[VR Baron]

Originally Posted by apexit53

Had some fun with some "camC" prep

19x11 square with 285/305 2017 build date RE71R's lol

it was a blast but had zero grip lol.

Looks like fun! Yeah I get to polish off my four year old,100 lap re71s in two weeks at our last event . Will be interesting!

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by apexit53

Had some fun with some "camC" prep

19x11 square with 285/305 2017 build date RE71R's lol

it was a blast but had zero grip lol.

Good to hear you'll be going CAM! I hope to make the Lincoln nats events next year so hopefully I'll see ya there.

What are you doing for suspension? I recently got a DSC controller and am considering ordering some custom springs with higher rate, 1" overall drop and they'd also account for the fact Vorshlag plates drop the front end a bit, so more rear drop than front. Rate increase may be limited by the rebound valving in the OEM shocks but I'd guess it can be a good bit higher.

[apexit53]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

Good to hear you'll be going CAM! I hope to make the Lincoln nats events next year so hopefully I'll see ya there.

What are you doing for suspension? I recently got a DSC controller and am considering ordering some custom springs with higher rate, 1" overall drop and they'd also account for the fact Vorshlag plates drop the front end a bit, so more rear drop than front. Rate increase may be limited by the rebound valving in the OEM shocks but I'd guess it can be a good bit higher.

While i have a build in mind for my car to go to cam, I don't yet plan to do cam, not regularly though lol.

I do think futzing with a DSC controller would be fun and talking to Robert it would help, but id rather go with their whole coilover setup. Just a large expense right now and FS is, "cheaper" lol

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by apexit53

While i have a build in mind for my car to go to cam, I don't yet plan to do cam, not regularly though lol.

I do think futzing with a DSC controller would be fun and talking to Robert it would help, but id rather go with their whole coilover setup. Just a large expense right now and FS is, "cheaper" lol

Yeah, the whole DSC setup is around $8k, and definitely not required to have a competitive CAM car. I only have Hotchkis ft bar, ZLE rear bar, ZLE rear subframe bushings and it does quite well with a good driver at the wheel, lol. I've had a few really good drivers codrive with me and the car has done very well. Last race it got within a few tenths of a GT3 driven by a great driver, GT3 got 1st in PAX and FTD, my Camaro was 2nd, beating a few M2s along the way. I managed 11th out of about 90 drivers.

I think the DSC and a set of springs may make for some nice improvements for a more reasonable price. I picked up the V4 DSC used for $800. I also looked at removing the AFM lifters and adding a cam + flex fuel, it's about the same cost as a DSC coilover setup! That money is going into a GT4 fund, lol.

No way I'm spending big-$ for a CAM setup. If I wanted to I'd probably start with a CAM-T Mustang.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

What are you doing for suspension? I recently got a DSC controller and am considering ordering some custom springs with higher rate, 1" overall drop

I would actually be interested in hearing more about these springs, if/when you are able to share. I don't plan to run CAM-C at national events, but you never know. I do run it locally, so I've toyed with the idea of getting a set of 19x11/12 wheels and the DSC controller: things that could very quickly be removed for national events. But if I ever did go to CAM for real, I think it would be interesting to try a simple spring swap combined with the DSC controller.

[/quote]Rate increase may be limited by the rebound valving in the OEM shocks but I'd guess it can be a good bit higher.[/QUOTE]
My understanding is that the MR dampers can effectively be locked with enough voltage to the fluid, so there's no real limit on damping rates in either direction. I think the springs currently in the aftermarket are all too soft for fastest speeds, and 1" lower could also be better.

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by Msquared

I would actually be interested in hearing more about these springs, if/when you are able to share. I don't plan to run CAM-C at national events, but you never know. I do run it locally, so I've toyed with the idea of getting a set of 19x11/12 wheels and the DSC controller: things that could very quickly be removed for national events. But if I ever did go to CAM for real, I think it would be interesting to try a simple spring swap combined with the DSC controller.

For sure, I'll contact the spring mfg'er, I'm thinking Hyperco, and also see if DSC can offer some input if not write a basemap for them. The std DSC basemaps could also just be changed by a % based on the change in spring rate, and we could go from there. It's also likely ordering more springs makes the price cheaper, and there may be a minimum order, so I'll post up here and on FB if it's possible to get custom springs made.

Good to hear the OEM magride damping is nearly unlimited, I wasn't sure if that would limit the potential increase in spring rate.

