[NW-99SS]

That's a troubling thread, not going to lie.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

That's a troubling thread, not going to lie.

100% expected though.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by minn19

100% expected though.

The issues are expected? I don't follow M6 or S550 production at all, so to me, the wiring harness, exposed wires, and badly installed intake piping is alarming.

The panel gaps/fitment can happen in any car, there were C7 Z06 and ZR1 owners who found some similar issues on their deliveries.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

The issues are expected? I don't follow M6 or S550 production at all, so to me, the wiring harness, exposed wires, and badly installed intake piping is alarming.

The panel gaps/fitment can happen in any car, there were C7 Z06 and ZR1 owners who found some similar issues on their deliveries.

I owned two previous GT350s, Focus ST and many F150s (including a current one). I also do some fleet management at my work and have had to deal with many shitty Fusion issues. Yes, it was 100% expected and as you can read from other posters here, many of us tried to warn them only to be called all sorts of names etc. Ford is currently a company in complete disarray. The have trouble with both mechanical and cosmetic quality/build issues etc. Then when you try get things fixed it is a massive pain in the ass at the dealer and corporate level. Unless you are extremely lucky that you have a great dealer. Even then they can only do so much.

When my current F-150 lease is up, I'll be turning that in and heading to another brand. Most likely never returning.

I do feel for them, but many of them went through other issues with their GT350s and still willingly paid ADM for the GT500. I really don't know what to say.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by minn19

I owned two previous GT350s, Focus ST and many F150s (including a current one). I also do some fleet management at my work and have had to deal with many shitty Fusion issues. Yes, it was 100% expected and as you can read from other posters here, many of us tried to warn them only to be called all sorts of names etc. Ford is currently a company in complete disarray. The have trouble with both mechanical and cosmetic quality/build issues etc. Then when you try get things fixed it is a massive pain in the ass at the dealer and corporate level. Unless you are extremely lucky that you have a great dealer. Even then they can only do so much.

When my current F-150 lease is up, I'll be turning that in and heading to another brand. Most likely never returning.

I do feel for them, but many of them went through other issues with their GT350s and still willingly paid ADM for the GT500. I really don't know what to say.

Great post, thanks for clarifying and thanks for sharing

[TRZ06]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/thr...d-this.149135/

Buddy of mine sent that link to me, lol!! Yea I think I trust GM more than Ford, LOL!!

Anyway, one comparison I would like to see is the current crop of GM performance cars up against the GTR, M6, and others in the same arena. To me any comparisons against Ford are boring. Especially considering the price gap needed for a Mustang to keep up with a Camaro. And the Z06 is probably going to beat every Mustang in everything stock to stock. I think we really need better competition these days. I understand the rivalry has always been Chevy vs Ford but it's not interesting anymore if the competitor can't keep up.

Competition performance wise, I think all the manufacturers have something to compete (except BMW, they just are going in the wrong direction).

The next race needs to be in fit/finish and QC. This is where the extra money is going on the luxury brands.

It's one of the reasons why I will be choosing the GT4 over the upcoming Z06, even though performance wise the Z06 will be superior. Corvette has terrible QC history.

[rocket403]

And people were saying that Dodge had a issue with quality

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

That's a troubling thread, not going to lie.

So question...I am not sure of this...but is the GT500, GT350, and other specialty Mustangs built in the same factory and on the same assembly lines as the GT and EB? If so then that might explain the quality issues. These cars, despite having a much higher tag, are not built separately. They're built right alongside the cheaper ones. That is if I am correct. So it's not like they're getting any special attention above the $25K base Mustangs. Not that anyone paying even $25K should get shitty quality. But if they had separate assembly lines with higher paid/higher skilled/higher grade workers, then maybe those workers would put more effort into the finishing quality. Some of these issues seem minor. But some of them seem more like they come from an IDGAF person on minimum wage who is told by his boss that he has to complete X amount of units every day. On the other hand, if they are built separately, then there is no excuse for the lack of quality. We're talking about a car that OTD will be minimum $80K even in the cheapest form. That is a very expensive vehicle. For that kind of money those quality issues should not exist.

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

The issues are expected? I don't follow M6 or S550 production at all, so to me, the wiring harness, exposed wires, and badly installed intake piping is alarming.

The panel gaps/fitment can happen in any car, there were C7 Z06 and ZR1 owners who found some similar issues on their deliveries.

They aren't. Nobody spends that kind of money and expects those issues or any issues at all. They might be common. They might be widespread. But I doubt anyone plops down that kind of money then comes across an issue and says "oh I expected that". There are Ford fanatics who will defend anything Ford does. So when someone complains that their $98K CF GT500 has peeling paint and crooked emblems, then they are ridiculed by the fanatics. And maybe they still would buy the car even if they knew about those issues beforehand. I certainly wouldn't. But nobody "expects" it but the blind followers. My ZL1 and HC had no issues. And even the used 2 year old 5th Gen SS I bought back in 2012 for $26K had nowhere close to issues like that.

