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Old 05-13-2022, 08:17 PM   #113
synolimit
 
Drives: 22 ZL1 1LE A10
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Originally Posted by khcoaching View Post
Since it will be a few months for the weather to warm up here and I want to try the 18" rims.....I ordered a set of these to try. I got a last minute deal via a sponsorship code that made them decently priced. I ordered 305/35/18 and hopefully can run them in late Feb/early March.
i was thinking 315/30/18. curious what 1.3" smaller over OEM will do and feel like. as for weight i think they'll be the same.
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Old 06-09-2022, 10:51 AM   #114
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#8 Ridge Motorsport Park June 1st 2022

Without Chicane 1:45.61

I had been looking forward to this day for quite some time. I co-own a motorcycle trackday company and this was our first car event. We held it as a private day and there were maybe 12 cars there, running 30 min sessions. We even had a couple of other Camaro6 members there, very cool!

Even though I am at the track a ton of days throughout the year, I don’t actually get to drive it a lot, so I try to make the most out of each day by having a systematic approach to the car’s improvement. Since I was not driving for about 8 weeks, from #7 I decided to go pretty big with the changes:

- DSSV suspension
- Mag ride delete
- Full BMR rear control arms (mainly for rear camber, so I decided to do all of them)
- ZLE front calipers (Ferodo 3.12 pads)
- SS front lines
- Girodisc front rotors
- Updated Alignment (-3.2/-2.6)



For the June 1st day, I went with my 19” used Goodyear 3Rs that had about a day and half on them.

Comments / Results:

Starting off, I drove poorly this day. I had a lot on my plate and I wasn’t very focused to drive well. In fact, I had my first spin in the car and did so right in front of @eimarshall (video to follow) Even though I was able to get an official PB, I blew the exit of T13 and lost out on a 45.1. I also had to pass a car in the 2nd fastest part of the track which was another .15, so there is for sure a 44.9 there. Here is the real-world experience of the changes.

DSSV changeover -

- I was pretty jacked to get the DSSV installed and to see what it would do. Installation was straightforward and the car sits about an inch lower, front and rear. As delivered, there was a slight rake to the front (1/4”) with about 6 threads showing on the bottom of the DSSV body. Initially the car felt much more planted and turn in was very good. I ran a high 46 right out of the gate, but noticed that the front had some late corner push. I lowered the front 4 turns and that improved to a low 46. Since that was better, I lowered the front another 2 turns (which now only leaves about 1 turn left) and this really felt good, I left the car alone and worked on driving. I can’t emphasize how much easier and better the car is to drive. Much more stable and confidence inspiring, everywhere. There are a few places at the Ridge where things can get sketchy and having the ability to have a more stable car was great. (See below for a data graph that shows how the yaw changed) And, IMO, the ride on the street was really no different than the Mag Ride….

Rear Control Arms –

- This was something I wasn’t planning on doing, but we were maxed out with camber on the upper arms and since they were being changed, we did them all. I also think this contributes how tight the car feels and how turn in response is so much better. Yes, they are noisy on the street.

Updated alignment –

- We went with -3.2 in the front and -2.6 in the rear. The tech told me the front can go to -3.5, but he went with -3.2 in the front to stay in line with what we had before. The rear tire wear looked amazing and we actually corded the L/R, which is the least used tire at that track. Next time, we will go with a bit more in the front, but overall, it was pretty good. (See tire pics below)

ZLE Front Brakes –

- This was also something I wasn’t going to do, but decided since the car was coming apart and I already had the calipers, only needing the front rotors, to do it. I also decided since they were inexpensive, to add SS front lines. To not add weight, I used Girodisc rotors along with fresh Ferodo 3.12 pads. (All purchased from KNS) OK, the DSSV was a big deal, this is as big or bigger. I didn’t expect a big change, but holy sh.t. This car has brakes. Like…..as good as GT3 RS brakes. With the additional confidence with the DSSV, I found that I would want to drive into the corner a bit too hard and to back off rushing the entry. Also, I am using a lot less brake psi, which hopefully adds to the pad life.

