06-26-2022, 03:11 AM | #1 |
Drives: 2021 camaro 1ls Join Date: Nov 2020
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Braking distance
After a close call with a deer jumping over the hood of my camaro, I'm curious what is the largest factor in determining a car's stoping distance. Is it the tires or brakes, assuming all other factors are equal? Also, not in track type situation where the brakes are getting cherry red, but a street type scenario where you make one panic stop and inches really matter.
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06-26-2022, 07:21 AM | #2 |
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A chain is only as strong as its weakest link. Put cheap tires on and there’s your limiting factor. Great tires but so-so brakes? Well, brakes are your limiting factor. Then of course there’s road conditions to consider. Dry, wet, warm, cold, surface type.
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06-26-2022, 09:30 PM | #3 | |
Drives: 2017 Blue Camaro 1SS 1LE with PDR Join Date: Sep 2018
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Definitely tires for a single dry panic stop.
Fuel economy focused all season tires with high treadwear ratings take around 100' to stop from 50mph vs. under 80' for sticky tires with lower treadwear ratings around 200. https://m.tirerack.com/tires/tests/t...b=ResultCharts https://m.tirerack.com/tires/tests/t...b=ResultCharts Remaining tread depth makes a huge difference for wet panic stops: https://youtube.com/watch?v=zA6MUlVNkLM Quote:
You could even stop an average car with the accelerator stuck at 100% throttle without the brakes failing: "even with the engine racing at full throttle, Popular Mechanics editors have demonstrated a 2010 Toyota Camry with none of the recent fixes braking uneventfully to a stop from highway speed, so the brakes should easily stop the car." https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna35783011 Last edited by cdrptrks; 06-26-2022 at 09:49 PM. |
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06-27-2022, 04:18 AM | #4 | |
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Quote:
Your point about the tires having the biggest impact makes sense as it's the one thing that the consumer may replace with something that doesn't carry the same abilities as the original ones. And, even if they're replaced with something "better", the rest of the system may not be able to take full advantage (although the ABS may kick in later due to reduce wheel slip, and that could shorten up the stopping distance). Even with a significant upgrade, though, the improvements are only likely to go "so far." |
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06-27-2022, 07:12 AM | #5 | |
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Quote:
That Camry also only has 170hp/tq
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06-27-2022, 07:23 AM | #6 |
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I won't be the one to test it, but do you think a high-power sports/muscle car (Camaro, Mustang, Chally, M4, S/RS5, AMg 'vette, etC) would be able to overpower their brakes?
That would be vastly more interesting than a Camry, though I understand why the Camry was chosen.
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06-27-2022, 07:43 AM | #7 | |
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Quote:
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06-27-2022, 07:51 AM | #8 | |
Drives: 2021 LT1 6spd Join Date: Nov 2020
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Quote:
I'd hope the brakes could overpower, but would be interesting for someone to test with a ZL1, GT500, Hellcat, etc.
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06-27-2022, 08:28 AM | #9 | |
Drives: 2020 Camaro 2SS A10 Join Date: Jun 2018
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Quote:
Same for computers, and cars. These cars are also designed that under track/panic braking the car down shifts hard to the lowest possible gear and in doing so you deaccelerate faster as long as your foot is off the gas pedal which is usually the case in such scenarios. Think of it like an engine brake for a semi-truck. I did personally have an incident involving a construction truck and a construction barrel. Tires are the first step to effective braking. I had summer tires 300 TW in the front and 220 in the back. Responsive handling at high speed in my case 60mph avoiding a construction barrel that was hit by a construction truck which threw the barrel the equivalent to 4 highway lanes in front of me. Braking hard and swirving at the same time to avoid the first barrel, and again to avoid the second barrel.
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06-27-2022, 08:32 AM | #10 | |
Drives: 2017 Blue Camaro 1SS 1LE with PDR Join Date: Sep 2018
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Quote:
https://www.businessinsider.com/brak...tandard-2012-5 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-a...-idUSKCN1SJ1UL Side note: on the Camaro SS 1LE I have experimented with using a light brake pedal application for around a second with my left foot while at a steady throttle position in a specific turn on one track to slightly modify the front to rear balance for a bit more front grip and the car did not cut throttle so there may be a delay or minimum amount of braking required before throttle cut kicks in. Similarly, I have seen PDR videos of Camaro drivers who manually blip the throttle to rev match downshifts during hard braking on track and the car allows that too without cutting throttle. |
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06-27-2022, 08:40 AM | #11 |
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If you are already threshold braking or have engaged ABS, that is the limit of grip that the tires can provide. Downshifting during this time won't make you stop any faster but it will reduce brake pad wear and reduce the amount of heat generated by the brakes.
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06-27-2022, 08:47 AM | #12 | |
Drives: 2021 2SS 1LE Join Date: Aug 2020
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Quote:
The OEM brakes in any car are normally fine to stop the car for a few panic stops in row before the pads get overheated and fade. Like was said by others here, if you can lock up the brakes (ABS), then the brakes are more capable than the tires (thus tires will be the thing to improve stopping distance). On the track, it can be a different story because the brakes get used far more heavily and frequently than they do on the road or typical enthusiast driving. For a track driven vehicle, once you start upgrading any single part (tires, brakes, engine, suspension improvement, etc) you typically put more demands on the other components, and one of those components then becomes the weakest link in the overall system performance. |
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06-27-2022, 08:54 AM | #13 | |
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Quote:
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06-27-2022, 10:31 AM | #14 | |
Drives: 2020 Camaro 2SS A10 Join Date: Jun 2018
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Quote:
Its not a true engine brake like on a semi, but it will definitely stop you faster than running at the highest possible gear under the same condition.
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