[DaveC113]

IMO, you're crazy if you get a C8 Vette w/o Z51, MRC and LT2 for the HUD and PDR.

Unless you're buying it just for looks and will never drive it near it's limits... which is fine, that's why the base comes with all season tires. But for enthusiasts the base Vette is lacking features compared to an SS 1LE.

[Aragorn]

I used to buy bare bones everything but not anymore. Don’t want regrets later and trying to add aftermarket features for a ton of money.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

IMO, you're crazy if you get a C8 Vette w/o Z51, MRC and LT2 for the HUD and PDR.

Unless you're buying it just for looks and will never drive it near it's limits... which is fine, that's why the base comes with all season tires. But for enthusiasts the base Vette is lacking features compared to an SS 1LE.

Please, a base Vette can exceed the safe driving limits of any road in the US at a reasonable speed. to pretend otherwise is just that. I've already said that the primary difference is the tire and of course one should have two sets.

"enthusiast" will afford the base vs a full optioned Camaro. There is no "enthusiast" need for heated leather and a 1200 watt, 50 speaker sound system or LOL HUD..... really?

[6sigma]

Originally Posted by oldman

Please, a base Vette can exceed the safe driving limits of any road in the US at a reasonable speed. to pretend otherwise is just that. I've already said that the primary difference is the tire and of course one should have two sets.

"enthusiast" will afford the base vs a full optioned Camaro. There is no "enthusiast" need for heated leather and a 1200 watt, 50 speaker sound system or LOL HUD..... really?

I mostly agree with this. The C8 playbook even calls the base model the 'purist' and lightest version. For somebody that wants a C8 for fun on the street the base model is beyond enough. If I intended to track the car I'd get the Z51, and if not I'd probably get a base car. I'm curious what Z51 costs - would not be surprised if it's $8-10k. That's a lot for stuff that mostly isn't needed on the street. There's a lot we still don't know yet, including actual test drives so I will withhold decision. I am intrigued by the base no option car at $60k - seems like that might truly be the bargain of the century.

I wonder if Chevy is taking a page from Porsche's playbook with lots of options and customization, some performance some aesthetic. Porsche is masterful at creating ways to separate money from buyer's wallets. You'll never find a base, no option 911 Carrera at $90k even though that car is 98% of the performance of a $150k optioned car (staying in the same model).

[HouseStark]

Originally Posted by oldman

Please, a base Vette can exceed the safe driving limits of any road in the US at a reasonable speed. to pretend otherwise is just that. I've already said that the primary difference is the tire and of course one should have two sets.

"enthusiast" will afford the base vs a full optioned Camaro. There is no "enthusiast" need for heated leather and a 1200 watt, 50 speaker sound system or LOL HUD..... really?

I think you’re missing his point. You’re shelling out money to have a car designed for one purpose only which is all out performance. Why would you want a watered down version maximize your potential performance in your car which was only created for performance and lap times. I agree you’d be nuts not to get the Z51 package it’s so much more than HUD and tires which btw HUD is awesome to have on track.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by oldman

Please, a base Vette can exceed the safe driving limits of any road in the US at a reasonable speed. to pretend otherwise is just that. I've already said that the primary difference is the tire and of course one should have two sets.

"enthusiast" will afford the base vs a full optioned Camaro. There is no "enthusiast" need for heated leather and a 1200 watt, 50 speaker sound system or LOL HUD..... really?

HUD is nice on track actually. Same place the Z51, PDR, etc will be nice at. If one doesn't go to the track then I'd agree.

Also, there's a gearing difference contributing to that sub 3 second 0-60 also with the Z51 package so it's not just tires.

[6sigma]

Originally Posted by HouseStark

I think you’re missing his point. You’re shelling out money to have a car designed for one purpose only which is all out performance. Why would you want a watered down version maximize your potential performance in your car which was only created for performance and lap times. I agree you’d be nuts not to get the Z51 package it’s so much more than HUD and tires which btw HUD is awesome to have on track.

What if you don't track and want a fun street car? What if Z51 is $7k+? I just don't think it is required for a street car. Same thing could be said for 1LE package - why are SS models sold without 1LE? Why isn't every Camaro a ZL1 1LE? It's a performance car, why not get the best performance features.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by 6sigma

What if you don't track and want a fun street car? What if Z51 is $7k+? I just don't think it is required for a street car. Same thing could be said for 1LE package - why are SS models sold without 1LE? Why isn't every Camaro a ZL1 1LE? It's a performance car, why not get the best performance features.

Z51 will likely cost around $5k. MRC isn't even included on the Z51 package.