PTM Settings –

- I had been using the PTM “Race” setting for my best laps and it had been working pretty well. I could be seriously aggressive (sloppy) on exits and let the electronics work for me, ultimately not ideal and later when I turned them off and in a poorly focused setting, this bit me. I knew using the electronics was starting to hold me back last time I was out, but didn’t commit to not using them as of yet. With the DSSV, the first few sessions I could not get the corner off a corner to save my life, without huge electronics intervention. The GPS speed graph was showing a dip on ever exit, instead of a build of speed. I turned everything off and dropped a second, immediately, but also was sloppy and spun. From there, I was more focused on my throttle application and where the rear would spin and all was good. (See below for tire and sway bar comments)

Goodyear 3R and Sway bars –

- I was on the same set of 3Rs as last time’s PB and while worn a bit, weren’t bad. I also had more time to monitor the tire pressure this day. I started at 23cold and maintained 32psi hot. I left the stock sway bars on with the DSSV install and with the – stock SS 1LE sway bars – I feel this setup is too stiff for the 3Rs. Why? Because when the car has a high force in it, I have a lot more grip. Places where the car has lighter force, a lot less grip, both front and rear. I can see why the ZLE uses lighter bars and I think that is where my next setup change will be. I have a set of the ZLE bars as well as the Hotchkis/BMR front rear combo, but unless I am on slicks, I don’t see that as a good way to go. I would try slicks with the bars I have now, before just throwing anything stiffer on.

Next steps –

- First, I need to drive this a bit more when I am more focused and fresher. After that, I want to install the ZLE bar combo with a fresh et of 3Rs to see what that will do. After that, I can evaluate and see what makes sense. Ultimately, was the DSSV worth it? IMO, Absolutely. I felt I was at a limit of the Mag Ride with 3Rs and while I could have added slicks and went quicker, the Mag Ride wasn't going to be able to keep with with the slicks. The DSSV was a bolt in .5 quicker, but way more fun to drive. With the 3Rs and the ZLE bars, I think we are looking at more than a second improvement in lap time, as well a way easier to drive. Also, I ran WAY more 45s and low 46s with the Mag Ride, much more consistent fast laps.


Graphs: BLUE IS DSSV - RED IS PREVIOU PB

#1 Overall speed the entire laps


Name:  DSSV 45vs 45.jpg
Views: 718
Size:  210.9 KB


#2 Zoomed in for corner 1-8


Name:  DSSV Ridge Turn 1-8.jpg
Views: 729
Size:  212.3 KB

#3 Zoomed in for corner 8-16

Name:  DSSV Rodge Turn 8-16.jpg
Views: 711
Size:  211.4 KB

#4 Yaw difference

Name:  DSSV Yaw example .jpg
Views: 714
Size:  202.8 KB

#5 Front tire wear

Name:  June 2022 3R R_F.jpg
Views: 711
Size:  354.3 KB

#6 Rear tire wear

Name:  June 2022 Goodyear 3R L_R.jpg
Views: 720
Size:  337.4 KB
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Old 06-09-2022, 11:02 AM   #115
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Video of a session with my faster laps, not great driving -




Spin off of Turn 5 courtesy of @eimarshall......

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Old 06-09-2022, 01:44 PM   #116
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Nice update! Did you go with FEA (ZL1 1LE) rear springs or leave your FE4 rear springs in for now? Also, why not regular ZL1 / J6H front rotors where you don't lose pad area and volume?
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Old 06-09-2022, 02:42 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by RUQWIKR View Post
Nice update! Did you go with FEA (ZL1 1LE) rear springs or leave your FE4 rear springs in for now? Also, why not regular ZL1 / J6H front rotors where you don't lose pad area and volume?
I went with the FEA springs to keep the car balanced with the OE designed setup. That said, the front is stiffer than the rear and I assume it's for the slightly higher weight of the ZLE....

