[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

reviving this thread because i used the *drumroll* feature! haha.

Did you put your GT4 order in yet? Can you post a link to your build code?

Now I'll just go on a long monologue about some of my random considerations and experiences and why i'm torn between keeping the SS1LE or getting a 718GT4, 992 GT3 or C8 Z06.

I've been through a number of cars and found that i really enjoy cars that offer some drama. F80 and 718S boxster were really good cars but lacked some drama, largely from softer steering/shifting inputs and exhaust notes. When motor trend came out with the Camaro vs M3 test i went and got an SS, then SS1LE, bounced around some (Audi S3, M6 gran coupe, 718S boxster) and then came back to an SS1LE because i just LOVE the exhaust bark and the playful nature. it's easy and predictable to kick the back end out when I want to have some fun but also very progressive at the limits while on track while being pretty darn quick -- even in my hands.

My dream has always been to get a GT3 or GT3RS. I got a call today about a 992 GT3 allocation. "Hey! How does $50k sound" as in $50k over MSRP. I respectfully declined and said my line in the sand was $10k over and call me back if they get there. The GT3 will be just too good for me to pass up. However ..... i've decided that i need to drive the 718 GT4 at PECATL to get a good feel for it. I'm HOPING the car feels lively and exciting enough to get me excited. I would LOVE to spend $100k less than a GT3 and still get the razor sharp handling they're known for. I'm just a little nervous that the perfect handling may come across as less playful and could cause me to lose interest. For that reason, the manual would be a must. It just keeps me more engaged. The PDK is better on track (no money shifts, perfect shifts every time, maximize performance, sweet sounding upshifts) but the manual to me is just a way to entertain me between track days. The complaints of the long gears on the GT4 don't really make much sense to me because the SS1LE also has pretty long gears (like 78mph ish in 2nd gear? pretty similar to the GT4 i believe, close enough to be a non-issue). Transmission choice is not much of a debate and i'm glad there are choices for different preferences.

I'm thinking long and hard about what i want to trade my SS1LE in for... or even if maybe i should keep it which would be hard due to space and convincing my wife that it's a good idea.

This brings me back to my main considerations right now are: 992 GT3 (cost of a GT4 and new M3 combind? hard to fathom it's worth quite that much), 718 GT4 which isn't perfect but a great handling car and very beautiful, or C8 Z06 which will be a performance monster but still has many unknowns.... all great options but again ... i still wonder if i'll miss the playfulness of the SS1LE. I think only time (and test drives) will tell.

look forward to seeing what your build looks like and what your impressions are... keep up posted and don't totally jump ship for rennlist!

I just did an autox today and rode along in a previous gen GT3 with RE71Rs. This car is a rocket ship, and is maybe a second slower on a 60 sec course vs the fastest purpose built race cars on slicks there, which was a supercharged Lotus... all sorts of other cars with major mods, running slicks, etc. can't compete and the GT3 is a bone stock SS class car. I've driven some older 911s, and Porsche seems to have removed all issues with the rear-engine layout and now it seems like it's just an advantage in many circumstances. The car can put the power down better than any RWD car I've ever been in, and with the grip of the RE71s it's just ridiculous. There was one accidental oversteer moment and it was super smooth and easily reeled in. The owner said it's relatively easy to drive vs a GT350R he used to own. If you can get one I'd take it over a GT4 for sure. Not that GT4s aren't also amazing, but the GT3 is a more special car, and it's faster. There were 2 GT4s there that weren't competitive. The GT3 and GT4 owners are all pro-level drivers.... GT4s were 1.55s and 2.57s slower on a 60 sec course!

The Camaro has amazing potential, as I'm sure you know, but it's no GT3. It is surprisingly close to GT4s though.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

The Camaro has amazing potential, as I'm sure you know, but it's no GT3. It is surprisingly close to GT4s though.

i've driven 991.1 GT3 at PECLA but never a GT4. I think i need to make a trip to PECATL once they have the 992 GT3 there and give both of those a drive and see what i think. The Turbo (+/- S) is another amazing performer that has the major advantage of the back seat which may come in handy with my two munchkins. It lacks some of the GT3 character but it's still blazingly.... painfully... fast and still does just fine on the track even though it's "heavy" per rennlisters. I drove the GT3 and Turbo back to back at PECLA and the Turbo felt fantastic, honestly.

i think some track time is the best way for me to get to the bottom of it... and also maybe keep the Camaro for a while. if i find myself never wanting to drive it because the new car is plenty fun, then maybe i'll sell it.

thanks for the input! no doubt the GT3s are iconic for good reason .. hopefully my allocation offer becomes something i can live with.