Originally Posted by rocket403

And people were saying that Dodge had a issue with quality

Dodge absolutely does have quality issues. The difference is that cars like the Hellcat and SRT8s leave the factory looking good and without the quality issues that Fords have off the assembly line. The problems with Dodge come down the road. It is more of a longevity thing. Trust me. I have a list of stuff. It is all minor so it doesn't bother me too much. But it is still there.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

So question...I am not sure of this...but is the GT500, GT350, and other specialty Mustangs built in the same factory and on the same assembly lines as the GT and EB? If so then that might explain the quality issues. These cars, despite having a much higher tag, are not built separately. They're built right alongside the cheaper ones. That is if I am correct. So it's not like they're getting any special attention above the $25K base Mustangs. Not that anyone paying even $25K should get shitty quality. But if they had separate assembly lines with higher paid/higher skilled/higher grade workers, then maybe those workers would put more effort into the finishing quality. Some of these issues seem minor. But some of them seem more like they come from an IDGAF person on minimum wage who is told by his boss that he has to complete X amount of units every day. On the other hand, if they are built separately, then there is no excuse for the lack of quality. We're talking about a car that OTD will be minimum $80K even in the cheapest form. That is a very expensive vehicle. For that kind of money those quality issues should not exist.

GT500 and GT350 before it are built at the Flat Rock, Michigan assembly plant on the same line with the same workers as all Mustangs. No different than ZL1 being built on same line as Camaro LS in Lansing, Michigan. Nobody at either plant is minimum wage. All are covered by the collective bargaining contract between the UAW and the Domestic 3 automakers. Corvette assemblers at Bowling Green are covered by the same contract.

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

.....

Dodge absolutely does have quality issues. The difference is that cars like the Hellcat and SRT8s leave the factory looking good and without the quality issues that Fords have off the assembly line. The problems with Dodge come down the road. It is more of a longevity thing. Trust me. I have a list of stuff. It is all minor so it doesn't bother me too much. But it is still there.

It sounds like you are outlining the difference between Quality (how good is it at its best) and Reliability (how well and how long the quality holds up).

[shaffe]

What Martin said^

The quality issues when delivered are very disappointing and it does seem Ford has been hit by it the hardest lately(2020 explorer), but the big 3 all need to do better. Some of these things should never happen

[rocket403]

Having owned the Challenger for 10 years I have had some minor issues that any car would have, the quality and longevity of my Challenger has been great, I drive it hard with no issues. I have some friends that bring up quality issues with Dodge and direct it to me, these are GM guys that remember past issues, living in the past I guess.

I had owned two Mustangs and had many issues with both cars, I had to get a trunk lid replaced because the skin separated from the frame, daytime light module replaced the day after I picked up the car. I had over 30 warranty repairs on the car in 18 months, I ended up trading it in for a new Mustang, with that car I had issues with paint and runs in a factory paint job, had the trans out 3 times for issues. I finally had most of the issues worked out then it was stolen. I see that quality is still not Job #1.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by shaffe

What Martin said^

The quality issues when delivered are very disappointing and it does seem Ford has been hit by it the hardest lately(2020 explorer), but the big 3 all need to do better. Some of these things should never happen

This exactly

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

GT500 and GT350 before it are built at the Flat Rock, Michigan assembly plant on the same line with the same workers as all Mustangs. No different than ZL1 being built on same line as Camaro LS in Lansing, Michigan. Nobody at either plant is minimum wage. All are covered by the collective bargaining contract between the UAW and the Domestic 3 automakers. Corvette assemblers at Bowling Green are covered by the same contract.

Maybe in the future they should have specific teams that work on the higher up vehicles. I find that people tend to do a better job when they know (or think) they are working on a more important project. It probably would cost too much to do that tho.

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

It sounds like you are outlining the difference between Quality (how good is it at its best) and Reliability (how well and how long the quality holds up).

Or maybe the difference between quality and durability. A lot of the issues with Dodge seem to pop up over time. For example, my fuel cap cover faded/peeled after a year and a half. A more durable product would not have after such a short period of time. I do think that GM and FCA pays more attention to how the vehicle looks before it leaves the factory. GM pays more attention to how the vehicle is down the road. Overall I do think GM is better at quality, durability, reliability, etc. Ford kinda just takes the approach that if you have a problem then the warranty will come in handy. FCA's issue seems to be more along the money side of things. They went cheap on a lot of stuff so that is why they are not as durable.

Still tho, it sucks when your super expensive car that you paid a markup on before it even arrived at the dealership shows up with defects and then has to spend several weeks in the shop to fix. Or when it happens several times and the manufacturer has to buy the vehicle back from you. I get it that these things happen. But it seems to happen more with Ford.

[TRZ06]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Maybe in the future they should have specific teams that work on the higher up vehicles. I find that people tend to do a better job when they know (or think) they are working on a more important project. It probably would cost too much to do that tho.


Or maybe the difference between quality and durability. A lot of the issues with Dodge seem to pop up over time. For example, my fuel cap cover faded/peeled after a year and a half. A more durable product would not have after such a short period of time. I do think that GM and FCA pays more attention to how the vehicle looks before it leaves the factory. GM pays more attention to how the vehicle is down the road. Overall I do think GM is better at quality, durability, reliability, etc. Ford kinda just takes the approach that if you have a problem then the warranty will come in handy. FCA's issue seems to be more along the money side of things. They went cheap on a lot of stuff so that is why they are not as durable.

Still tho, it sucks when your super expensive car that you paid a markup on before it even arrived at the dealership shows up with defects and then has to spend several weeks in the shop to fix. Or when it happens several times and the manufacturer has to buy the vehicle back from you. I get it that these things happen. But it seems to happen more with Ford.

Don't pay markup, that is just flushing money down the toilet.

Corvette is just as bad as Ford. Camaro seems to do better, but Corvette has serious QC issues.