catch can importance?

[tonyko1]

SC2150.......You ignore my qualifications, and you talk of a "class action suite"'? For what?



Dog gone it, there is a # 5...........I mentioned a class action suit, not suite, details are important..........

What I meant was if the pics you show are TYPICAL, and not Atypical..........see how important spelling is.................if the pics you show are typical, I meant that you would be an expert witness for a class action suit of owners of these engines against GM for a known inherent flaw that GM must be aware of but chose to ignore, if indeed that is the case.

Thank you.

[Bradrulz]

Now this clown is an attorney too.

:troll:

[Blues45th]

Hissing noise? Seems like not getting enough pressure built up in it. And I will say. These are something that if you ever had a gm engine know oil consumption is known and have ruined cars because of it.

[Angrybird 12]

When I first heard of catch cans I thought it wasn't necessary and was a gimmick too. I questioned many times back 5 months ago if they were necessary. The more research I did on the problem the more I understood the issue. I decided to give it a chance. After running the RX catch can for the last few months I can see the value in having one. I still feel like its cheap insurance for keeping your system cleaner for a longer time than not having a catch can at all.
GM engines are not alone in this problem. Do some real research on your own instead of relying on hearsay and see for yourself that a catch can, while may not be a 100% effective prevention, it can delay the effects of carbonization.

[Blues45th]

Lol gm bought back my cts because of it and oil consumption as they referred to it.

[buzzy56]

I cannot believe where this thread has gone.If you have no interest in installing a catch can why would you attempt to derail those from obtaining information and purchasing and installing one.Just sell it give it away and move on.

For those that come to the thread for information and data to make a decision to purchase let them be.They are big boys and girls. They can make up their own minds with out all the negative input.

This site used to be so informative and everyone (most) were polite and so helpful.Lately to many are acting like BUTT HOLES ! Nothing nice to say better to say nothing at all.For me ,I listened to reasons why a can would benefit our engines and I decided to purchase one(used).Although I will have to admit that I am cheap.Just think if I had waited I could have really bought one cheap off Tony ! Let's all try to be a little bit more understanding of others and not take things so personally.Enough crap going on in this old world.Let's keep our site warm and welcoming ,while still being able to politely disagree with out attacking each other.Peace

[Blues45th]

Anyone gave radiator smell after running can. Seems to linger now in my engine bay

[willhe64]

Originally Posted by tonyko1

He stated the L99 was engineered to burn off the oil

Your mechanic just proved to me that he is an idiot. Had a pretty strong suspicion, but this seals it, thanks.

[SC2150]

Originally Posted by buzzy56

I cannot believe where this thread has gone.If you have no interest in installing a catch can why would you attempt to derail those from obtaining information and purchasing and installing one.Just sell it give it away and move on.

For those that come to the thread for information and data to make a decision to purchase let them be.They are big boys and girls. They can make up their own minds with out all the negative input.

This site used to be so informative and everyone (most) were polite and so helpful.Lately to many are acting like BUTT HOLES ! Nothing nice to say better to say nothing at all.For me ,I listened to reasons why a can would benefit our engines and I decided to purchase one(used).Although I will have to admit that I am cheap.Just think if I had waited I could have really bought one cheap off Tony ! Let's all try to be a little bit more understanding of others and not take things so personally.Enough crap going on in this old world.Let's keep our site warm and welcoming ,while still being able to politely disagree with out attacking each other.Peace

Amen!

And all catchcans are not created equal for any using the ineffective ones that still allow oil through.

We have over 11,000 in use and we always repair, replace, or refund....even those that have bought used ones we take care of. The way we do it.

[VQ35DE]

I am happy with mine Tracy !

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by VQ35DE

I am happy with mine Tracy !

Yeah I think that 99% of people that have actually bought a good Catch Can and used it for a while are happy with how it keeps the gunk out of the intake.

[tonyko1]

Well good for all of you. And a good catch can is a "can" or anything that hold the small amount of oil it collects. The "can" is a collection vessel, nothing more, nor less. With the hoses routed correctly, a coffee can, albeit a one lb can would fit and work.

