[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by shaffe

That sounds like blind faith to me lol. To say the only ones who can do it is GM when it's going to be their first try?

I mean it would/will be cool to see it but personally I would have a little more faith in someone that has built FPCs before than someone that has never done it.

It is more trust than blind faith. I don't trust that Ford can build these engines properly. And if they do then there will be some sacrifice somewhere. I do trust that GM can figure it out and make it proper.

[GuywithL86]

Both companies have built plenty of crappy motors and great motors.

Fact of the matter is, gm has built modern dohc performance motors for cadillac and they have not shown to be reliable. Since the first gen coyote was so reliable, I actually trust ford more for a dohc v8.

Look at the the cadi 2.0t, and the v6 TT in the vsport and ats-v. Not reliable at all. I’d be driving one if they were.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by GuywithL86

Both companies have built plenty of crappy motors and great motors.

Fact of the matter is, gm has built modern dohc performance motors for cadillac and they have not shown to be reliable. Since the first gen coyote was so reliable, I actually trust ford more for a dohc v8.

Look at the the cadi 2.0t, and the v6 TT in the vsport and ats-v. Not reliable at all. I’d be driving one if they were.

Not to jump on the GM bandwagon, but you can't compare I4 and V6 motors to V8s...completely different family of engines, completely different engineers on each team.

I don't trust either (Voodoo oil consumption for example), the Italians have the most experience, and those are hit or miss as well.

[shaffe]

MT did a little comparison of the GT350 and GT500.

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/ford...y-gt350-gt500/

I wonder when they are going to be able to do their full line of testing

[GuywithL86]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

Not to jump on the GM bandwagon, but you can't compare I4 and V6 motors to V8s...completely different family of engines, completely different engineers on each team.

I don't trust either (Voodoo oil consumption for example), the Italians have the most experience, and those are hit or miss as well.

Yeah, they screwed up the voodoo, but the coyote is amazing

Point is, gm only really had one great dohc v8, and it was designed by lotus for the c4 zr1

Then they had the northstar, and that thing sucked.

They have zero history as far as I know of ever developing a dohc v8 that didn’t suck. And ford built pretty much the best dohc budget v8’s ever, the coyote.

Really not a ford or gm guy, but if you look at history gm has only ever had success with pushrod v8’s, and they are so good at it that they are still used today and pretty much crush everything in regards to hp/weight, hp/physical size, hp/cost, hp/efficiency. The only major downside they have is the powerband.

[rocket403]

MartinJlm had some information with regards to the Lotus ZR1 engine and if I remember correctly it was the most expensive engine GM ever made and the heads were one off's.

My experience with GM engines was 70's and 80's and Olds vs Chevy, and 455,350,403,307 Olds vs 350, 305 Chevy and I can say that those Chevy engine's could not stand up to the Olds in any way.

The latest LS engine's from what I have gleamed from various sources is that they are a great engines, I have also had a couple of the Ford 4.6L and have no issues with them at all even with the plastic intakes that are said to fail.

[Emoto]

Originally Posted by hotlap

Amazing.

In the initial write up, where MT claimed to have measured 561 HP, 515 lb-ft, they describe their phone calls to the Chevy “engineers” asking them to speculate on why the measured numbers were high.

Just imagine being one of the Chevy engineers they called. (Assuming they really did speak with actual Chevy engineers). Wouldn't you be both shocked and horrified? I certainly would. What could you possibly say to such a call? If GM had really sent out a ringer,I don't think the enthusiast community would take very well to it.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by rocket403

MartinJlm had some information with regards to the Lotus ZR1 engine and if I remember correctly it was the most expensive engine GM ever made and the heads were one off's.

My experience with GM engines was 70's and 80's and Olds vs Chevy, and 455,350,403,307 Olds vs 350, 305 Chevy and I can say that those Chevy engine's could not stand up to the Olds in any way.

The latest LS engine's from what I have gleamed from various sources is that they are a great engines, I have also had a couple of the Ford 4.6L and have no issues with them at all even with the plastic intakes that are said to fail.

It's not that the heads were "one off's", it's that there were a 3 different iterations of the engine in the 6 years it was in production and many of the parts, heads included, were not interchangeable between the variants. Partially due to year-to-year increases in hp, partly due to the casting supplier for the original heads going out of business mid-program and needing to incorporate a new casting supplier. At least for the service parts, which is what I was dealing with at the time.

[rocket403]

Thanks Martin I know you would set me straight LOL

On a side note I have a funny/not funny story on a ZR1 depending on who you were. I was putting myself through college by working at a GM dealer the ZR1 was the top Vette and we had one in the showroom, turns out this guy came in and wanted to test drive it, the salesman and the customer went out for the testdrive guy says he wants to buy it (cost at the time was 92K Can) so they stop for coffee (Canadian thing) and salesman gets the coffee comes out and the car is gone with the customer. They never found the car and we found it funny that the salesman got dupped, and lost his job.

I was able to drive every car GM made from 88 to 91 and I really liked the ZR1 I had driven a couple of them.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by rocket403

MartinJlm had some information with regards to the Lotus ZR1 engine and if I remember correctly it was the most expensive engine GM ever made and the heads were one off's.

My experience with GM engines was 70's and 80's and Olds vs Chevy, and 455,350,403,307 Olds vs 350, 305 Chevy and I can say that those Chevy engine's could not stand up to the Olds in any way.

The latest LS engine's from what I have gleamed from various sources is that they are a great engines, I have also had a couple of the Ford 4.6L and have no issues with them at all even with the plastic intakes that are said to fail.

Both of my brother's are Olds 442 guys. I saw them lose the bearings on two 455's due to oil starvation at higher rpms. I never had an issue with my Chevy (305/327/350) or Pontiac (400/455) engines.

The weakness in the Olds engines is pretty well documented.

BTW. The 305 wasn't a performance engine but it did ok in my 84 Monte SS

[rocket403]

When building an Olds Engine you needed to spend a lot of time with the oiling system enlarge the oil holes in the crank, go with a high volume pump larger oil pan etc.
I had only small block Chevy engines never had anything bigger so can't comment on them

[rocket403]

I had the 305 in my 79 Cutlass ended up replacing it because of Cam failure and I didn't want to spend money on a turd of an engine picked up a 350 Chevy it was good engine for awhile then had a litter collapse more Cam issues replaced with nice Edelbrock unit with intake and Chain ran good for a little bit then valve seats had the classic blue smoke on startup (Classic Chevy Issues in the 80's with their small blocks)
After that I would never have a Chevy in an Olds.

In the years working at dealership the biggest issue with the 305 and 350 was Cam issues, we always had a police car Vette or Camaro in the back having the engine worked on.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by shaffe

MT did a little comparison of the GT350 and GT500.

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/ford...y-gt350-gt500/

I wonder when they are going to be able to do their full line of testing

So now they're going with objective data to choose the winner eh? LOL! I guess all that GT350R magic and the exhaust sound and how it just looks soo good and how there's just something about it and how the high revs is all nothing. Now it's all about the extra HP and the trap speeds and the huge brakes and the difference in the quarter mile. LOL!! And now the $94K CF version wins only based on objective data. I guess these goofballs felt they had to protect the GT500 so it wouldn't lose to the ($20K cheaper) GT350R.

But it'll be back to subjective comments when the ZLE beats the CF and the ZL1 beats the Base around a track. Then it'll be all how the GT500 is a better car to live with and they can drive it easily and it has a DCT and the steering wheel feels nice and the seatbelt is amazing and the sound guys like the hood vents...

[NW-99SS]

Can we all agree how terrible that Ram 1500 drive selector is in the GT500?