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Old 05-25-2018, 01:41 PM   #1093
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Originally Posted by BlaqWhole View Post
Because the A10 in the ZL1 1LE would not have made it perform any better on the track. And it would have bumped up the cost of the car although I suspect some (myself included) would have gladly paid for it along with a sunroof. Plus none of the competition right now can even match the standard ZL1 which says a lot.

Ford nerfed the GT and GT350 and they did it so they could milk every penny they can from these suckers. Pay X amount for the GT350. But then you have to add this or that package in if you want certain options. Other options are not available. Other options can't be combined with this or that option package. Then lets up the GT but we'll throw more HP in the same engine and call it the "Bullitt" and charge even more money for it. But let's withhold the A10 trans from that. But the standard GT gets the A10. And now the PP2 gets the manual trans. All these bits and pieces yet they're all coming out to the same mid $50K once you add in all the options that other cars have as standard and that is even if you can combine this and that option package.
I've never hear of the "this or that" package. Can you please be more specific?

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Old 05-25-2018, 01:43 PM   #1094
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Originally Posted by hotlap View Post
As it unfolded, they took three years to close the gap but didn’t pull ahead.
It took 2 years. The 6th gen camaro was released as a 2016.

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Old 05-25-2018, 02:19 PM   #1095
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Originally Posted by BlaqWhole View Post
Because the A10 in the ZL1 1LE would not have made it perform any better on the track. And it would have bumped up the cost of the car although I suspect some (myself included) would have gladly paid for it along with a sunroof. Plus none of the competition right now can even match the standard ZL1 which says a lot.

Ford nerfed the GT and GT350 and they did it so they could milk every penny they can from these suckers. Pay X amount for the GT350. But then you have to add this or that package in if you want certain options. Other options are not available. Other options can't be combined with this or that option package. Then lets up the GT but we'll throw more HP in the same engine and call it the "Bullitt" and charge even more money for it. But let's withhold the A10 trans from that. But the standard GT gets the A10. And now the PP2 gets the manual trans. All these bits and pieces yet they're all coming out to the same mid $50K once you add in all the options that other cars have as standard and that is even if you can combine this and that option package.
So why no A10 in the SS 1LE? Your complaining that the PP2 doesn't get the A10 but neither does the 1LE.

To be fair, getting as much money as they can is kind of the idea of making cars for profit. Automakers make more on higher optioned cars than they do on base models.

Other options not being able to be combined I agree with you there. There is no reason why certain options shouldn't be allowed to be selected. Ford is the worst at that. If I want a PP Car why can't I get the black painted roof?

Again the Bullitt is a special edition tribute car. you can't get an auto, because the movie car didn't have one. And again the Bullitt gets upgraded power so it's not just paint/decorative package like the Hot Wheels Camaro. Probably helps the buyers feel better about their purchase.
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Lets keep it simple. ..
it has more power...its available power is like a set kof double Ds (no matter where your face is... theyre everywhere) it has the suspension to mame it matter...(
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Old 05-25-2018, 05:24 PM   #1096
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Originally Posted by Zeke.Malvo View Post
I've never hear of the "this or that" package. Can you please be more specific?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaffe View Post
So why no A10 in the SS 1LE? Your complaining that the PP2 doesn't get the A10 but neither does the 1LE.

To be fair, getting as much money as they can is kind of the idea of making cars for profit. Automakers make more on higher optioned cars than they do on base models.

Other options not being able to be combined I agree with you there. There is no reason why certain options shouldn't be allowed to be selected. Ford is the worst at that. If I want a PP Car why can't I get the black painted roof?

Again the Bullitt is a special edition tribute car. you can't get an auto, because the movie car didn't have one. And again the Bullitt gets upgraded power so it's not just paint/decorative package like the Hot Wheels Camaro. Probably helps the buyers feel better about their purchase.
Because I was talking about the Camaro. I was talking about Ford and how they choose to skimp out on performance. They separate packages and combinations and make people pay extra for them instead of bundling it all together to make one killer package. See, I'm not criticizing GM because GM has been killing Ford in performance for the past recent years. It took drastic changes for Ford to get this far and it is still late in the game for them to just now be catching up. I get it, it works good for them. But if your defense is "well why didn't Chevy put the A10 in the SS 1LE" then the fact that the SS 1LE matched the GT350R and can beat the non-R might be a good reason why.
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Old 05-25-2018, 05:41 PM   #1097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaffe View Post
So why no A10 in the SS 1LE? Your complaining that the PP2 doesn't get the A10 but neither does the 1LE.

To be fair, getting as much money as they can is kind of the idea of making cars for profit. Automakers make more on higher optioned cars than they do on base models.

Other options not being able to be combined I agree with you there. There is no reason why certain options shouldn't be allowed to be selected. Ford is the worst at that. If I want a PP Car why can't I get the black painted roof?

Again the Bullitt is a special edition tribute car. you can't get an auto, because the movie car didn't have one. And again the Bullitt gets upgraded power so it's not just paint/decorative package like the Hot Wheels Camaro. Probably helps the buyers feel better about their purchase.
The two bolded passages are very much related. The history of the 1LE RPO code is that it NEVER had an automatic. Just as the Bullitt cars, both movie and commercially available, didn’t have automatics. The 1LE comes from a special, barely on the books order option that allowed dealers to option street cars same as race cars and allowed Chevrolet to homologate specially prepared Camaros for a specific race series.

So the reason LT, SS, & ZL1 1LE don’t have the 10AT is very similar to why Bullitt doesn’t get the 10AT.
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Old 05-25-2018, 06:28 PM   #1098
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Originally Posted by Martinjlm View Post
The two bolded passages are very much related. The history of the 1LE RPO code is that it NEVER had an automatic. Just as the Bullitt cars, both movie and commercially available, didn’t have automatics. The 1LE comes from a special, barely on the books order option that allowed dealers to option street cars same as race cars and allowed Chevrolet to homologate specially prepared Camaros for a specific race series.