If it is collecting copious amts of oil, then it is worth its price right there, it is telling you your motor is throwing a bunch of oil, especially with these new Camaros that are at the most 3yrs old, maybe a tad more on some.

You all who criticize me and my dear friend the mechanic have been "judging me" on my assertation that it isn't needed for YOU. I state it isn't needed for ME, as I am a casual driver who doesn't race and a V8 L99 aint the same as a V6, which I can't speak on nor care to.

What I have issues with is that if you don't agree, then you lash out at me that I shouldn't comment, or I am so wrong as to be a heretic in regards to all things Camaros.

As I said before:

1. It is your money, do as you want. But when people ask if they should get one, great if you have one and you say yes, ditto for me if I say no.

2. My friend the mechanic told me I don't need it, good enough for me, he is my friend, that is what friends do. He is not an IDIOT as "Willhe64" asserts. How dare you, and your avatar does nothing to show you to be a rational, well-thought out person. So be it.

3. And finally, glad all who have bought it are happy, that is great. How to compare it against your very engine without is completely impossible. I don't care about testimonials, pictures, anything, $$ talks and BS walks. I do know that confident people don't need to defend their decisions about buying or doing something. I do have confidence in my reasons for NOT doing something. Hey, I fell for "Slick 50" oil treatment in the Mid-80's, I learned.

Best to all,

tony

[Smirnoff]

If you installed a catch can & saw all of the nasty oil "goo" collected at the bottom of the can & diverted from being ingested back into the intake of your motor.....you might change your mind, maybe not?

Many are very skeptical at the beginning (pre-purchase) - not after (post-purchase & installed)!

[SC2150]

Sorry, but I have to agree....your Tony may me good at most automotive but has no clue on this subject.

And for those that are not already convinced on the misinformation, or want to see how cans do or dont work (ALL cans, even a beer can w/2 fittings popped in will catch some oil due to condensation, but most let as much or more through into the intake air charge as they catch:

As for cans, here are the most common you will see and a detailed description on how they work, (and dont work).

We'll start with some of most common ebay/made in china ineffective cans that are really no more than a "empty beer can":

This one is very common and is generally bought from ebay, but several company also brand it. Comes with fittings, a universal braket, sight tube to see when it needs to emptied:


And the inside......notice not only is it completely an empty can, but the fittings are just punched in with metal filings hanging:


This is another Ebay/China cheapo. Looks nice, ends are milled from billet and the main body extruded aluminum. This can is very common and is seen in many colors and with over 20 companies branding it as "their own design". Search on ebay to see for yourself:


And as you can see, allthough it is a good size, and looks nice, just an empty can again. The majority of all vapors enter and do a quick U turn and exit:

So again, no different than an empty "jumbo" beer can.

And now to another variation of ebay/china. Sight windows and can be had in several colors or a carbon fiber wrap:


Now the inside:
Bonded together with plastic resin...this insulates it greatly reducing the ability to condense oil vapors....and since it relies on the plastic to seal it this one had a good sized vacuum leak where it didnt get coated, and time will tell if this resin delaminates over time from the fuel/oil vapors. It also has what the instructions describe as a "Robber Strip".....not sure what that is.


Notice, if they would have designed it so the inlet tube protruded through the screen, it would actually have a bit better effectiveness, but since it terminates in the top the majority of the vapors just do a quick U turn back out.



Now on to one made in the USA, quality of the machining is top notch, excellent appearance, solid bracket. You will see dozens of variations of this with the appearance slightly different on the top and some cary very well known brands:


Now look closely at the internal design. There is no specified inlet or outlet, and when you unscrew it you see the vapors enter through one fitting, travel through coalscing media (so far so good) but it just U turns into the outlet side into more coalscing material which acts the same way as taking a wet wash cloth and holding it to your mouth and sucking on it...the liquid pull right through. So even though it looks awesome, and the machining is top notch, since it is so small the flow never slows enough to allow most droplets to fall out of suspension so they suck right into the other side and out the outlet.

A can has to be large enough so the velocity, or the flow speed through the can slows enough for the condensed droplets to fall out of suspension and not carried through (take a straw and drip a small amount of water in a saucer, suck on the straw and it will draw the liquid up completely...similar to the dentist suction tube, now take a piece of garden hose and try the same....you wont get any, or almost no liquid due to the internal volumn of the hose/straw/container used as an oil separator.




