[cbr1100xx]

Originally Posted by TRZ06

It's pretty unusable for a MFG. to admit a cosmetic mistake and fix it that fast.

VERY unusable!

[cellsafemode]

Pricing people out is the primary reason of sales issues, not a frontend fascia for their V8 trim.

They talk about that in the linked article.

Chevy moved the camaro into a different demographic than it traditionally had, one that requires the performance that the camaro brings to the table, but they also demand a subtle style. Chevy retained a traditional style, aggressive almost to a teenage-male level ...but that style had always been attractive to the previous demographic, not the new one they priced the camaro into.

So it's not doing well. Surprise. You're not cross-shopping BMW drivers with the way a camaro looks. They need to do what they can to reduce the bottom trim level ...if that means lower performance / handling, then that's what they need to do. That's what the camaro buying public expect and look for. Then they use the aftermarket to make it as good as they want it where they want it themselves on their own time.

[GelflingEssence]

Originally Posted by Jeb114

I do not see them changing it to late , Too many built already some have been delivered.

Anything can happen. The new design was almost universally hated.

The "fugly" '19 could end up being very collectable.

[TRZ06]

Originally Posted by cellsafemode

Pricing people out is the primary reason of sales issues, not a frontend fascia for their V8 trim.

They talk about that in the linked article.

Chevy moved the camaro into a different demographic than it traditionally had, one that requires the performance that the camaro brings to the table, but they also demand a subtle style. Chevy retained a traditional style, aggressive almost to a teenage-male level ...but that style had always been attractive to the previous demographic, not the new one they priced the camaro into.

So it's not doing well. Surprise. You're not cross-shopping BMW drivers with the way a camaro looks. They need to do what they can to reduce the bottom trim level ...if that means lower performance / handling, then that's what they need to do. That's what the camaro buying public expect and look for. Then they use the aftermarket to make it as good as they want it where they want it themselves on their own time.

I disagree with the BMW and aftermarket comments.

I came from a 2016 BMW M3.

Also, what you soon realize with having to go aftermarket (especially when you get into suspension) is that it is very easy to screw things up or introduce other issues.

I applaud GM for making the SS 1LE and ZL1 1LE for that matter.. Being able to buy a car of this performance caliber without having to go aftermarket OR having to spend 6 figures is AMAZING!!!

Yes, it moves it up a notch, but at least with the 6 Gen., you get your moneys worth. They did the brakes proper, they did the suspension proper, they did the chassis proper, they did the wheel/tire package proper.

I love this car WAY more than my M3.

Unfortunately for GM, the market for sports car is not that great. We are a niche market. Crossovers and SUV's are the rage right now.

So, while you make some valid points, I do not agree with that BMW shoppers are not cross shopping, nor do I agree about the aftermarket.

[cellsafemode]

Aftermarket bulges in two places. Low income car owners and racers. Where it doesn't bulge, the people who make up the leasing demographic.

So i get where you're coming from with your stance on the aftermarket.



I wanted to make the argument that the low income demographic was priced out of the camaro but in further research, i dont think that argument can be legitimately made.

The camaro is not doing bad for being a niche market car, it's doing bad compared to other cars within the same niche market. It's even cheaper than it's rivals who are doing better with crappier performing cars. So what gives?

1. The demographics did shift, but not due to the car being priced higher than traditionally. The income levels of their demographic has shrunk over time (factory workers and traditionally blue collar men). So those buyers are priced out of all new sports cars in general. The new demographic isn't a fan of the almost childishly aggressive look of the camaro compared to the alternatives.

2. Not making the vehicle available rhd from the get-go. While the market for RHD may be small, and in areas where american cars in general are a small market, there's no excuse for allowing your competition to not have any competition in an entire market. Especially one that gets their opinions about all cars heard around the world.

[vtirocz]

Originally Posted by TRZ06

The 2 things I REALLY wanted from the 2019 were the LED Headlights and the new higher res. rear view camera.