[Bosse'sBoss]

There's is a huge price difference from the GT4 compared to the lower priced SS1LE, not on the same price league, instead you should compare the GT4 to the performance of the ZL1 1LE, that makes more sense.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

There's is a huge price difference from the GT4 compared to the lower priced SS1LE, not on the same price league, instead you should compare the GT4 to the performance of the ZL1 1LE, that makes more sense.

well I have an SS1LE and not a ZL1 or ZLE.. also not looking at pure performance but also playful nature and handling feel. There have been some folks who think the added supercharger weight etc causes a (?small) penalty in feel ... I know it’s not apples to apples ... there is never a truly “fair comparison” bc there’s always something that messes it up. SS1LE vs GT4 has similarities such as NA motor that the ZL1/ZLE do not. Price aside, I think the GT4 and SS1LE are better matched. Choosing a car is a very subjective experience though so of course YMMV. The ZL1 and ZLE are also very much cars that I have considered but I think right now they’re lower on my list compared to the GT4, GT3 and C8 Z06

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

i've driven 991.1 GT3 at PECLA but never a GT4. I think i need to make a trip to PECATL once they have the 992 GT3 there and give both of those a drive and see what i think. The Turbo (+/- S) is another amazing performer that has the major advantage of the back seat which may come in handy with my two munchkins. It lacks some of the GT3 character but it's still blazingly.... painfully... fast and still does just fine on the track even though it's "heavy" per rennlisters. I drove the GT3 and Turbo back to back at PECLA and the Turbo felt fantastic, honestly.

i think some track time is the best way for me to get to the bottom of it... and also maybe keep the Camaro for a while. if i find myself never wanting to drive it because the new car is plenty fun, then maybe i'll sell it.

thanks for the input! no doubt the GT3s are iconic for good reason .. hopefully my allocation offer becomes something i can live with.

The reviews I've seen on the new GT3 look encouraging, I think the car looks even better too. The Turbo is crazy fast, low 10s 1/4 is amazing. I can imagine it's a little more practical as a road car vs the GT3 too.

If rumors of the Z06 starting at $80k are accurate that's a bit more realistic for my price range and it's going to be faster vs the GT3, with a 9k rpm redline FPC V8 and 8-sp DCT. But I've never even been in a C8 yet so IDK. Someone just got a vid of C8 Z06 launching, it sounds like the C8R race car.

I've been considering investing in a track-only car for autox and time attack, so I have to make that decision... if I go that route my budget for cars will be spoken for, lol.

It's a good time to love sports cars, lots of great choices at all different price ranges! You can't go wrong I think, GT3, Turbo or Z06 are all going to be amazing cars.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

The reviews I've seen on the new GT3 look encouraging, I think the car looks even better too. The Turbo is crazy fast, low 10s 1/4 is amazing. I can imagine it's a little more practical as a road car vs the GT3 too.

If rumors of the Z06 starting at $80k are accurate that's a bit more realistic for my price range and it's going to be faster vs the GT3, with a 9k rpm redline FPC V8 and 8-sp DCT. But I've never even been in a C8 yet so IDK. Someone just got a vid of C8 Z06 launching, it sounds like the C8R race car.

I've been considering investing in a track-only car for autox and time attack, so I have to make that decision... if I go that route my budget for cars will be spoken for, lol.

It's a good time to love sports cars, lots of great choices at all different price ranges! You can't go wrong I think, GT3, Turbo or Z06 are all going to be amazing cars.

i'll have to see what finances allow and am well aware that there is no single BEST car. debating any of these cars is a zeroth world problem that we are all lucky to have. one scenario i could foresee is getting a GT4 (if i enjoy my test drive) and then add a Z06 later... still would come up cheaper or similar to the price of a GT3 or Turbo. That reality may keep me from pursuing the GT3 or Turbo, to be honest. With a Z06 and GT4 my wife and i can both do track days without sharing a car and i can have my manual car for weekend fun.

all this talk is kinda useless without A) knowing enough about the Z06 and B) not having driven any of these cars yet

if all i cared about was lap times i'd for sure just go get a ZLE and call it a day, haha!

[JamesNoBrakes]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

I just did an autox today and rode along in a previous gen GT3 with RE71Rs. This car is a rocket ship, and is maybe a second slower on a 60 sec course vs the fastest purpose built race cars on slicks there, which was a supercharged Lotus... all sorts of other cars with major mods, running slicks, etc. can't compete and the GT3 is a bone stock SS class car. I've driven some older 911s, and Porsche seems to have removed all issues with the rear-engine layout and now it seems like it's just an advantage in many circumstances. The car can put the power down better than any RWD car I've ever been in, and with the grip of the RE71s it's just ridiculous. There was one accidental oversteer moment and it was super smooth and easily reeled in. The owner said it's relatively easy to drive vs a GT350R he used to own. If you can get one I'd take it over a GT4 for sure. Not that GT4s aren't also amazing, but the GT3 is a more special car, and it's faster. There were 2 GT4s there that weren't competitive. The GT3 and GT4 owners are all pro-level drivers.... GT4s were 1.55s and 2.57s slower on a 60 sec course!

