[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Number 3

But all that unravels with the CTS going off a bigger A2xx and the ATS going smaller. Interesting to see how this plays out as a viable Cadillac is likely more important than the Camaro in the bigger picture.

Maybe a stretched Corvette Chassis.

But seriously, you're likely right - Camaro will follow the Cadillac, if they're sharing a chassis. Perhaps Cadillac has helped pay for Alpha as it is, and they reuse it as legacy for the next generation.

[Chazzz]

I seriously question if Chrysler will ever replace the rapidly aging Charger/Challenger as they were due for redesign in 2018 and it has now been put on hold until possibly 2021. Adding to this is the fact that the Charger/Challenger/300 are the only remaining passenger cars in the entire Chrysler/Dodge lineup. They are rapidly converting all their car plants to SUV truck and Jeep production. Keep in mind the current Challenger made its debut all the way back in 2008 and that's two years before Gen5 Camaro! Talk about dated, but yet overall sales numbers have been competing with Gen6. What the Challenger is getting for its decade old design in 2018 is a refresh a new AWD six cylinder model more special edition packages and a wide body hellcat with more room for bigger tires that might be able to handle all that power.

[camaro5]

Originally Posted by samurai

Have in mind that Mustang facelift deliveries started, new models should usally end in a sales bump

Originally Posted by Bongos2U

Yep...and Ford is probably having fire sales for the outgoing '17 Mustang to clear dealer lots.

Yes. We're going to take a hit here for a while as mustang refresh has begun deliveries.

Let's see how long their new-model sales push lasts.

Ford has just raised mustang gt pp1 prices $4000 with the refresh!

That's gonna hurt sooner or later, and the 2019 Camaro refresh is coming this summer, only months away.

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

It's not nearly that bad from a profitability standpoint...the car is built in a shared plant with a shared platform (that meets crash-test standards). 4th gen had all those issues and more.

But we can safely assume they are thinking hard about how to increase sales.

$4000 mustang gt pp1 price increase is going help level the playing field, combined with a decontented 2019 SS at a competitive (to mustang gt w/ no pp) entry price.

Originally Posted by Chazzz

I seriously question if Chrysler will ever replace the rapidly aging Charger/Challenger as they were due for redesign in 2018 and it has now been put on hold until possibly 2021. Adding to this is the fact that the Charger/Challenger/300 are the only remaining passenger cars in the entire Chrysler/Dodge lineup. They are rapidly converting all their car plants to SUV truck and Jeep production. Keep in mind the current Challenger made its debut all the way back in 2008 and that's two years before Gen5 Camaro! Talk about dated, but yet overall sales numbers have been competing with Gen6. What the Challenger is getting for its decade old design in 2018 is a refresh a new AWD six cylinder model more special edition packages and a wide body hellcat with more room for bigger tires that might be able to handle all that power.

The Maserati (owned by FCA) Ghibli is the basis for the next Challenger and Charger.

The Dodge Challenger and Charger will move to the Maserati Ghibli’s platform for 2021.

The Challenger and Charger will remain on the aging Chrysler LX platform for a few years longer, with an updated version of the cars due in 2019.

The vehicles will then undergo a complete redesign for 2021, at which point they will move to the Ghibli’s platform.
The Ghibli is loosely based on the full-size Maserati Quattroporte, sharing aspects of its suspension and steering.
It’s not clear how much of the equipment used in the Ghibli will carry over to the Challenger and Charger.

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-platform.html

[Bongos2U]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

It's not nearly that bad from a profitability standpoint...the car is built in a shared plant with a shared platform (that meets crash-test standards). 4th gen had all those issues and more.

But we can safely assume they are thinking hard about how to increase sales.

Exactly. GM management during the time of the 4th gen. was pretty inept.

Mark Reuss has said recently that they might change the price structure of the 6th gen. Camaro (especially the SS), to reflect a less expensive entry price point.

I think there will definitely be a 7th. gen. Camaro. But, good God, it better have more distinct styling and better visibility.