The OEM rotors weigh 5lbs more than than the Girodisc and are the same weight as the SS 1LE OEM rotors...plus, I've driven a few cars with the Giro rotors and have been impressed....

Ken
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Old 06-09-2022, 05:14 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by khcoaching View Post
I went with the FEA springs to keep the car balanced with the OE designed setup. That said, the front is stiffer than the rear and I assume it's for the slightly higher weight of the ZLE....

The OEM rotors weigh 5lbs more than than the Girodisc and are the same weight as the SS 1LE OEM rotors...plus, I've driven a few cars with the Giro rotors and have been impressed....

Ken
Though the Girodisc weight savings is the wider hat and smaller ring (less thermal capacity). Whatever works for each of us...

Keep us updated on the sway bar, etc. changes. Appreciate the informative, data driven posts.

Last edited by RUQWIKR; 06-09-2022 at 07:32 PM.
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Old 06-09-2022, 07:32 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by RUQWIKR View Post
Though the Girodisc weight savings is all or mostly in the bigger hat vs. the ring. Whatever works for each of us...

Keep us updated on the sway bar, etc. changes. Appreciate the informative, data driven posts.
Yep, agreed. All I know is I wasn't expecting as much an improvement from them as I got.

Ken
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Old 06-10-2022, 11:22 AM   #120
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Nice write up as usual, Ken! Did you cord the inside of the rear tire? I thought that pointed to a rear toe issue.

How does lowering the front affect the handling? More spring preload? Or just mechanical geometry?

And not to brag, but I think my spin was better. LOL!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=de...ature=youtu.be
I managed to grab 2nd instead of 4th going into turn 9, but thankfully my engine seems fine. Broke traction instead and sent me into the gravel. I stopped 4ft from the wall. I'll be listening to gravel rattle around for a while.
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Old 06-10-2022, 01:46 PM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimarshall View Post
Nice write up as usual, Ken! Did you cord the inside of the rear tire? I thought that pointed to a rear toe issue.

How does lowering the front affect the handling? More spring preload? Or just mechanical geometry?

And not to brag, but I think my spin was better. LOL!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=de...ature=youtu.be
I managed to grab 2nd instead of 4th going into turn 9, but thankfully my engine seems fine. Broke traction instead and sent me into the gravel. I stopped 4ft from the wall. I'll be listening to gravel rattle around for a while.
Yes on inside of the L/R tire. Potentially a rear toe issue....looking at the alignment specs, we're off a bit from last time on toe. I need to ask Mark.


The lower front ride height places more weight on the front of the car. It shouldn't change preload.....

HA! Hello Onstar..... glad you and the car are OK!
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Old 06-10-2022, 04:37 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimarshall View Post
Nice write up as usual, Ken! Did you cord the inside of the rear tire? I thought that pointed to a rear toe issue.

How does lowering the front affect the handling? More spring preload? Or just mechanical geometry?

And not to brag, but I think my spin was better. LOL!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=de...ature=youtu.be
I managed to grab 2nd instead of 4th going into turn 9, but thankfully my engine seems fine. Broke traction instead and sent me into the gravel. I stopped 4ft from the wall. I'll be listening to gravel rattle around for a while.
Holy crap I bet you could crush a diamond with your sphincter on that one.
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Old 06-10-2022, 07:46 PM   #123
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Holy crap I bet you could crush a diamond with your sphincter on that one.
There were extra grip marks in the seat. Lol.
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Old 06-23-2022, 09:04 PM   #124
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Minor update -

My wife is needing our truck this week and I have work for the next 5 day so.....on went the stock wheels and tires for my short commute...I'm pretty surprised that the ride quality with the DSSV, pretty darn good and IMO, not really that much different the than MagRide in track mode.

I stopped and took a couple of shots while in the road today.....
Attached Images
  
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Old 06-24-2022, 12:33 AM   #125
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Might need to think about spending some money on home repair rather than track time……lol!
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Old 06-24-2022, 07:47 AM   #126
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Might need to think about spending some money on home repair rather than track time……lol!
HA! But the garage is good.....
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