[3.8TransAM]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

WHaaaa... ?

Then on what basis is Dodge selling overpriced 4400 lb boats with 20 y/o chassis for big $$$?

If the ZL1 got the LT5 it would be a big deal, Chevy could accompany it with a whole ad campaign and could even come up with stupid names. How about the new Chevy ZL1 Crusader?

Dodge sells them because they are a car that appeals to the masses. Relatively fast, functional as an actual car, you can see of it and the back seat and trunks are usable. The Camaro is superior to enthusiasts, but unfortunately we do not buy enough cars in volume compared to the general populace.

[Artryan]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

WHaaaa... ?

Then on what basis is Dodge selling overpriced 4400 lb boats with 20 y/o chassis for big $$$?

If the ZL1 got the LT5 it would be a big deal, Chevy could accompany it with a whole ad campaign and could even come up with stupid names. How about the new Chevy ZL1 Crusader?

Of course the LT5 would raise some eyebrows, but it would likely add significantly to the cost. My comment was more in reference to putting the LT2 into the SS. I think if the LT5 were to find its way into the ZL1, prices would be on par with the GT 500.

IMHO, even with HP rivaling that of Dodge, you still have the disadvantage of selling an essentially 2 seater sports car with poor visibility. That's kind of why I implied that more HP won't make much of a difference. The sales volume of the ZL1 is so small, and the end is so near that I just can't see GM doing much to try and compete with Dodge or Ford with the Camaro.

I really hope I'm wrong about all of this, but I think at this point knowing what Ford and Dodge are producing, if GM had any plans to do a significant engine upgrade, they would likely release that to the public to try and make a lot of people hold off on buying a GT500 or Redeye.

[GuywithL86]

I wonder if gm just got caught cheating. Maybe they dyno’d a souped up press car

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

WHaaaa... ?

Then on what basis is Dodge selling overpriced 4400 lb boats with 20 y/o chassis for big $$$?

If the ZL1 got the LT5 it would be a big deal, Chevy could accompany it with a whole ad campaign and could even come up with stupid names. How about the new Chevy ZL1 Crusader?

Originally Posted by 3.8TransAM

Dodge sells them because they are a car that appeals to the masses. Relatively fast, functional as an actual car, you can see of it and the back seat and trunks are usable. The Camaro is superior to enthusiasts, but unfortunately we do not buy enough cars in volume compared to the general populace.

That's why people buy base models(the masses), not the HiPo cars Dave is talking about. Hellcats sell because they have HUGE HP numbers, which helps them add fun factor and overcome gross weight problems. How many Hellcats you think they would sell if it did no better than matching the ZL1 650 HP, or had even less? Not near as many as they do now. HP sells, always has.

[HDRDTD]

IF they tried to time some 0-60 times or something similar, the results should have confirmed or dispelled the reported dyno figures easily.

Or did they ??

[Steve83ta]

The numbers were run on a Mustang Dyno. Mustang Dynos can be manipulated to show higher numbers. Spend a little time on YouTube looking at Dynojet vs Mustang. Now I’m not saying it was done intentionally. But it’s possible somebody went into the settings and changed something inadvertently during a previous run with another car causing false readings for the next car That was run.

[50MileSmile]

In the sales race, you guys need to give credit to Dodge for the amount of advertising it does - plus the fact that it comes up with a new model or two that’s of interest to a new segment of the marketplace every year. Even the incentives are inventive - rebates of a dollar per horsepower were noticed by the buying public, while Chevy and Ford did nothing that was very visible. How else can Dodge be No. 1 in sales with Hemi cars that feel and drive like they’re encased in concrete?

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by GuywithL86

I wonder if gm just got caught cheating. Maybe they dyno’d a souped up press car

Nah, it's a bogus dyno. To make that power with a 6.2 NA you'd need it to be pretty clearly not stock (like having a lumpy idle).

MT should be better than this. I don't know why they even published that rubbish.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by 50MileSmile

In the sales race, you guys need to give credit to Dodge for the amount of advertising it does - plus the fact that it comes up with a new model or two that’s of interest to a new segment of the marketplace every year. Even the incentives are inventive - rebates of a dollar per horsepower were noticed by the buying public, while Chevy and Ford did nothing that was very visible. How else can Dodge be No. 1 in sales with Hemi cars that feel and drive like they’re encased in concrete?

Ummmm because more customers are willing to buy them.

Dodge has nothing to advertise BUT Charger and Challenger. Both Chevy and Ford know that for what is now a tiny fraction of the 17,000,000 unit market advertising is not money well spent. But Dodge with a lookalike mini van and a 10 year old SUV you would all think it’s advertising. It isn’t.

[Scraps0f]

Pretty sure I mentioned this before, but motor trend keeps putting out these high numbers. I don't know if there are any real world independent tests yet but they got the same ~30% increase over rated horsepower on the latest Supra. https://www.motortrend.com/news/2020...pra-dyno-test/

[Steve83ta]

Check out this vid

[c4racer]

Ya. But did Chevrolet ever test with magic fairy dust ?
I think not.

[laynlo15]

The track is the only way we'll see if those numbers work. My Camaro on the same rwhp back in 2017 ran 10.80s@129 but not on street tires. The C8 may not need a drag pack since its a mid engine and traction shouldn't be an issue with it and GM advertises under 3 seconds to 60 so it should hook and book at the drag strip on a sticky track.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by GuywithL86

I wonder if gm just got caught cheating. Maybe they dyno’d a souped up press car

I don't think they would do this, not everyone is going to put their car on a dyno to compare but I guarantee the car is going to get raced and tested a lot and the 2.8 0 to 60 and 11.1 quarter mile has to be repeatable. No way GM would put a ringer with performance numbers the real car will get nowhere near. Probably a mustang dyno issue since they have many inputs that can be manipulated to effect the number produced. Not shifting on mustang dynos, great tools but can be easily manipulated or miscalibrated.