Personally I would never buy an SS without the 1LE package though. I've driven both and walked away from a 16 SS, but ended up buying an SS 1LE a few years later. It was a much better driving car IMO, even on the street.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by HouseStark

I think you’re missing his point. You’re shelling out money to have a car designed for one purpose only which is all out performance. Why would you want a watered down version maximize your potential performance

First outside of the already addressed tires the "watered down version is more than one can ever use on the street. Also neither initial version is going to be the "all out performace'.

Second we are talking about Camaros going to Vettes obviously if you have enough dollars and don't care about the cost then absolutely I understand the "need" for HUD

Originally Posted by HouseStark

in your car which was only created for performance and lap times. I agree you’d be nuts not to get the Z51 package it’s so much more than HUD and tires which btw HUD is awesome to have on track.

I have no idea what you are getting at. Obviously, this thread is above Camaro price range buyers going to a C8 and if so will this kill the Camaro, if you are in that price range you are not in the price range to afford a "car which was only creatted for lap time" and as close corally hou don't "need" HUD etc etither.

[DaveC113]

For whatever reason HUD and PDR are part of the LT2 package, not Z51. So you have to get both Z51 and LT2, then add magride to the Z51 package. Not sure what that costs, but probably makes the car over $70k.

oldman, you need to reread my post, lol. BTW, totally disagree about HUD, once you've had it, it would be hard to go back. Same with magride. The issue is, my SS 1LE has magride, e-LSD and HUD and the base Vette doesn't. There's no way I'd buy the Vette without those features after owning a car with them. They are features for driving enthusiasts, and not just luxury fluff.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Also, there's a gearing difference contributing to that sub 3 second 0-60 also with the Z51 package so it's not just tires.

I think until we see the gear ratio, it is a complete assumption that Z51 "gearing" will result in a better 0-60 of any significance. Read the thread I never said "just" times, I have said that tires have to be a big and maybe even significant contribution. Plus the base car is lighter...

[oldman]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

oldman, you need to reread my post, lol. BTW, totally disagree about HUD, once you've had it, it would be hard to go back.

Since I could not afford it I guess there is no going forward either. HUD is meaningless for Camaro drivers trying to afford a C8, it maywell be the cat's meow for the affluent C8 owners... Amen. not the topic of the thread.

Originally Posted by DaveC113

Same with magride. The issue is, my SS 1LE has magride, e-LSD and HUD and the base Vette doesn't. There's no way I'd buy the Vette without those features after owning a car with them. They are features for driving enthusiasts, and not just luxury fluff.

Then you are not the topic of the tread, if you can afford a $70 to $80 Vette then you are not in the should I have a frills pack Camaro vs a base C8.

To my mind and the topic of the thread, is the C8, due to the sub $60 cost, its looks, it performance at THAT price point.... will it kill the Camaro, Clearly many full optioned Camaro buyers will be looking at a C8 for not that much more and in some cases cheaper. To argue that these buyers NEED rather silly options like HUD, belies the whole topic and price point of Camaro vs C8. The vast majority of the drivers sitting in-between a Camaro and a C8 are NOT in the I need a Z51 and magnaride price range or "need".


I did read your thread, and you are more of a "man" than me, because of your abilities and driving prowess absolutely demands a Z51 Vette, great I bow down to you happy.... you still are not at the price point of the thread. Maybe in my next life I'll be at the price point too....

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by oldman

Since I could not afford it I guess there is no going forward either.

My guess is (from reading your signature) that you can afford a HUD if you wanted one. If you just want to go fast in a straight line then sure, you want a base car. If you value going around corners fast, all that stuff is nice... more than nice, you're not going to buy a car without them, especially if you've experienced what they do.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

My guess is (from reading your signature) that you can afford a HUD if you wanted one. If you just want to go fast in a straight line then sure, you want a base car. If you value going around corners fast, all that stuff is nice... more than nice, you're not going to buy a car without them, especially if you've experienced what they do.

I would agree with the words "need" and "afford" have different meanings to people, I can afford a C8, I clearly can't "afford" a HUD or Z51. I'm also very sure the base vette is pretty fast in the twisty too given a decent set of summer tires.

Now one semester at Oxford (where my kid is at) could easily option a C8 out... but that is a whole different set of "afford".

Now if I had a race track membership, I think I would be more inclined to "afford" a Z51 and more. But once again it is not the topic of the thread. It is if the BASE Vette will cut into and maybe even destroy the Camaro, I think the full optioned Camaro or super performace optioned camaro and any future Z/28 is clearly in trouble.

I acutally don't have too much opinion whether a Z51 with HUD, magnaride, bells and whistles is "needed" and probably would not bother to reply to such a thread, cause I acknoldge it is out of my "affordable" scale.