[ChefBorOzzy]

I'm fine with evolutionary styling for a couple gens or perhaps even longer if done right. Saw a black SS with silver stripes yesterday and it looked menacing, where a Mustang in GT trim looks pedestrian to me stock.. Can be made to look pretty good with small changes though. GT350 is great.

[Selo]

FCA has a problem on their hands. The Challenger is a huge success pretty much based on cosmetics alone. The ride is pretty generic - once driving it could just as well be a Chrysler 300 or a Charger. It would be like having a Camaro that drove just like a Malibu. So what the hell do they do with a refresh? If it doesn't still look exactly like an old Challenger, it loses 90% of it's.buyers. But if they leave it the same, well, they can't. It's old, heavy, and gets bad mileage. And after 12 years I'd guess most everybody who wants one will have gotten one. Then again, it worked for Porsche 911 for quite awhile too.......

[Chazzz]

If FCA is successful in their bid to sell off the Chrysler division that Maserati based Chellenger will either never happen or if it does it will probably go the way of the Chrysler/Mercedes Crossfire SRT6.

[Marty McFlew]

Originally Posted by Chazzz

I seriously question if Chrysler will ever replace the rapidly aging Charger/Challenger as they were due for redesign in 2018 and it has now been put on hold until possibly 2021. Adding to this is the fact that the Charger/Challenger/300 are the only remaining passenger cars in the entire Chrysler/Dodge lineup. They are rapidly converting all their car plants to SUV truck and Jeep production. Keep in mind the current Challenger made its debut all the way back in 2008 and that's two years before Gen5 Camaro! Talk about dated, but yet overall sales numbers have been competing with Gen6. What the Challenger is getting for its decade old design in 2018 is a refresh a new AWD six cylinder model more special edition packages and a wide body hellcat with more room for bigger tires that might be able to handle all that power.

Yep...thats been Sergios plan all along. He planned on that happening earlier but the muscle car wars started up again. Its why he dumped the name Dodge from the Truck line and rename it RAM. His idea was to kill Dodge all together and focus on FIAT and the Trucks/RAM putting Dodge in the history books. Only thing is FIAT did not take off like he thought it would. And the Challenger and Charger picked up the pace. Don't know his plans now. Last I heard he was trying to sell the whole shop to somebody else. Its a shame Dodge name was removed from the Truckline because the Dodge truck has so much history. WW2 Dodge trucks/Power Wagon was the go to truck for getting the job done. Thats what happens when America sells out to foreigners.

[Zeke.Malvo]

Originally Posted by Selo

FCA has a problem on their hands. The Challenger is a huge success pretty much based on cosmetics alone. The ride is pretty generic - once driving it could just as well be a Chrysler 300 or a Charger. It would be like having a Camaro that drove just like a Malibu. So what the hell do they do with a refresh? If it doesn't still look exactly like an old Challenger, it loses 90% of it's.buyers. But if they leave it the same, well, they can't. It's old, heavy, and gets bad mileage. And after 12 years I'd guess most everybody who wants one will have gotten one. Then again, it worked for Porsche 911 for quite awhile too.......

So are you saying if Dodge came out with an all new revolutionary Challenger, it would only sell 385 units or so a month? That's only about 4500 cars in a year. Interesting.

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[Selo]

Originally Posted by Zeke.Malvo

So are you saying if Dodge came out with an all new revolutionary Challenger, it would only sell 385 units or so a month? That's only about 4500 cars in a year. Interesting.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

Good chance it will sell less than that and go the way of the Viper.

[FrostySS]

Originally Posted by metros11

Well I did my part in helping the Camaro sales...

Me too.

[90503]

FWIW here's a good link that shows Camaro sales in U.S. and Canada...

http://gmauthority.com/blog/gm/chevr...sales-numbers/

[detltu]

Falling down on the job. I looked for the numbers on Friday. I will update the spreadsheet and load the charts after work today.

[Soleil]

Originally Posted by detltu

Falling down on the job. I looked for the numbers on Friday. I will update the spreadsheet and load the charts after work today.

Thank you