Let me add in the home air compressor separators many use:

These will catch oil, but stayrate in a few hundred miles allowing all oil to pull through after it reaches saturation. As this one shows, this company adds a hose to the drain to return the contaminated oil to the crankcase reintroducing the damaging combustion byproducts into the engine oil accelerating wear and damage. All in not understanding all the purposes and functions of todays PCV systems.

Now on to the ones that work. Starting with the Mike Norris, CCA, (and several others that brand this unit). As you can see, the oil enters the top, passes through a small chamber with coalescing material that does a good job of separating the oil and as the flow pulls through, the larger droplets fall into the bottom for collection and only the smallesr ones get pulled through. Mainly because the outlet is only 1" from the droplets dripping out of the chamber as the speed of the flow will pull a small amount through. This is a very good functioning can and allows a very small amount of pull through and is one we endorse as worth using on most NA applications. Nice looking, durable, and functional for the reasons listed:


On to the next 2 that are excellent in function and quality. The Elite and the AMW. Both are slightly different in appearance, but both use the same basic very effective design internally. Even though from the outside they may look similar to the one with so many brands that does not work well, these work excellent:

First the Elite:



Look above closeley. The coalescing chamber is quite large and is very effective in trapping the oil from suspension and all but the smallest drops fall to the bottom where they are trapped to drain later. The outlet barb is app 2" from the bottom of the coalscing chamber so less chane for pull through. Excellent can we also endorse.

The AMW:



A bit different in appearance, but using the same internal principal of the Elite.....an excellent can that we also endorse.

These last 3 I want to point out are direct competitors of RX but are excellent (some of the ONLY ones worth purchasing out of the hundreds to choose from) and have our endorsement. Well worth buying and installing to prevent the issues described throughout this thread.

Now the RX can. Several things in this design are unlike any other on the market. The distance the oil laden fumes travel from entering, through 3 different chambers which each have a function, is over 7" so pull through from droplets falling to the bottom for collection is near impossible. It also is nearly 1 qt of internal volume (standard can, Monster is nearly 2 quarts) so the velocity, or speed of the flow can slow enough for even the smallest of droplets to fall out of suspension:




Follow the pictures below of a disected RX can. The vapors first enter the top center and travel down the dispersion tube that distributes the vapors evenly into the large coalescing chamber where 90% plus of the oil is separated from the vapors and can drop into the collection and condensing chamber. This uses the temprature differential to condense any oil still suspended into large enough drops that then collect on the outer cooling surface and drop to the bottom for collection. Then the vapors have to travel past a disc baffel into the separate outlet chamber where they have one final cooling step to allow any trace oil to condense befor exiting through a flow controlling checkvalve that prevents any back flow at WOT when intake vacuum is at its lowest level and also prevents the vapors from flowing through to fast.
The oil laden vapors at no time mix with crankcase vapors already cleaned as they exit. Every other design has points where the dirty, and cleaned vapors mingle so there is no way to separate 100% of the oil as some of the entering vapors are always mixing with the exiting vapors.





Now the Saikou Micchi is also a very effective functioning can but I dont have time to post all out there, but anyone that has visited in person has seen the examples of both.

All we source, do a several hundred mile drive with a clear glass inline checkvalve installed between the can and the intake manifold vacuum barb and over this same drive route, with the same car (we know its consumption), and then judge the amount that pulled through and was caught in the clear glass filter. With the average empty/ebay/china can the filter is saturated in 50-100 miles beyound capacity showing 50-80% plus of the oil travels right through into the intake air charge.

The poor designed nice looking ones work a bit better, but still pull through 30% plus where the ones we endorse allow less than 10% pull through to under 5% which is excellent in eliminating most of the issues caused by oil ingestion into the intake air charge.

And more specific question, ask & I'll do my best to answer each accurately.

Top pics? Mike Norris, Elite, AMW, Saikou Micchi and RX. There are a few other we have seen advertised that look like they will also be excellent in function, but we have yet to purchase, test, and dissect.