The Camaro has amazing potential, as I'm sure you know, but it's no GT3. It is surprisingly close to GT4s though.

I do autoX with a bunch of different porsches. The 718s slay it. The nimble chassis is well suited to it. The 911 isn't bad, but not as well suited. The bigger the course, the better a GT3 is going to do, but that's going to be a big track and the GT4 isn't going to suck there either. I think you are blowing it way out of proportion. Riding with a good driver on a good setup car makes a huge difference, yes, but the proper GM comparison with a GT3 is a Zl1 1LE, not a SS 1LE. What I notice personally is as the speeds increase in my SS 1LE, I do better and better, but there's a point where I'll fall off to the cars like the GT3 as the speeds increase.

People vastly underestimate the 718 chassis and there's a reason it makes the best-of almost every year.

If you're on a 60 second course, it's not the GT3, the GT4 or any of that. It's mostly the driver and largely the tires/pressure. Driving correctly on a 60 second course saves tons of time and the car isn't nearly as much of an advantage. If the Miata's aren't kicking your a$$, then something is wrong.

With what I've experienced personally, I wouldn't be going for a GT3 unless I was going to do big-track racing. Otherwise, a GT4 will still do amazing at big-track racing, but if smaller tracks and day to day fun is a priority, that's a sweeter spot, or just get a 911 2S or GTS if you can swing it. Again, people vastly underestimate how capable cars are, but on smaller tracks, it's not the car.

[JamesNoBrakes]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

There's is a huge price difference from the GT4 compared to the lower priced SS1LE, not on the same price league, instead you should compare the GT4 to the performance of the ZL1 1LE, that makes more sense.

Performance wise, they are very close, the GT4 and SS1LE. The GT3 is much closer to the ZL1 1LE in terms of performance. Looking at lap times. That's a little deceiving though, because both GM cars punch so far above their pricepoint. Comparing to porsche is kind of non-sequitur too, since porsche has throughout history punched far above it's own weight class, compared to exotics like ferarri and lamborghini. So using porsche as your only measure doesn't quite work out when comparing against cars that cost the same amount.

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

I do autoX with a bunch of different porsches. The 718s slay it. The nimble chassis is well suited to it. The 911 isn't bad, but not as well suited. The bigger the course, the better a GT3 is going to do, but that's going to be a big track and the GT4 isn't going to suck there either. I think you are blowing it way out of proportion. Riding with a good driver on a good setup car makes a huge difference, yes, but the proper GM comparison with a GT3 is a Zl1 1LE, not a SS 1LE. What I notice personally is as the speeds increase in my SS 1LE, I do better and better, but there's a point where I'll fall off to the cars like the GT3 as the speeds increase.

People vastly underestimate the 718 chassis and there's a reason it makes the best-of almost every year.

If you're on a 60 second course, it's not the GT3, the GT4 or any of that. It's mostly the driver and largely the tires/pressure. Driving correctly on a 60 second course saves tons of time and the car isn't nearly as much of an advantage. If the Miata's aren't kicking your a$$, then something is wrong.

With what I've experienced personally, I wouldn't be going for a GT3 unless I was going to do big-track racing. Otherwise, a GT4 will still do amazing at big-track racing, but if smaller tracks and day to day fun is a priority, that's a sweeter spot, or just get a 911 2S or GTS if you can swing it. Again, people vastly underestimate how capable cars are, but on smaller tracks, it's not the car.

Lol, ok.

[TRZ06]

Sorry, I haven't been on here lately.

I just got an allocation on a GT4 for a Sept. build and a Nov. / Dec. delivery. I don't have my code handy, but the highlights are... GT Silver, PDK, PCCB's, standard seats (didn't want the carbon buckets as it will be a daily for me and getting out of them is a PITA), extended leather w/ silver contrast stitching, leather steering wheel & gear lever, carbon fiber trim interior, guard red instrument dials, sport chrono package, Bose , Apple CarPlay. I am missing a few things, but those are the main highlights.

Whether you are interested in a GT4 or C8 Z06, the big issue right now is getting one.

The 4.0 ,motor on the 718's had a recall for 2021, so with that and the current chip shortage, allocations have been scarce for a GT4.

I have been waiting for 4 mths now for an allocation and finally got one just yesterday.