I'd like the LED headlights as well, those I like the '16-'18 headlight assembly design better.

[TRZ06]

Originally Posted by vtirocz

I'd like the LED headlights as well, those I like the '16-'18 headlight assembly design better.

Yeah , from a design perspective, they both look good. It's the actual light output that is very different.

Driving on the freeway, you can immediately tell which cars have LED's and which have HID's.

It's crazy. When I am next to a car with LED's , it makes my car look like it has halogens, lol.

You can match the LED color with a 6K HID bulb, but you can not match its light output or spread. You see so much more of the road and its better lit up with LED.

[lt4camaro]

Keep it simple and don't think about it. The 2019 SS front end sucked and they fixed it. Congrats to Camaro.

[Cgocifer]

Honestly, to save the camaro, they need to fast track a gen 7 with a completely new design to fix the vis issue (doesnt bother me, I'm used to it), implement a sophisticated yet aggressive design that still resembles a camaro, and give the awesome performance platform the class and looks it deserves. The 911 Porsche has kept the same shape and profile for decades yet still looks modern and fresh with the evolution of a great design. Camaro can do the same if GM learns to stop jumping on every new trend. Just create a gorgeous design that still resembles somewhat of a Camaro and it will sell.

I'm still surprised that the pre refresh 6th gen did so poorly. I think it is gorgeous especially in 1LE trim, but I digress.

[Mr Carrots]

Originally Posted by TRZ06

I disagree with the BMW and aftermarket comments.

I came from a 2016 BMW M3.

Also, what you soon realize with having to go aftermarket (especially when you get into suspension) is that it is very easy to screw things up or introduce other issues.

I applaud GM for making the SS 1LE and ZL1 1LE for that matter.. Being able to buy a car of this performance caliber without having to go aftermarket OR having to spend 6 figures is AMAZING!!!

Yes, it moves it up a notch, but at least with the 6 Gen., you get your moneys worth. They did the brakes proper, they did the suspension proper, they did the chassis proper, they did the wheel/tire package proper.

I love this car WAY more than my M3.

Unfortunately for GM, the market for sports car is not that great. We are a niche market. Crossovers and SUV's are the rage right now.

So, while you make some valid points, I do not agree with that BMW shoppers are not cross shopping, nor do I agree about the aftermarket.

BMWs are now massively overpriced and you need to mod that 80k M4 to get close to stock ZL1 performance, so there are definitely former BMW owners who switched.

Their mid range b58 engines are still not able to be modded to match the ageing n55 or n54, and their high end m5 is ridiculously expensive.

But yes, the badge snobs who buy or lease a optioned out 4 banger 3 series for 600+ a month are most of their market, and they arent going camaro

[JamesNoBrakes]

Originally Posted by Cgocifer

Honestly, to save the camaro, they need to fast track a gen 7 with a completely new design to fix the vis issue

Got that covered, no more complaining about visibility, entry and exit, high sills and other sports-car "problems". Gen 7 is ready to go:

[Subcool]

Is that a new color on that awesome design or is it krypton Green?

[V8 Firebird]

Originally Posted by Subcool

Is that a new color on that awesome design or is it krypton Green?

That is new color "Shock" , and it is Bright yellow replacement, not Krypton Green.

[lawguy85]

Originally Posted by Jeb114

I do not see them changing it to late , Too many built already some have been delivered.

Source?? I'm not seeing any here in Atlanta. The top 3 Chevrolet dealers have 1 2019 listed between them. There's certainly only a handful of 2019 posters here (tbh, I wouldn't be surprised if there's more that lurk but are turned off from posting because of the reaction). There's very little anecdotal evidence to support your conjecture, I'm curious what you've seen that suggests these things are moving numbers?

I honestly don't see a point dunking on the 2019 front end now that people are driving/enjoying it, but it's equally asinine to pretend the design was a success or that if one doesn't find it aesthetically pleasing they're "haters" or have some sort of agenda.