So the reason LT, SS, & ZL1 1LE don’t have the 10AT is very similar to why Bullitt doesn’t get the 10AT.
I understand your point, but one correction: The original 1LE Camaro could be ordered with the 5.7 / 4 speed auto combo.
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Old 05-25-2018, 06:39 PM   #1099
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As per the Camaro White Book, early 1LE's could be had with automatic transmissions. I'm not sure if the book is accurate or not, but just thought I'd throw that out there.

"Ordering the RPO G92 performance axle with an IROC-Z coupe triggered 1LE. Here's how it worked: When G92 was ordered, it forced several other options including engine oil cooler, 4-wheel disc brakes, dual converter exhaust and P245/ 50ZR16 tires. A 1989 Camaro with G92 had to have either the 350ci (RPO B2L) engine with automatic transmission, or the 305ci (RPO LB9) with 5-speed manual. These Camaros had 145 mph speedometers and 5500 rpm redline tachs. If RPO G92 was ordered with air conditioning, the cars were built as street vehicles. If air conditioning was not ordered, Chevrolet added 1LE equipment for the race series."

Then again, I may not be reading this right. It's not all that clear. I assumed all 1LE's were manual, but the passage above made me question that assumption.
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Old 05-25-2018, 06:42 PM   #1100
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Originally Posted by vtirocz View Post
I understand your point, but one correction: The original 1LE Camaro could be ordered with the 5.7 / 4 speed auto combo.
I had assumed all 3rd-gen 1LE's (1989 - 1992) were available with either automatic or manual transmissions.
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Old 05-25-2018, 06:58 PM   #1101
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Originally Posted by vtirocz View Post
I understand your point, but one correction: The original 1LE Camaro could be ordered with the 5.7 / 4 speed auto combo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRMike View Post
As per the Camaro White Book, early 1LE's could be had with automatic transmissions. I'm not sure if the book is accurate or not, but just thought I'd throw that out there.

"Ordering the RPO G92 performance axle with an IROC-Z coupe triggered 1LE. Here's how it worked: When G92 was ordered, it forced several other options including engine oil cooler, 4-wheel disc brakes, dual converter exhaust and P245/ 50ZR16 tires. A 1989 Camaro with G92 had to have either the 350ci (RPO B2L) engine with automatic transmission, or the 305ci (RPO LB9) with 5-speed manual. These Camaros had 145 mph speedometers and 5500 rpm redline tachs. If RPO G92 was ordered with air conditioning, the cars were built as street vehicles. If air conditioning was not ordered, Chevrolet added 1LE equipment for the race series."

Then again, I may not be reading this right. It's not all that clear. I assumed all 1LE's were manual, but the passage above made me question that assumption.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRMike View Post
I had assumed all 3rd-gen 1LE's (1989 - 1992) were available with either automatic or manual transmissions.
Well, ok then. I stand corrected.
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Old 05-25-2018, 07:08 PM   #1102
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Well, ok then. I stand corrected.
As you can see from my previous post, it was a little tricky to get a 1LE in the 3rd-gen. It wasn't like you just checked the box for 1LE while ordering.
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Old 05-25-2018, 09:58 PM   #1103
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Interesting!
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Old 05-26-2018, 03:17 PM   #1104
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Does anyone know if the A10 the Camaro is getting is the exact same transmission offered in the 2018 GT? I'm just curious if it's the same or if there are slight differences and whether or not the final drive ratio is going to remain 2.77 or not for the A10...which I'm hoping it doesn't. I think Chevy should also just make 4.10's standard for the M6, but it's still stuck at 3.73.

According to this link, the final drive ratio for the 10spd is TBD as of now:
http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/...2019.tab1.html
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Old 05-26-2018, 03:54 PM   #1105
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Does anyone know if the A10 the Camaro is getting is the exact same transmission offered in the 2018 GT? I'm just curious if it's the same or if there are slight differences and whether or not the final drive ratio is going to remain 2.77 or not for the A10...which I'm hoping it doesn't. I think Chevy should also just make 4.10's standard for the M6, but it's still stuck at 3.73.

According to this link, the final drive ratio for the 10spd is TBD as of now:
http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/...2019.tab1.html
The Camaro already had the A10 first...it was in the 17 Camaro ZL1. The SS is now getting it for 2019 MY. More than likely they will change certain things to make it optimal for the LT1 engine. So I doubt it will be the same.
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Old 05-26-2018, 04:35 PM   #1106
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Originally Posted by BlaqWhole View Post
Use your imagination.


Because I was talking about the Camaro. I was talking about Ford and how they choose to skimp out on performance. They separate packages and combinations and make people pay extra for them instead of bundling it all together to make one killer package. See, I'm not criticizing GM because GM has been killing Ford in performance for the past recent years. It took drastic changes for Ford to get this far and it is still late in the game for them to just now be catching up. I get it, it works good for them. But if your defense is "well why didn't Chevy put the A10 in the SS 1LE" then the fact that the SS 1LE matched the GT350R and can beat the non-R might be a good reason why.
the 1LE is 3 seconds slower around VIR, While the 350R was only 1.7 sec slower than the ZL1. the 1LE's Big Willow time is suspect AF... it suddenly beats or matches cars that raped its ass at VIR(350R, Z28)? and the same 1LE that gets destroyed by the ZL1 to the tune of 4.7 seconds at VIR is .39 slower at Big Willow? yeah, no, sorry.

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