have been from the start. It sounds like they are trying to improve handling without sacrificing too much comfort. 200 lbs lighter goes a long way and everybody on here should be jumping for joy with this announcement. It's exactly what we've asked for.

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

I don't doubt at all that we might see the 2016 SS (or maybe the SS with some type of performance package?) get close to the handling capabilities of the 1LE...but I wouldn't bet that it can outcorner it. That said, the increased handling, + the increase in acceleration could equal a 1LE beater.

If we get MRC as an option, don't think it would be hard to get 1LE cornering and good ride quality for those not looking for something too firm for DD.

[KaBoom1701]

200lbs less + Mag-Ride = awesome performance .......

Let's see

[FINALLYSATISFIED]

I'll wait til May 16 before I say anything..

[Mr Twisty]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

not even close...the 1997 Camaro? 15 MILLION build combinations -- trust me on this as I did the math. We built 60 thousand Camaros that year. The costs to offer those 15 million build combinations was one of the reasons that the car went away for a while..........


How many 'stripped' Camaros do we build? Go look at the build numbers as they're on this site. The reality is that the number is very small. The car MUST be appealing to a wide audience in order to be successful. Not everyone wants a seat warmer - but some do - so you must offer it as part of a package. Same for power seats....there was huge outrage when we didn't offer a power passenger seat in the 2010 Camaro. We listened to the customer and it's now part of a package. It's never easy to make any of these decisions - but listening to the customer -- the voice of the collective customer -- makes a successful automobile. No, we won't make everyone happy - we're not about to put manual windows in a Camaro as the costs to do so are staggering. (engineering two types of door innards and wiring harnesses...)

Yeah, we've had that discussion before, and you're right, I guess I'm a dying breed...Someone that enjoys the drive more than the destination...

I'm just ticked off at all these new safety measures they're cramming down our throats, my "Collision Mitigation System" (that's what Meritor Wabco calls it) activated on an overpass today, engaged the brakes and almost shoved a truck up my butt. Some [edited for political rhetoric] put crap on my truck that I can't control, and even more so, that takes control away from me... I don't like it. A lot.

Tell the engineers to invent a device that will disable cell reception in a moving vehicle. THAT'S collision mitigation I can support!

[HDRDTD]

Originally Posted by Mr Twisty

Tell the engineers to invent a device that will disable cell reception in a moving vehicle. THAT'S collision mitigation I can support!

Let's hear a big HELL YES !!!!!
to a cell phone jammer.

I just want one that has about a two car range.

[snarky]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Yes, for an equivalent 4 or 6 cylinder.

We know that adding the V8 and all it's necessary goodies add around 200 pounds to the Camaro today.

What everyone has been doing is exactly what you did, assume that because a 2.0T ATS weighs 3,400 pounds that you should be able to get a 3,400 pound SS Camaro. Nope. That would require a significant amount of premium materials and drive the price higher resulting in lower volumes, resulting in 2003 all over again. No thank you.

In today's market, 200 pounds is a big deal. Yes, I realize there is a small sample of people that want an engine, transmission, brakes and a steering wheel. That does not make a great car, though. In fact it would make a car that would be so s%&(ty that only a few would buy it. Think COPO volumes. A great car for the few that need that.......a crappy car for pretty much anyone that also likes to drive to work everyday, go on a weekend trip once in a while. There has to be the ability to provide the features that most people want in a car.

I hate to remind you guys, but most Camaro owners don't even know this site exists...or any Camaro site for that matter. To most, it's a really nice car they enjoy owning and driving and as long as it's economical, the insurance premiums are decent and it is reliable, they'll keep driving it. But that's all it means to most buyers or lessees. No mods, no track days. Those are the bread and butter customers GM has to attract with this new car. It simply has to be a great car first, then a great Camaro.

So the Camaro needs to be a simply awesome coupe. The V6 does in fact have to compete with not only the Mustang, but also Honda Accord Coupe. It just has to be better on so many levels that the minimalist crowd will be disappointed. My guess is they will be the only ones disappointed, because I am expecting some pretty great stuff coming our way.

As for the safety stuff, well get ready for the mandates. Once you see statistics that cars with active safety features save lives, they will become mandatory. It's coming.

I didn't say 3400-3500 for an SS model. The base model should be between 3430 and 3575. The mention of cadillac using premium materials that a camaro owner can't afford is silly. ATS models here excluding V-series sell for between 28k and 50K. Not exactly "upmarket".

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by snarky

I didn't say 3400-3500 for an SS model. The base model should be between 3430 and 3575. The mention of cadillac using premium materials that a camaro owner can't afford is silly. ATS models here excluding V-series sell for between 28k and 50K. Not exactly "upmarket".

Sorry, sticker on an ATS is $33,200 with a 2.5 liter 4 cylinder. Put in the 2.0T and you are at $36,240. A V6 to compare to today's Camaro is $42,000. And I don't think anyone is suggesting (at least I hope not) that the Camaro gets the 2.5

It's not what a Camaro owner can afford. It's simply the material cost in the product. There are premium materials in the ATS. Now GM has already shown aluminum chassis bits that are replacing steel. That is a huge premium. Aluminum is much more expensive than steel. What I am afraid of is the use of premium materials in the chassis results in a cheaper interior. But even worse, it will be like the new Tahoe. Yes, the base version is only slightly more expensive than the outgoing model. But you can option one up to around $75,000. OUCH.

And probably confusing several peoples comments on 4 to 500 pound weight loss. That is a 3400 pound SS and there are a few people here thinking that was possible and going on to claim a big fail on GM's part if not. So sorry if that wasn't your intent.

But keep in mind, these are teaser comments to wet our appetite, not things to argue over. And it seems like we are arguing over nothing more than a few comments and pics.

[davidcroft]

Originally Posted by 69RSSS

Are we ready to start guessing at the cost of the 6th gen? The thing sounds like it is going to be amazing. With an updated interior (we're hoping for), and the lighter weight (more expensive materials???), do we think GM will be able to keep the Camaro at the same price point it has been at?

NO, It's going to be considerably more. I have heard strong rumors of that. If you look at Silverado and Tahoe and Stingray(compared to previous models)....you'll see where the trend is headed.

It's all in the interior and "options" that everyone cries for....then doesn't wanna pay for.

Now to corral the discussion back in....The weight savings + the LT1 is gonna be wicked. I've seen a few all-motor VVT camshaft/header combinations where the TQ is INSTANT and carries all the way through on some Stingrays. No flat plane crank or carbon fiber wheeled rice-mobile will outrun that. Especially not if the $$ is equal.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Happy to see more examples of how they're not messing around with this one!

Buh-bye, Mustang.....and a lot of other cars.

[Posaune]

Originally Posted by davidcroft

NO, It's going to be considerably more. I have heard strong rumors of that. If you look at Silverado and Tahoe and Stingray(compared to previous models)....you'll see where the trend is headed.

It's all in the interior and "options" that everyone cries for....then doesn't wanna pay for.

It will still need to be priced competitively with the Mustang. Unless GM is going for Challenger volume, I don't see them increasing to match Challenger pricing.