The off-the-shelf spring options need to stay pretty close to OEM rates to avoid damping issues, but if we can adjust damping then we can adjust spring rates too. Ideally, I'm thinking of something in between SLE and ZLE rates, maybe slightly closer to ZLE. It would be a pretty large change overall but right now the car is a bit soft and overdamped in track mode. It is amazing how well it works, GM's damping is really good but compromised for a smooth ride.

I also wasn't super happy the Vorshlag camber plates lowered the front end a bit, there's no great way to correct for that, but new springs could.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

For sure, I'll contact the spring mfg'er, I'm thinking Hyperco, and also see if DSC can offer some input if not write a basemap for them. The std DSC basemaps could also just be changed by a % based on the change in spring rate, and we could go from there.

I would agree with a global increase in rebound rates, with probably not much increase in compression rates...at least to start. In theory, the rebound damping controls the sprung mass whereas the compression damping controls the unsprung mass. So the spring rates should only affect the rebound damping needs. That's on paper, and I would guess it applies more to high-speed damping than low-speed damping. So maybe a global increase in high/low-speed rebound and just low-speed compression?

Ideally, I'm thinking of something in between SLE and ZLE rates, maybe slightly closer to ZLE. It would be a pretty large change overall but right now the car is a bit soft and overdamped in track mode. It is amazing how well it works, GM's damping is really good but compromised for a smooth ride.

I agree with this, too. That would plug a big gap in the aftermarket.

[DaveC113]

Ok, looks like custom springs are possible.

I have not finalized anything, open to input on rates and drop. Also if anyone knows OEM SLE and ZLE rates off the top of their head let me know, I haven't had a chance to research that yet. I am thinking something like 1.7x OEM rates, 5/8" drop up front, 1" in back (accounts for Vorshlag plates, and camber reduces ride height a bit too).

Also if anyone is interested please let me know, post here or PM me. Price depends on volume so it would be good to gauge interest.

The DSC magride controller would be necessary to adjust the shocks to match the new springs. It's $1400 msrp. However, the DSC coilover kit is $6500, so about $8k total. I am hoping the springs will be a few hundred a set if we can get a little volume, so a much more affordable solution.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

Ok, looks like custom springs are possible.

Just a thought: this might be worthy of its own thread.

Also if anyone knows OEM SLE and ZLE rates off the top of their head let me know, I haven't had a chance to research that yet.

This is a good question, but the answer seems...complicated for some reason. This thread tried to delve into it, but you'll see from my questions that I'm not sure it has the SS 1LE rates and SS rates correct. I wondered if they had those two cars' rear rates accidently flipped. I think it's correct on the ZLE rates, though. Maybe that's enough. There is supporting evidence about the ZLE rates from Chevy themselves, when they introduced the ZLE aftermarket kit: see the increase in rates they spec in the second pic of this thread. Finally, one can look at the test results from Powell's YYZ spring comparison charts, where the yellow line is the ZLE spring rate in each graph (one front, one rear). I'm linking Wildhammer's site because you can zoom in on the small graphs. I don't think we ever solved the puzzle of what springs each of the other lines on the graph are.

I am thinking something like 1.7x OEM rates, 5/8" drop up front, 1" in back (accounts for Vorshlag plates, and camber reduces ride height a bit too).

My other suggestion would be to stay away from progressive rates. Linear rates are the preferred route for a car without significant ground effects down force. There's a lot of belief in voodoo out there, but simpler is better in this case.

[rotis]

Ran the SW divisional last weekend, it was my first time going to GrandSport Raceway, what a great site! My driving on Saturday was pretty poor, putting me out of contention for Top PAX, but I put in some good runs on Sunday-

[RUQWIKR]

Originally Posted by rotis

Ran the SW divisional last weekend, it was my first time going to GrandSport Raceway, what a great site! My driving on Saturday was pretty poor, putting me out of contention for Top PAX, but I put in some good runs on Sunday-

Nice! What tires and wheel size(s)?

[apexit53]

Originally Posted by rotis

Ran the SW divisional last weekend, it was my first time going to GrandSport Raceway, what a great site! My driving on Saturday was pretty poor, putting me out of contention for Top PAX, but I put in some good runs on Sunday-

when did you move to texas??

[rotis]

Originally Posted by RUQWIKR

Nice! What tires and wheel size(s)?

315/30-18 Nankang CR-1, on 18x12 square.

The tires are about 18 months old and have somewhere north of 160 runs, they are starting to run out of tread but still work for the most part.

[rotis]

Originally Posted by apexit53

when did you move to texas??

In March of this year, moved to be closer to family.