The C8 Z06 has my interest as well, however it will be hard to get one for quite a while and the ADM's on them I think will be insane for at least a year, maybe longer depending on the supply chain and chip shortage situation.

This is not the best time to be looking for a sports car.

[semif18]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

For the price and performance I prefer the SS1LE. For less than the price of the GT4 you could get a ZL1 that easily would beat the Cayman GT4.


Nothing compares to the great V8 sound

I wouldn't sleep on the GT4. I sold mine and got a ZLE. Yes, the ZLE is faster but the GT4 turns like nothing else (my point is the ZL1 doesn't "easily" beat a GT4).

Price/performance there is no comparison. Porsches are fantastic cars but very expensive.

[semif18]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

There's is a huge price difference from the GT4 compared to the lower priced SS1LE, not on the same price league, instead you should compare the GT4 to the performance of the ZL1 1LE, that makes more sense.

I went from a 981 GT4 to a ZLE. Both fantastic cars. I'm not a pro driver so take that into account, I've taken a high performance driving course but that's it so I think I'm kinda in the average/decent class. ZLE is faster in a straight line. My experience is mainly ripping around mountain roads. GT4 turns like a scalpel, feels and sounds like a race car. ZLE is definitely more brute force, but I think more fun. ZLE is a surprisingly nice car compared to the Porsche with nicer toys like PDR. 981 GT4 is very purpose built and bare bones but has a gorgeous interior. If you start bringing price into the conversation there is no comparison, ZLE is superior.

[semif18]

Originally Posted by TRZ06

Sorry, I haven't been on here lately.

I just got an allocation on a GT4 for a Sept. build and a Nov. / Dec. delivery. I don't have my code handy, but the highlights are... GT Silver, PDK, PCCB's, standard seats (didn't want the carbon buckets as it will be a daily for me and getting out of them is a PITA), extended leather w/ silver contrast stitching, leather steering wheel & gear lever, carbon fiber trim interior, guard red instrument dials, sport chrono package, Bose , Apple CarPlay. I am missing a few things, but those are the main highlights.

Whether you are interested in a GT4 or C8 Z06, the big issue right now is getting one.

The 4.0 ,motor on the 718's had a recall for 2021, so with that and the current chip shortage, allocations have been scarce for a GT4.

I have been waiting for 4 mths now for an allocation and finally got one just yesterday.

The C8 Z06 has my interest as well, however it will be hard to get one for quite a while and the ADM's on them I think will be insane for at least a year, maybe longer depending on the supply chain and chip shortage situation.

This is not the best time to be looking for a sports car.

You'll love the GT4! I had a 981 and my understanding is the 718s are better in just about every way. The gearing is tall, which apparently has not changed in the 718, but it didn't bother me as much as some folks. I didn't think it was that big of a deal. Look into RSNV wing risers. While I think the stock wing on the GT4 is awesome in my opinion it's too low, the RSNV risers put it at the perfect height and really make the car look awesome! But obviously that's over to your personal opinion.

[evanescent03]

Get your car yet? What do you think?

I just ordered one today with a June delivery. Doing buckets and manual trans .. i want it to feel like an occasion and also feel great on the track. PDK is better for the track for sure but i always tend to get bored with PDK/DCT on the street (eg: boxster 718S, M6 gran coupe, M3) .. the manual is like a fidget spinner for me, i've concluded. I tried to order PCCB but they're not available anymore for whatever reason. steels will work just fine.

i've driven my 718S boxster at a couple track days but looking forward to driving the GT4 in anger .. hoping to get it before my VIR trip this summer.

i'm sure taking cost into the equation, the SS1LE will remain my all time favorite smiles/performance per dollar car for track days, but after having a couple i just wanted something different.

cheers.

Originally Posted by TRZ06

Sorry, I haven't been on here lately.

I just got an allocation on a GT4 for a Sept. build and a Nov. / Dec. delivery. I don't have my code handy, but the highlights are... GT Silver, PDK, PCCB's, standard seats (didn't want the carbon buckets as it will be a daily for me and getting out of them is a PITA), extended leather w/ silver contrast stitching, leather steering wheel & gear lever, carbon fiber trim interior, guard red instrument dials, sport chrono package, Bose , Apple CarPlay. I am missing a few things, but those are the main highlights.

Whether you are interested in a GT4 or C8 Z06, the big issue right now is getting one.

The 4.0 ,motor on the 718's had a recall for 2021, so with that and the current chip shortage, allocations have been scarce for a GT4.

I have been waiting for 4 mths now for an allocation and finally got one just yesterday.

The C8 Z06 has my interest as well, however it will be hard to get one for quite a while and the ADM's on them I think will be insane for at least a year, maybe longer depending on the supply chain and chip shortage situation.

This is not the best time to be looking for a sports car.